Steven Gerrard

[sharkyvilla]

28 minutes ago, Pissflaps said:

Can he adjust to the injuries we now have. It was bad enough before them. Now his starting central spine of Kamara and Carlos is gone. 

Change of formation maybe?

Letting all the wingers go means we don't really have any changes of formation up our sleeve.  We are wedded to the system until January at the earliest, even if we did change the manager.

[tomsky_11]

2 hours ago, sharkyvilla said:

Letting all the wingers go means we don't really have any changes of formation up our sleeve.  We are wedded to the system until January at the earliest, even if we did change the manager.

Feels to me like Gerrard is already changing it, if not the 433/4312 on paper, but in pratical in game shape. Has felt to me like Gerrard has played Cash less aggressively in getting forward than last season, and Young is perhaps sitting back even more, while Bailey seems to be occupying a wider position that the fullback would have last season. Just watched the Southampton highlights as well and noted that Digne as well was barely foward in our attacks, and our front three of Coutinho Watkins Bailey were more often joined by McGinn and Ramsey on the inside channels, whereas last season the more likely scenario was the wide forwards coming inside and the full backs outside.

Given how prominent the use of full backs was to Gerrard, both at Ranger's and last season, suggests to me Gerrard is looking to change things.

I think between Bailey, Coutinho and Buendia we've enough options to occupy those wide areas, especially if we still have the option to utilise one or both of the full backs in the attack.

Edited September 22, 2022 by tomsky_11

[Tomaszk]

2 hours ago, tomsky_11 said:

Keep seeing points like this, and we shouldn't spend in Jan if he's still here and I don't get it. If we've opportunities to improve the squad and especially the first xi we should take them, irrespective of the manager in place. And I personally don't see a massive issue on the whole with the business we've done in the last few seasons.

Simply because a new manager we can actually progress with may not want them.

He certainly shouldn't be allowed to bring in any players over 29 for their retirement contracts. 

[Keyblade]

11 minutes ago, tomsky_11 said:

Lol at no point have I suggested everything is ok. Potentially two games from the sack if results go the wrong way is hardly saying everything is ok. The O'Neill comparison, and those to other managers who have faired far worse, is only to highlight that we've never let a manager go this early who's performing to the level Gerrard is, whatever your opinion on that level. It's being talked about on here like its a complete disaster and past the point of recovery. I don't think that's the case at this moment in time, even if I think it's below par.

We have, we've let Sherwood go earlier. But there's really no point comparing to previous incarnations of Villa. We're different now, and it's not even like those past decisions were necessarily correct or anything. Just because we didn't sack O'Neil (for example), doesn't necessarily mean we should hold off on Gerrard.

[DJBOB]

A petty dig more than anything but also dislike how he runs over to his media buddies for post-match interviews.

Should spend more time doing the coaching bit instead of the media bit.

[tomsky_11]

6 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

Simply because a new manager we can actually progress with may not want them.

He certainly shouldn't be allowed to bring in any players over 29 for their retirement contracts. 

But I don't believe that is how the club is set up to work is it? And I'm not sure too many of are signings are ones any other manager we might bring in would be unhappy to have.

Edited September 22, 2022 by tomsky_11

[tomsky_11]

1 minute ago, Keyblade said:

We have, we've let Sherwood go earlier. But there's really no point comparing to previous incarnations of Villa. We're different now, and it's not even like those past decisions were necessarily correct or anything. Just because we didn't sack O'Neil (for example), doesn't necessarily mean we should hold off on Gerrard.

Sherwood had 0.87ppg from 23 games in the league and was on a run of 1 point in 9 games when he was sacked, so not close to Gerrard, who even after being terrible for 9 months is still at 1.24ppg

[nick76]

1 minute ago, tomsky_11 said:

for 9 months is still at 1.24ppg

A disingenuous stat given 12 of those points came in the first six games, he’s not on a rolling 1.24ppg.  I know repeating the same argument but that stat doesn’t reflect us now, this season or in this calendar year.

[AV82]

Quote

You have to feel for Villa on some level.

• Coutinho playing awful.
• Douglas Luiz almost certainly going to run down his contract.
• El Ghazi sold.
• Won two games all season.
• Diego Carlos doing his ACL after only a few weeks (and is the club's 4th most expensive signing of all time).
• Digne injured.
• Bailey wants to leave.
• Lost one of the brightest young talents in Chukwuemeka to Chelsea.
• The whole captaincy controversy with McGinn and Mings.

And now Kamara (who they pay a whopping £150,000-a-week) out for two months, all while having to be managed by Steven Gerrard.

 

Couldn't have said it better myself. This post is from an Arsenal fan on reddit.

Edited September 22, 2022 by AV82

[nick76]

Just now, AV82 said:

Couldn't have said it better myself. This post is from an Arsenal fan on reddit.

He forgot

* Having SG as a manager

[imavillan]

Genuine question to all of the SG supporters.

