GarethRDR Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 some Scottish bloke that won a European medal for a German club in the ancient times? That is **** stupid. And I'm sorry if I sound harsh, but that is ignorance in the extreme. You throw that Dortmund team of 96/97 into today's Prem, I tell you they'd make a damn good fist of it. They were **** world-beaters, Lambert was a huge factor in that and it's abundantly clear from the success he's has had in the relatively short time he's been a manager (taking Wycombe to a cup semi-final and making a damn good fist of it against Chelsea, stabilizing Colchester, back-to-back promotions with Norwich) that he picked up one or two things from ol' Hitzfeld back in the day. And I hate Dortmund! Urgh, I hope Trog never reads this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanthemanisgod Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 SnC, Lets not be naive, I'm fairly sure had it been Utd that approached him in the summer he'd have accpeted the job thanking Wigam for al they'd done to progress his career. I'd certainly not be against the appointment of Deschamps, although I do think his impact here would be limited to what it was in the French league, but I just cannot see it happening given the current position of the club. I'm very worried that rather than a bizarre move by Randy as some are painting it AMc was actually the best person prepared to take the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craigy1874 Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Wainy316 Post subject: Posted: Nov 03, 2011 - 08:49 AM Star Player Joined: Oct 15, 2005 Posts: 6698 Location: Seoul, South Korea Status: Offline Supported VT this year PieFacE wrote: AshVilla wrote: The right manager for Aston Villa will be at the game the weekend and i would pull out all the stops to get him. Agreed! I assume you mean Lambert? Sharp this guy, aint he :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeinMadrid Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 The most annoying thing is that we paid £3m in compo for him and have given him a contract worth £9m. This is **** ridiculous. What exactly has he proved? He plays crap football, got his last club relegated due to said shit style of football, but luckily won the League Cup because Arsenal handed it to them on a plate. I'm 99% sure we paid just under 2.5m in compo and he is on a 3 yr/6m contract. I also form part of the "he seems like a decent guy and I want him to succeed, but our football is shit under him" camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Stan, Every Premiership club starts the season with the same amount of points. Aston Villa's position in the Summer, is an established Premiership club with very good pedigree. Every club in Europe has to live within its means, Aston Villa is no different. The prestige and pull is that Villa are a sleeping giant within one of the best league's in the world. MacClaren was well pee'd off when he didnt get an interview, Hughes left Fulham to join us, Flores was quoted as saying he was ready to join, Houllier never even wanted to leave....Dont kid yourself that McLeish was the only choice we had, because it wasnt.. Lerner chose McLeish because he thought he was the best man for the job, he had recently won a League Cup and Got Blues into Europa, to an American who knows very little about football, he seen this as a great skill..He seen how annoyed us fans were when we threw away the FA Cip tie with City, McLeish was Cup winner to Lerner and would pull out all the stops to bring him to Villa Park..Yes he knew he was ex-Blues and would get a bashing by some fans...But he seen a Domestic winner in his eyes and wanted to bring this man to do similar with Villa.. We also had the General saying that they had advice from Fergie at how decent he is as a manager. Lerner was fooled and naive...He is out of depth running a football club in the Premiership, his last 2 (and only 2) managerial appointments have proven this...Along with the crappy criteria they constantly strive for in "Premiership experienced only". When the only managers coming close to Fergie and Manchester United are nearly almost all non Premiership trained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 The right manager for Aston Villa will be at the game the weekend and i would pull out all the stops to get him. Agreed! I assume you mean Lambert? Would rather we re-employ Graham Turner than have MO'N MK2 anywhere near the club. Ha Ha Ha Ha. If McLeish isn’t the poor mans MON I don’t know what he is. and in Faulkner it seems we have a poor man Steve Stride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 I'm sorry, I have to disagree with the first points. a) Better players with no money ? AND reducing the wage bill ? retain a player who supports Liverpool, and had refused to sign a new contract all of last season, and then made it clear he wanted to sign for liverpool, I don't think so. You would be surprised the kind of player a good manager can find, and you will be amazed which clubs good players will play with if the right manager is there. And you will be amazed that not everyone has to play for £50K a week I am pretty sure that Downing supports Boro. He grew up there and went through the academy; he only left the club because they got relegated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Villa_Fan Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 I wish we had MON MK2, but I don't think we'd be that fortunate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morley_crosses_to_Withe Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 You would be surprised the kind of player a good manager can find, and you will be amazed which clubs good players will play with if the right manager is there. And you will be amazed that not everyone has to play for £50K a week Spot on. AM has basically wasted £14M on a load of shite. Granted that it's not a huge amount of money, but surely it could have been better spent. Did we really need Hutton when we have Herd and Cuellar!? Was N'Zogbia REALLY all we could get for the best part of 10M quid!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBGB Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 With hindsight N'zogbia is shite. The majority here were screaming for him over the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Was N'Zogbia REALLY all we could get for the best part of 10M quid!? Who would you suggest? im sure at time many people thought it was better deal than Downing though is he any worse than Downing as both have same stats for this season only Downing played more minutes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Was N'Zogbia REALLY all we could get for the best part of 10M quid!? Who would you suggest? im sure at time many people thought it was better deal than Downing though is he any worse than Downing as both have same stats for this season only Downing played more minutes In that case you may as well just ask your average Joe to manage the club.(oops we did) The point of of hiring a good manager with vast knowledge of the game, is that he has just that..Vast knowledge. And a manager with vast knowledge may have replaced Young and Downing for half the price of N'Zogbia..But we hired a manager that only has the vision of a small pond rather than the ocean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 With hindsight N'zogbia is shite. The majority here were screaming for him over the summer. The thing is though, alot of posters here had the same reaction to, for example, Milner when he arrived. Saying he was shit because he didnt hit the ground running. 