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August Optimism Gauge


maqroll

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What type of signings did you expect?

We can't expect to be back in the top six this season. This is only the first season of the rebuilding process. Have some patience.

You see this is the sort of comment that really pisses me off.

Why can we not expect to be in the top six this season? With the right investment we should be challenging for the top six most seasons. We are Aston Villa and not Norwich who will always have lower expectations than ourselves. With the right sales and purchases there is no reason why we cannot be on a par with Everton or Newcastle who have purchased the right players. We seem to be permanently in a rebuilding process and will be no more than what we are at the moment until the attitudes of fans and board alike change. There has been too much of a deafest attitude around Villa Park for far too long and its a cancer thats stopping the club from moving forward!

How long are we going to be in a rebuilding process? O'Neill's five year plan? Then GB trying to rebuild the club and now we are in a rebuilding process again.

There is quality out there to be purchased which will move us forward, Carroll, Sturridge, Johnston to name but three whose quality would push us into the top six. Yes its going to take money, a lot of it but we have been told wages were the issue and not transfer funds so have we not made room for that type of quality already with departures?

We should also now consider selling Gabby who's form has been poor and this would help fund the above purchases along with Downing revenue.

All we need is ambition. Ambition to put this club back where it belongs. Unfortunately, i have seen very little of that and with the present mind set we'll still be making the old excuse that we are in a rebuilding process five years from now.

Don't worry, the feeling's mutual. The attitude that we should be in or around the top 6 purely because we're Aston Villa pisses me off as well. It would require massive funds. We're talking £50m+ here. Of course I expect us to be challenging for the top 6 in future seasons but right now the squad is rather lacking in quality and although Lambert is a good manager and making some good signings, we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree.

I really don't see how you can say we lack "ambition" when we've shown just that in appointing Lambert and letting him revamp the squad.

After the recent financial troubles it would be very irresponsible to chuck money we don't have at getting into the top 6.

You are correct in stating that no team should have a divine right to be in the top six but we should at least be challenging for top 6-8 consistently given reasonable investment and good management from within the club.

I certainly don't subscribe to the view that it would take fifty plus million to do it. 30-35m tops providing the right players were purchased, with that amount then off set with one or two players sold. Everton have sold one or two of their better players for the greater good of their team and if it meant us selling Gabby and N'Zogbia then so be it.

Whether we can afford to do so no-one really knows other than the manager and the chairman so it is a bit presumptuous to state 'we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree!'

Also have there been 'financial troubles' or has the chairman just reigned in wages? The two are wholly different!

You also seem to think that employing a manager who's best achievement so far is getting a team promoted from the Championship is a measure of our ambition. Warnock and Mick McCarthy did that so if one of those managers had been employed as our new manager would you still deem that as a measure of our ambition?

Lambert has done nothing yet that another decent manager wouldn't have done in the first few months at our club and while i am hopeful that he can turn us around, i will wait and see what standard of player he can attract to the club and what results he can achieve before stating that he was an ambitious appointment by Lerner.

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Well it's an educated guess, that would be a realistic target to aim for over the next 3 years

Consolidate a position as a top 6-8 side

& have a good go at the trophies

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What type of signings did you expect?

We can't expect to be back in the top six this season. This is only the first season of the rebuilding process. Have some patience.

You see this is the sort of comment that really pisses me off.

Why can we not expect to be in the top six this season? With the right investment we should be challenging for the top six most seasons. We are Aston Villa and not Norwich who will always have lower expectations than ourselves. With the right sales and purchases there is no reason why we cannot be on a par with Everton or Newcastle who have purchased the right players. We seem to be permanently in a rebuilding process and will be no more than what we are at the moment until the attitudes of fans and board alike change. There has been too much of a deafest attitude around Villa Park for far too long and its a cancer thats stopping the club from moving forward!

How long are we going to be in a rebuilding process? O'Neill's five year plan? Then GB trying to rebuild the club and now we are in a rebuilding process again.

There is quality out there to be purchased which will move us forward, Carroll, Sturridge, Johnston to name but three whose quality would push us into the top six. Yes its going to take money, a lot of it but we have been told wages were the issue and not transfer funds so have we not made room for that type of quality already with departures?

