Scientific Experiment V2 #9 - MON(thly) Approval Ratings

[Risso]

Don't believe it for a second. If you have a credible link to backup what you have to say then I shall more than happily admit that I am wrong.

Always happy to make somebody look stupid:

Spurs accounts

Click 'financial statements', then 'notes to the consolidated accounts', then click next until you get to note 5. Write down Spurs total wages of £60.5m.

The Villa accounts show that our wage bill is £70.5m. I can email you a copy if you like, but they've been debated quite a bit on here, and here's a website which states the figure as well.

Cup of tea to wash that humble pie down?

[stewiek2]

On the note of who's won things, what has MON won in England that Harry hasn't?

MON won trophies at Leicester, a club he took over in the Championship, and then became one of Celtics most successful ever managers when he took the job when Rangers had won 12 of the previous 13 titles.

Harry, despite managing in English football longer than MON, only has 1 trophy to show for it. As I said before, he needed to financially cripple a club to do that.

Redknapp is a decent manager, no doubt, but he's always spent more money than his club could afford and isn't as good as MON.

Unfortunately football has moved on since his days at Leicester when really Man United were dominating everything and everyone else was much of a muchness, and well in Scotland the only team to worry about is Rangers. MON's record in terms of trophies is admirable, but unfortunately, like Cloughie in the 1990s, I think MON has reached his peak and is in decline as a manager.

What has changed since last season really? He still plays players out of position. The football for the most part is shit, his substitutions bizarre, his tactical nuance is questionable at the very least. And he bottles the big decisions as well as, it seems, constantly sending teams out to nick a goal and defend it for their lives rather than try to WIN games!?! Hell at 1-1 Saturday we were trying to protect it... against WOLVES!?!

I and a few others said that this season was crucial for him, as he needed to show he was up with the modern game. I so little evidence of this. He had TWO right backs on the bench against Wolves yet moved his out of form left midfielder there!? Unbelieveably shocking management.

This isn't just about this season, it is about the last two seasons of decline. I don't ask for us to win things, just to play good football and show some desire and nuance to win games. With this squad we should expect better than he is delivering. Maybe he needs to change his coaching staff and philosophy. But he will not. And that is to the detriment of Aston Villa football club and quite frankly, if he is still in charge next season I see NO change at all and we will once again, be toying with better but eventually accept a top 8-6 place whilst playing the dullest, one-dimensional, predictible football out of any of the 'top teams.' Time for a change I think.

[briggaman]

Don't believe it for a second. If you have a credible link to backup what you have to say then I shall more than happily admit that I am wrong.

Always happy to make somebody look stupid:

Spurs accounts

Click 'financial statements', then 'notes to the consolidated accounts', then click next until you get to note 5. Write down Spurs total wages of £60.5m.

The Villa accounts show that our wage bill is £70.5m. I can email you a copy if you like, but they've been debated quite a bit on here, and here's a website which states the figure as well.

Cup of tea to wash that humble pie down?

The Villa website you linked to says:

In this case we’re not exclusively talking about players, we’re talking employees. We’re talking about everyone at the club: The players, the coaches, football management, commercial, marketing, operations, maintenance, administration, projects, even the match day stewards. Everyone.

I very much doubt that the Spurs wage bill (for players alone) is lower than ours.

[leviramsey]

Start of the season if you offered me an FA Cup Semi and a League Cup final and to be still in the hunt for 4th place with as many games are left to go, I'd have been delighted. It's been a good season no matter what else happens. Anything else is a bonus. It's an improvement on last season without doubt.

So it's a yes from me

this.

[bose]

One thing's for certain - he's very frustrating.

His number one fault is his stubbornness. I think if he believes he's right about something, it's virtually impossible to get him to believe otherwise. That's why when all of Cuellar, Dunne and Collins are fit, Luke Young will not start. The only way he will get a game is if one of the CB's is injured and Cuellar has to move there.

His insistance to always use the same eleven doesn't work in modern day football. That's probably why we always seem to fall apart around March/April. When he says he'll have to rotate (like he said in some interview recently), he means players will get injured so other players will get a chance. He has a clear view of his best eleven and he will use those eleven players until they literally can't play anymore.

Despite all that I still trust him. The best way way will be to see how the seasons sums up in May. So far it's been pretty good until recently.

Now that I've said that watch us win Chelsea on Saturday. It really wouldn't surprise me.

[kurtsimonw]

Don't believe it for a second. If you have a credible link to backup what you have to say then I shall more than happily admit that I am wrong.

Always happy to make somebody look stupid:

How very nicely put.

Had it been a poster I had more time for, I would probably have let it go and agreed with you. But given who you are and both links you've provided quite clearly stating the figure is for all staff, none-playing staff and club staff included, I'm going to have to disagree until you can give me a credible link for playing staff only. I really couldn't care less if we pay our tea lady more than Spurs to make it look like they're paying less.

Unlucky Risso. Maybe next time though eh?

[Risso]

The Villa website you linked to says:

In this case we’re not exclusively talking about players, we’re talking employees. We’re talking about everyone at the club: The players, the coaches, football management, commercial, marketing, operations, maintenance, administration, projects, even the match day stewards. Everyone.

I very much doubt that the Spurs wage bill (for players alone) is lower than ours.

That's exactly the same for both clubs.

Football wages (as opposed to admin) will be the vast majority of the wage bill in both cases. Admin wages are an absolute pittance in comparison.

[kurtsimonw]

That's exactly the same for both clubs.