12 months down the line hes a **** hero. You just couldnt make this shit up. Fickle aint the word. Hes a good player and i wish to **** that our fans would actually get behind the players/coaching staff at the club instead of running them down all the time. Nothing personal against you btw mate, im talking about alot of Villa fans here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanthemanisgod Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 SnC, Yes all clubs start with the same points but they do not all start on the same terms. Reputation counts for a lot in football and well ours isn't what it used to be. We are not sleeping giants in any sense of the word. We can barely scrape 30,000 fans, the last trophy we wont was 15 years ago, and our most recent European success was nearly 30 years ago. Jesus even when there was excitement around the club we could barely sell out Villa Park. We have a relatively low income compared to our rivals in the top half of the league, and we have an owner who is reluctant to get his cheque book out. We have a proud history yes but to call us sleeping giants is falling wide of the mark. On top of that regardless of what our club may or may not be the PL is what it is and by that I mean even with Deschamps at the healm, Utd, City, Chelsea, Arsenal and Spurs arent going to go away. Even if he was successful there's no guarantee he could ever regularly surpass 4 out those 5 and therefore would he be willing to risk his reputation on the ability to get us ina position to challenge for the CL but ultimately end up scratching around the Europa places. Or do you really think that the best players would choose Deschamps at Villa over Sir Alex at Utd, Mancini and £200k a week at City, AVB at Chelsea, Wenger at Arsenal, even 'Arry and the draw of London at Spurs. I'll accept that some players on the fringe of that level might do, but the best will still go to the biggest, most successful and best paid clubs, and Villa will not be in that category regardless of manger while money still runs the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Stan, There are only so many best players these clubs can sign. Squad depth is less than 30 players. So lets take away the top 15 clubs in Europe, you are still left with a huge amount of players to chose from. Its just the wider your vision stretches the better player you will know about. When Saunders built his team, the English league teams usually bought UK players.The best players still went/or were at United, Liverpool etc but because Saunders has vision and knew what he wanted he could scour the lower divisions and build a winning side because he spotted something in these players..We had very few players playing at International level yet won the European Cup. Thats comes down to great vision and team building. Not buying the best players! Today, a great European winning side could still be built...Just that not from one country (like you used to)..It takes knowledge of all the leagues to achieve such..You need to put all the European teams into one large pot to then get your Ron Saunders type to chose his team. Its alot harder because the scope/pot is far wider/bigger.. So the race is on to chose a manager with the biggest knowledge of this pot.... OR, to just have loads of money and wait for these players to just materialise on the big stage(ie Chelsea/City) then buy them...We cant compete with the teams that buy these top players...But we can compete with teams looking to get a manager that would have the bigger knowledge of whats in the pot to build a winning side.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 The thing is though, alot of posters here had the same reaction to, for example, Milner when he arrived. I think people were pretty happy when he first came or the second time even. Maybe people winced at the £12 million, but like Young and Downing he proved to be worth every penny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFC-Prideofbrum Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Stan, There are only so many best players these clubs can sign. Squad depth is less than 30 players. So lets take away the top 15 clubs in Europe, you are still left with a huge amount of players to chose from. Its just the wider your vision stretches the better player you will know about. When Saunders built his team, the English league teams usually bought UK players.The best players still went/or were at United, Liverpool etc but because Saunders has vision and knew what he wanted he could scour the lower divisions and build a winning side because he spotted something in these players..We had very few players playing at International level yet won the European Cup. Thats comes down to great vision and team building. Not buying the best players! Today, a great European winning side could still be built...Just that not from one country (like you used to)..It takes knowledge of all the leagues to achieve such..You need to put all the European teams into one large pot to then get your Ron Saunders type to chose his team. Its alot harder because the scope/pot is far wider/bigger.. So the race is on to chose a manager with the biggest knowledge of this pot.... OR, to just have loads of money and wait for these players to just materialise on the big stage(ie Chelsea/City) then buy them...We cant compete with the teams that buy these top players...But we can compete with teams looking to get a manager that would have the bigger knowledge of whats in the pot to build a winning side.. Yet no manager has ever done this, yet you make out they are out there? I don't know of a manager who has consistently won in Europe with little money. Real Madrid, Chelsea, United, Barca's etc....they all spend big. You're telling us that something that has never done before and making it sound very easy. It really is a Football Manager dream, where it's a lot easier to get a scout report and judge someone's ability and potential! Villa will never be a european winning side without huge money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Villa will never be a european winning side without huge money. Maybe not, but with sensible appointments and sensible financial plans, I am sure we would be doing better, and we might even win some trophies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Villa will never be a european winning side without huge money. Maybe not, but with sensible appointments and sensible financial plans, I am sure we would be doing better, and we might even win some trophies... Villa could rule Europe with the right man at the helm. Im not saying you can do it without money....But it can be done without spending the mass amounts which some fans seem to think you need. Its all about assembling the right squad and set of tactics..The tactics will come from the brains within the manager and "his" coaching staff...The right squad selection again comes from the brains of the manager and "his" scouting staff...The FACTS we all know about are that the variety of players to chose from on the world stage is MASSIVE in comparison to how many "top clubs" there are on the circuit. Only a fool would think it cant be done.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFC-Prideofbrum Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 Villa will never be a european winning side without huge money. Maybe not, but with sensible appointments and sensible financial plans, I am sure we would be doing better, and we might even win some trophies... Not disputing we could do better, should be doing better and should have appointed a different manager. May win 1 or 2 trophies at best over a certain number of years, nothing more. I was debating the absolutely crazy idea we could dominate Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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