We should also now consider selling Gabby who's form has been poor and this would help fund the above purchases along with Downing revenue.

All we need is ambition. Ambition to put this club back where it belongs. Unfortunately, i have seen very little of that and with the present mind set we'll still be making the old excuse that we are in a rebuilding process five years from now.

Don't worry, the feeling's mutual. The attitude that we should be in or around the top 6 purely because we're Aston Villa pisses me off as well. It would require massive funds. We're talking £50m+ here. Of course I expect us to be challenging for the top 6 in future seasons but right now the squad is rather lacking in quality and although Lambert is a good manager and making some good signings, we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree.

I really don't see how you can say we lack "ambition" when we've shown just that in appointing Lambert and letting him revamp the squad.

After the recent financial troubles it would be very irresponsible to chuck money we don't have at getting into the top 6.

You are correct in stating that no team should have a divine right to be in the top six but we should at least be challenging for top 6-8 consistently given reasonable investment and good management from within the club.

I certainly don't subscribe to the view that it would take fifty plus million to do it. 30-35m tops providing the right players were purchased, with that amount then off set with one or two players sold. Everton have sold one or two of their better players for the greater good of their team and if it meant us selling Gabby and N'Zogbia then so be it.

Whether we can afford to do so no-one really knows other than the manager and the chairman so it is a bit presumptuous to state 'we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree!'

Also have there been 'financial troubles' or has the chairman just reigned in wages? The two are wholly different!

You also seem to think that employing a manager who's best achievement so far is getting a team promoted from the Championship is a measure of our ambition. Warnock and Mick McCarthy did that so if one of those managers had been employed as our new manager would you still deem that as a measure of our ambition?

Lambert has done nothing yet that another decent manager wouldn't have done in the first few months at our club and while i am hopeful that he can turn us around, i will wait and see what standard of player he can attract to the club and what results he can achieve before stating that he was an ambitious appointment by Lerner.

Is going on a massive spending spree the right approach though? Didn't seem to work to well with Liverpool. It only works if the owner has absolute bucket-loads (e.g. City and Chelsea). Lerner wants us to be sustainable (fair enough) and I don't think throwing around massive sums of money and spending big on wages is the best way to do it.

What we've done is got a young and upcoming manager. I think it's clear that that was what the board were looking for based on that and the OGS interest. Who do you realistically think we could have got that's better? We're not in a position to be able to attract world class managers who have already won everything, so it's a case of either taking on a steady, proven Premier League manager or go for a young and upcoming manager who can hopefully build a dynasty with us. I much prefer the latter. You keep on mentioning that Lambert hasn't achieved much but he is after all very young for a manager. Even then, back to back promotions with a small club like Norwich and then easily keeping them in the Premier League is no small feat. McLeish for example had a fairly good CV on paper (that's probably why the board went for him) and look how that turned out...

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I think reading this thread offers solid proof that the biggest issue we'll have this year is managing expectations

you don't think top 10 is realistic? that's all most people in the thread have been hoping for

the standard in the league is cack beyond the top 6 or 7 clubs

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I'm very optimistic and I'm more excited about going today than I was at any point over the last 2 years.

With Lerner getting his money and rumours earlier that lambert would have significant backing I'm still expecting another 3 players, with one maybe being a bit of a name.

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I think we can get to tenth place but it all depends on how fit Gabby and Db are and how well our defence copes with teams in the top 6.

If the team stays injury free and has a bit of confidence who knows what they can achieve.

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What type of signings did you expect?

We can't expect to be back in the top six this season. This is only the first season of the rebuilding process. Have some patience.

You see this is the sort of comment that really pisses me off.

Why can we not expect to be in the top six this season? With the right investment we should be challenging for the top six most seasons. We are Aston Villa and not Norwich who will always have lower expectations than ourselves. With the right sales and purchases there is no reason why we cannot be on a par with Everton or Newcastle who have purchased the right players. We seem to be permanently in a rebuilding process and will be no more than what we are at the moment until the attitudes of fans and board alike change. There has been too much of a deafest attitude around Villa Park for far too long and its a cancer thats stopping the club from moving forward!