Football wages (as opposed to admin) will be the vast majority of the wage bill in both cases. Admin wages are an absolute pittance in comparison.

There's no doubt you're correct there, but staff wages also includes the manager and coaching staff. We have MON, they have Redknapp, so you can certainly see why it looks like we pay more, because you no doubt pay more money for the better manager.

[Risso]

Don't believe it for a second. If you have a credible link to backup what you have to say then I shall more than happily admit that I am wrong.

Always happy to make somebody look stupid:

How very nicely put.

Had it been a poster I had more time for, I would probably have let it go and agreed with you. But given who you are and both links you've provided quite clearly stating the figure is for all staff, none-playing staff and club staff included, I'm going to have to disagree until you can give me a credible link for playing staff only. I really couldn't care less if we pay our tea lady more than Spurs to make it look like they're paying less.

Unlucky Risso. Maybe next time though eh?

You're just making yourself look more and more stupid with every post.

Both wages figures include all staff. Seeing as we don't pay the directors at Villa a single penny, who's earning the million pounds that would be needed to make our admin staff paid so much more than their Spurs counterparts? Especially given that admin staff in London would generally earn more than in Birmingham.

[Risso]

That's exactly the same for both clubs.

Football wages (as opposed to admin) will be the vast majority of the wage bill in both cases. Admin wages are an absolute pittance in comparison.

There's no doubt you're correct there, but staff wages also includes the manager and coaching staff. We have MON, they have Redknapp, so you can certainly see why it looks like we pay more, because you no doubt pay more money for the better manager.

Sorry, but I'd be better off trying to explain the finer points of accounting to my two tear old.

[kurtsimonw]

You're just making yourself look more and more stupid with every post.

Both wages figures include all staff.

And you're making yourself look even more stupid with every post.

I said, and I quote, "I really couldn't care less if we pay our tea lady more than Spurs to make it look like they're paying less." - Does this not suggest that I am aware that both figures include all staff, mentioning both tea ladies? Or do you think the Spurs tea lady is the name of a player? Or that she is a member of the playing staff?

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

The current arguement about who spends more than who sums up why football is a complete state atm.

Who gives a ****, and why do they give a **** about money that isnt theirs is what i want to know.

[Risso]

You're just making yourself look more and more stupid with every post.

Both wages figures include all staff.

And you're making yourself look even more stupid with every post.

I said, and I quote, "I really couldn't care less if we pay our tea lady more than Spurs to make it look like they're paying less." - Does this not suggest that I am aware that both figures include all staff, mentioning both tea ladies? Or do you think the Spurs tea lady is the name of a player? Or that she is a member of the playing staff?

At the end of the day, you said I was talking rubbish, but the cold hard fact is that our wage bill is £10m higher than Spurs, as I've proved. The admin staff from both clubs wouldn't make the tiniest spec of a difference to that. You're just not man enough to admit you were wrong. Sad.

[kurtsimonw]

And the current percentage of votes against MON is what is wrong with our club. Too many fans expect too much, too quickly. You can't just go from just missing out on relegation to top 4, while being outspent by your nearest rivals, it's just not realistic to expect.

[avfc89]

The current arguement about who spends more than who sums up why football is a complete state atm.

Who gives a ****, and why do they give a **** about money that isnt theirs is what i want to know.

Exactly, but football has evolved a lot and it's important to spend money to compete nowadays. It's a business now and should be treated as such.

[avfc89]

And the current percentage of votes against MON is what is wrong with our club. Too many fans expect too much, too quickly. You can't just go from just missing out on relegation to top 4, while being outspent by your nearest rivals, it's just not realistic to expect.

MON's done many great things for the club, but I don't believe he can take us forward. Randy's view is key, and I am pretty sure he will back him for a long time.

[leviramsey]

At the end of the day, you said I was talking rubbish, but the cold hard fact is that our wage bill is £10m higher than Spurs, as I've proved. The admin staff from both clubs wouldn't make the tiniest spec of a difference to that. You're just not man enough to admit you were wrong. Sad.

We are a club run on a more or less American model. Given the tendency of American management to pay itself more, it's not out of the question that Villa's administrative pay (especially given the posts that our executive corps held prior to the Villa) is 10m a year more than Spurs.

[Risso]

And the current percentage of votes against MON is what is wrong with our club. Too many fans expect too much, too quickly. You can't just go from just missing out on relegation to top 4, while being outspent by your nearest rivals, it's just not realistic to expect.

MON's done many great things for the club, but I don't believe he can take us forward. Randy's view is key, and I am pretty sure he will back him for a long time.

And I'm pretty sure he won't. He's invested over £200m into the club already, he's not going to settle for being also rans in 6th or 7th place for ever.

[leviramsey]

And I'm pretty sure he won't. He's invested over £200m into the club already, he's not going to settle for being also rans in 6th or 7th place for ever.

His family have sunk roughly a billion dollars into the Browns and not been outwardly bothered about performances...

[avfc89]

And the current percentage of votes against MON is what is wrong with our club. Too many fans expect too much, too quickly. You can't just go from just missing out on relegation to top 4, while being outspent by your nearest rivals, it's just not realistic to expect.

MON's done many great things for the club, but I don't believe he can take us forward. Randy's view is key, and I am pretty sure he will back him for a long time.

And I'm pretty sure he won't. He's invested over £200m into the club already, he's not going to settle for being also rans in 6th or 7th place for ever.

What I am saying he will get time, whether he moves us forward or not, he would have been given the time to do so.