Regardless of the results.

Have you been/do you get excited by/with the football we are playing under SG?

For me, I think I can count it on one hand.

[Zatman]

12 minutes ago, DJBOB said:

A petty dig more than anything but also dislike how he runs over to his media buddies for post-match interviews.

Should spend more time doing the coaching bit instead of the media bit.

He doesnt watch for criticism when we lose either. Thin skinned born winner

[AV82]

2 minutes ago, nick76 said:

He forgot

* Having SG as a manager

Check again mate he added that on the end

[Tomaszk]

14 minutes ago, tomsky_11 said:

But I don't believe that is how the club is set up to work is it?

Not a clue. We had a clear type of player before Grealish left, then it's been a free for all.

14 minutes ago, tomsky_11 said:

And I'm not sure too many of are signings are ones any other manager we might bring in would be unhappy to have.

Who knows! Some might not be happy with a one good game every 6 weeks Coutinho eating away £6m a year at the budget. Or Danny Ings earning similar when he can't move. Or Carlos sat with an injury for another six months.

[Sulberto21]

3 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

A change was the right thing to do.

It's the selection of Gerrard that has brought all the problems. He had nothing like the credentials to put £150m+ onto the club's books. 

It should be bizarre, but everyone knows why he was picked, everyone knows why he hasn't been sacked. The CEO continues to make a mess on the football side of the club.

I wish the CEO would stick to his job and stop meddling with the football side. At most he should be asking questions about performances relative to expenditure which we all know.

[Keyblade]

18 minutes ago, tomsky_11 said:

Sherwood had 0.87ppg from 23 games in the league and was on a run of 1 point in 9 games when he was sacked, so not close to Gerrard, who even after being terrible for 9 months is still at 1.24ppg

Right, but again, we were a different Aston Villa so PPG or whatever is irrelevant. You said we never sacked this early into a tenure, but we did. Roberto Di Matteo lasted what, 8 games? Different circumstances again, but it happens.

[tomsky_11]

58 minutes ago, nick76 said:

I know we’ve discussed it a few times now and I understand your points and facts, I disagree with most of your opinions on the back of those but I still don’t see how looking at the way we play, the results, everything on the pitch you can be happy? Happy enough to give SG more time.  Most of your arguments are on faith in some form about what other Villa managers have done or what you believe we’ve could’ve got from games or should do from games.  I know your reasons, it just baffles me.

2022 has been a poor year for Gerrard and we look no better now than the start of the calendar year despite the preseason everybody craved he should have and would make a difference.

Not just you but there's a lot of confusing me saying "I don't think we should sack him now, and I don't think the club will either" with "I'm happy and ok with our results" when I've explicitly stated I think they are well below par, both this season and for periods of last season.

I think for me it was obvious we were trying to take a different approach tactically this season, and that we were probably trying to rush something that required more time to perfect. It hasn't worked yet, that's been recognised by the management and the suggestion, both from the words of Gerrard and the evidence of the last couple of games is that we are taking a step back and prioritising being more compact and defensively solid, much like we did when he first arrived. Then you add to this the Beale/Critchley factor, which I think is pretty significant given their role.

Either way, there's no chance the club let him go off the back of the last two results, so this is all kind of moot. IF, having recognised the issues and changed the setup, we get results from the next two games, as we have the last two, then I think we are setting ourselves up to be back on track by the winter break and Gerrard is probably here til then at least. If we don't then I think he's gone.

 

[tomsky_11]

18 minutes ago, nick76 said:

A disingenuous stat given 12 of those points came in the first six games, he’s not on a rolling 1.24ppg.  I know repeating the same argument but that stat doesn’t reflect us now, this season or in this calendar year.

Like it or not he still earned those points. And Gerrard had as many points from his second 9 games (13 points, which he actually earned in a 7 game run, all in 2022) as his first 9. So I don't see the relevance, especially if you are trying to refute the point that was being made, which was Sherwood's 0.87ppg and 1 point in 9 games is not close to the same level as Gerrard. Sherwood had 80% of his total points before the halfway mark of his tenure. Even with the "new manager bounce" and the 13 points in 7 Jan-Mar 2022 run in the first half of his tenure, the same stat for Gerrard is split about 60/40.

 

[tomsky_11]

28 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

You said we never sacked this early into a tenure, but we did. Roberto Di Matteo lasted what, 8 games? Different circumstances again, but it happens.

No I didn't, because that's obviously untrue. I said:

Quote

we've never let a manager go this early who's performing to the level Gerrard is

 

[Keyblade]

7 minutes ago, tomsky_11 said:

No I didn't, because that's obviously untrue. I said:

 

My point is performance is relative though. You can't compare x PPG from the tail end of the Randy Lerner era to y PPG from season 5 of the NSWE era. 

But anyway, it doesn't even matter what we did or didn't do in the past. Has no bearing on what we should do now.