How long are we going to be in a rebuilding process? O'Neill's five year plan? Then GB trying to rebuild the club and now we are in a rebuilding process again.

There is quality out there to be purchased which will move us forward, Carroll, Sturridge, Johnston to name but three whose quality would push us into the top six. Yes its going to take money, a lot of it but we have been told wages were the issue and not transfer funds so have we not made room for that type of quality already with departures?

We should also now consider selling Gabby who's form has been poor and this would help fund the above purchases along with Downing revenue.

All we need is ambition. Ambition to put this club back where it belongs. Unfortunately, i have seen very little of that and with the present mind set we'll still be making the old excuse that we are in a rebuilding process five years from now.

Don't worry, the feeling's mutual. The attitude that we should be in or around the top 6 purely because we're Aston Villa pisses me off as well. It would require massive funds. We're talking £50m+ here. Of course I expect us to be challenging for the top 6 in future seasons but right now the squad is rather lacking in quality and although Lambert is a good manager and making some good signings, we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree.

I really don't see how you can say we lack "ambition" when we've shown just that in appointing Lambert and letting him revamp the squad.

After the recent financial troubles it would be very irresponsible to chuck money we don't have at getting into the top 6.

You are correct in stating that no team should have a divine right to be in the top six but we should at least be challenging for top 6-8 consistently given reasonable investment and good management from within the club.

I certainly don't subscribe to the view that it would take fifty plus million to do it. 30-35m tops providing the right players were purchased, with that amount then off set with one or two players sold. Everton have sold one or two of their better players for the greater good of their team and if it meant us selling Gabby and N'Zogbia then so be it.

Whether we can afford to do so no-one really knows other than the manager and the chairman so it is a bit presumptuous to state 'we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree!'

Also have there been 'financial troubles' or has the chairman just reigned in wages? The two are wholly different!

You also seem to think that employing a manager who's best achievement so far is getting a team promoted from the Championship is a measure of our ambition. Warnock and Mick McCarthy did that so if one of those managers had been employed as our new manager would you still deem that as a measure of our ambition?

Lambert has done nothing yet that another decent manager wouldn't have done in the first few months at our club and while i am hopeful that he can turn us around, i will wait and see what standard of player he can attract to the club and what results he can achieve before stating that he was an ambitious appointment by Lerner.

Is going on a massive spending spree the right approach though? Didn't seem to work to well with Liverpool. It only works if the owner has absolute bucket-loads (e.g. City and Chelsea). Lerner wants us to be sustainable (fair enough) and I don't think throwing around massive sums of money and spending big on wages is the best way to do it.

What we've done is got a young and upcoming manager. I think it's clear that that was what the board were looking for based on that and the OGS interest. Who do you realistically think we could have got that's better? We're not in a position to be able to attract world class managers who have already won everything, so it's a case of either taking on a steady, proven Premier League manager or go for a young and upcoming manager who can hopefully build a dynasty with us. I much prefer the latter. You keep on mentioning that Lambert hasn't achieved much but he is after all very young for a manager. Even then, back to back promotions with a small club like Norwich and then easily keeping them in the Premier League is no small feat. McLeish for example had a fairly good CV on paper (that's probably why the board went for him) and look how that turned out...

Where have i advocated massive expenditure in my posts? I have mentioned a figure of 30-35m which could be off set with the sales of Gabby and N'Zogbia.

I see you have mentioned Liverpool which is a biased choice to suit your debate. Dalglish spend unwisely overpaying for several signings and paid for it with his job. What about Newcastle? They sold their best assets and used that revenue to totally revamp their team and thats exactly my point. It would not need massive expenditure to get us back challenging for the 6-8. What about Everton who have consistently punched above their weight and indeed breached the top four with sensible investment by reinvesting revenue from player sales.

Benitez would have come to us if sensible investment had been made available and we already attracted GH who i believe would have transformed the club given the right condition of his health.

Finally you mention Mcleish stating that he had a fairly good CV. Really? Two relegations and you think thats good. :lol:

I rest my case your honour! 8)

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What type of signings did you expect?

We can't expect to be back in the top six this season. This is only the first season of the rebuilding process. Have some patience.

You see this is the sort of comment that really pisses me off.

Why can we not expect to be in the top six this season? With the right investment we should be challenging for the top six most seasons. We are Aston Villa and not Norwich who will always have lower expectations than ourselves. With the right sales and purchases there is no reason why we cannot be on a par with Everton or Newcastle who have purchased the right players. We seem to be permanently in a rebuilding process and will be no more than what we are at the moment until the attitudes of fans and board alike change. There has been too much of a deafest attitude around Villa Park for far too long and its a cancer thats stopping the club from moving forward!

How long are we going to be in a rebuilding process? O'Neill's five year plan? Then GB trying to rebuild the club and now we are in a rebuilding process again.

There is quality out there to be purchased which will move us forward, Carroll, Sturridge, Johnston to name but three whose quality would push us into the top six. Yes its going to take money, a lot of it but we have been told wages were the issue and not transfer funds so have we not made room for that type of quality already with departures?

We should also now consider selling Gabby who's form has been poor and this would help fund the above purchases along with Downing revenue.

All we need is ambition. Ambition to put this club back where it belongs. Unfortunately, i have seen very little of that and with the present mind set we'll still be making the old excuse that we are in a rebuilding process five years from now.

Don't worry, the feeling's mutual. The attitude that we should be in or around the top 6 purely because we're Aston Villa pisses me off as well. It would require massive funds. We're talking £50m+ here. Of course I expect us to be challenging for the top 6 in future seasons but right now the squad is rather lacking in quality and although Lambert is a good manager and making some good signings, we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree.

I really don't see how you can say we lack "ambition" when we've shown just that in appointing Lambert and letting him revamp the squad.

After the recent financial troubles it would be very irresponsible to chuck money we don't have at getting into the top 6.

You are correct in stating that no team should have a divine right to be in the top six but we should at least be challenging for top 6-8 consistently given reasonable investment and good management from within the club.

I certainly don't subscribe to the view that it would take fifty plus million to do it. 30-35m tops providing the right players were purchased, with that amount then off set with one or two players sold. Everton have sold one or two of their better players for the greater good of their team and if it meant us selling Gabby and N'Zogbia then so be it.

Whether we can afford to do so no-one really knows other than the manager and the chairman so it is a bit presumptuous to state 'we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree!'

Also have there been 'financial troubles' or has the chairman just reigned in wages? The two are wholly different!

You also seem to think that employing a manager who's best achievement so far is getting a team promoted from the Championship is a measure of our ambition. Warnock and Mick McCarthy did that so if one of those managers had been employed as our new manager would you still deem that as a measure of our ambition?

Lambert has done nothing yet that another decent manager wouldn't have done in the first few months at our club and while i am hopeful that he can turn us around, i will wait and see what standard of player he can attract to the club and what results he can achieve before stating that he was an ambitious appointment by Lerner.

Is going on a massive spending spree the right approach though? Didn't seem to work to well with Liverpool. It only works if the owner has absolute bucket-loads (e.g. City and Chelsea). Lerner wants us to be sustainable (fair enough) and I don't think throwing around massive sums of money and spending big on wages is the best way to do it.

What we've done is got a young and upcoming manager. I think it's clear that that was what the board were looking for based on that and the OGS interest. Who do you realistically think we could have got that's better? We're not in a position to be able to attract world class managers who have already won everything, so it's a case of either taking on a steady, proven Premier League manager or go for a young and upcoming manager who can hopefully build a dynasty with us. I much prefer the latter. You keep on mentioning that Lambert hasn't achieved much but he is after all very young for a manager. Even then, back to back promotions with a small club like Norwich and then easily keeping them in the Premier League is no small feat. McLeish for example had a fairly good CV on paper (that's probably why the board went for him) and look how that turned out...

Where have i advocated massive expenditure in my posts? I have mentioned a figure of 30-35m which could be off set with the sales of Gabby and N'Zogbia.

I see you have mentioned Liverpool which is a biased choice to suit your debate. Dalglish spend unwisely overpaying for several signings and paid for it with his job. What about Newcastle? They sold their best assets and used that revenue to totally revamp their team and thats exactly my point. It would not need massive expenditure to get us back challenging for the 6-8. What about Everton who have consistently punched above their weight and indeed breached the top four with sensible investment by reinvesting revenue from player sales.

Benitez would have come to us if sensible investment had been made available and we already attracted GH who i believe would have transformed the club given the right condition of his health.

Finally you mention Mcleish stating that he had a fairly good CV. Really? Two relegations and you think thats good. :lol:

I rest my case your honour! 8)

Unlike Newcastle we don't have a player we can sell for £35m. Yes, Everton are a good example, and look at Moyes. His only job was at Preston North End before he joined Everton. Just goes to show that just becuase a manager isn't "a name" he can still go on and do a very good job.

How do you know we could've got Benitez? Yes I agree on Houllier but that's all in the past now.

You were moaning about Lambert's biggest achievement being promotion with Norwich and I was pointing out that it's not all about trophies and achievements. McLeish won a ton in Scotland and a League Cup with SHA. He's won a lot, certainly more than Lambert, but that doesn't mean Lambert's not a thousand times better.

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My expectations:

- Turn up to all games and at least attempt to win.

- 110% effort from all players at all times during games.

- Enjoy watching football again.

Anything else is a bonus

I'd agree with that.
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- Turn up to all games and at least attempt to win.

- 110% effort from all players at all times during games.

i reckon with PL we're guaranteed these 2 (unless the wheels dramatically fall off the wagon and he loses it, very unlikely). plus i reckon we'll see a more modern style of football and finally some movement ;)

add some good movement to the 100% effort for 90 mins every week and being set up to win games from the start and i'd be ecstatic.

i think after that the results will look after themselves.

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What type of signings did you expect?

We can't expect to be back in the top six this season. This is only the first season of the rebuilding process. Have some patience.

You see this is the sort of comment that really pisses me off.

Why can we not expect to be in the top six this season? With the right investment we should be challenging for the top six most seasons. We are Aston Villa and not Norwich who will always have lower expectations than ourselves. With the right sales and purchases there is no reason why we cannot be on a par with Everton or Newcastle who have purchased the right players. We seem to be permanently in a rebuilding process and will be no more than what we are at the moment until the attitudes of fans and board alike change. There has been too much of a deafest attitude around Villa Park for far too long and its a cancer thats stopping the club from moving forward!

How long are we going to be in a rebuilding process? O'Neill's five year plan? Then GB trying to rebuild the club and now we are in a rebuilding process again.

There is quality out there to be purchased which will move us forward, Carroll, Sturridge, Johnston to name but three whose quality would push us into the top six. Yes its going to take money, a lot of it but we have been told wages were the issue and not transfer funds so have we not made room for that type of quality already with departures?

We should also now consider selling Gabby who's form has been poor and this would help fund the above purchases along with Downing revenue.

All we need is ambition. Ambition to put this club back where it belongs. Unfortunately, i have seen very little of that and with the present mind set we'll still be making the old excuse that we are in a rebuilding process five years from now.

Don't worry, the feeling's mutual. The attitude that we should be in or around the top 6 purely because we're Aston Villa pisses me off as well. It would require massive funds. We're talking £50m+ here. Of course I expect us to be challenging for the top 6 in future seasons but right now the squad is rather lacking in quality and although Lambert is a good manager and making some good signings, we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree.

I really don't see how you can say we lack "ambition" when we've shown just that in appointing Lambert and letting him revamp the squad.

After the recent financial troubles it would be very irresponsible to chuck money we don't have at getting into the top 6.

You are correct in stating that no team should have a divine right to be in the top six but we should at least be challenging for top 6-8 consistently given reasonable investment and good management from within the club.

I certainly don't subscribe to the view that it would take fifty plus million to do it. 30-35m tops providing the right players were purchased, with that amount then off set with one or two players sold. Everton have sold one or two of their better players for the greater good of their team and if it meant us selling Gabby and N'Zogbia then so be it.

Whether we can afford to do so no-one really knows other than the manager and the chairman so it is a bit presumptuous to state 'we just can't afford to go on a huge spending spree!'

Also have there been 'financial troubles' or has the chairman just reigned in wages? The two are wholly different!

You also seem to think that employing a manager who's best achievement so far is getting a team promoted from the Championship is a measure of our ambition. Warnock and Mick McCarthy did that so if one of those managers had been employed as our new manager would you still deem that as a measure of our ambition?

Lambert has done nothing yet that another decent manager wouldn't have done in the first few months at our club and while i am hopeful that he can turn us around, i will wait and see what standard of player he can attract to the club and what results he can achieve before stating that he was an ambitious appointment by Lerner.

Is going on a massive spending spree the right approach though? Didn't seem to work to well with Liverpool. It only works if the owner has absolute bucket-loads (e.g. City and Chelsea). Lerner wants us to be sustainable (fair enough) and I don't think throwing around massive sums of money and spending big on wages is the best way to do it.

What we've done is got a young and upcoming manager. I think it's clear that that was what the board were looking for based on that and the OGS interest. Who do you realistically think we could have got that's better? We're not in a position to be able to attract world class managers who have already won everything, so it's a case of either taking on a steady, proven Premier League manager or go for a young and upcoming manager who can hopefully build a dynasty with us. I much prefer the latter. You keep on mentioning that Lambert hasn't achieved much but he is after all very young for a manager. Even then, back to back promotions with a small club like Norwich and then easily keeping them in the Premier League is no small feat. McLeish for example had a fairly good CV on paper (that's probably why the board went for him) and look how that turned out...

Where have i advocated massive expenditure in my posts? I have mentioned a figure of 30-35m which could be off set with the sales of Gabby and N'Zogbia.

I see you have mentioned Liverpool which is a biased choice to suit your debate. Dalglish spend unwisely overpaying for several signings and paid for it with his job. What about Newcastle? They sold their best assets and used that revenue to totally revamp their team and thats exactly my point. It would not need massive expenditure to get us back challenging for the 6-8. What about Everton who have consistently punched above their weight and indeed breached the top four with sensible investment by reinvesting revenue from player sales.

Benitez would have come to us if sensible investment had been made available and we already attracted GH who i believe would have transformed the club given the right condition of his health.

Finally you mention Mcleish stating that he had a fairly good CV. Really? Two relegations and you think thats good. :lol:

I rest my case your honour! 8)

Unlike Newcastle we don't have a player we can sell for £35m. Yes, Everton are a good example, and look at Moyes. His only job was at Preston North End before he joined Everton. Just goes to show that just becuase a manager isn't "a name" he can still go on and do a very good job.

How do you know we could've got Benitez? Yes I agree on Houllier but that's all in the past now.

You were moaning about Lambert's biggest achievement being promotion with Norwich and I was pointing out that it's not all about trophies and achievements. McLeish won a ton in Scotland and a League Cup with SHA. He's won a lot, certainly more than Lambert, but that doesn't mean Lambert's not a thousand times better.

And we no longer have a manager in the Premiership who would be prepared to pay 35m for Carroll! However, we do still have assets at the club that would offset an expenditure which i have quoted.

Yes you are correct about Moyes at Everton and i would be very happy to see the same sort of success at our club but was it not you who said signing Lambert was a sign of our ambition? Lambert has a lot to prove before he would be seen in the same light as Moyes and therefore it is more than a bit premature to suggest that we have another Moyes on our hands. However if we had signed Moyes then that would indeed have shown our ambition because Moyes has proven over several seasons what a good manager he is.

Your correct about Benitez in that i can't prove that he would have come to us in spite of all the rumoured links with our club but GH did come to our club which disproves your statement that we couldn't attract a big name manager to our club!

Concerning your opinion on Mcleish's CV. Well i guess my granny could have been a success managing Rangers at the time of Mcleish's tenure but then she wouldn't have ever finished third in a two horse race would she 'Mantis?' :lol:

Give it up man and move on to another debate as you've lost this one. :winkold:

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Surprising how actually watching us can zap optimism.

Lowton, Ahamidi and Holman looked very average today.

I really do think we need a new winger and possibly a striker.

Bannan looked awesome today though so that helps the optimism a bit I guess.

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Surprising how actually watching us can zap optimism.

Lowton, Ahamidi and Holman looked very average today.

I really do think we need a new winger and possibly a striker.

Bannan looked awesome today though so that helps the optimism a bit I guess.

Unfortunately, that's the Villa BJ10!
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