Russia and its “Special Operation” in Ukraine

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

Apparently Ukraine have found a secret tunnel under the Dnipro river.  It was exposed becasue Russia blew up the dam.  Nobody knew it existed.

Will find out more,  funny if true and I suppose there must be 1 tunnel somewhere.

[ender4]

Quote

Ukraine has attacked a bridge linking southern Ukraine to the Crimean peninsula with long-range British missiles, Russian officials say.

The two parallel Chonhar bridges were both damaged but no-one was hurt, said the Russian-installed governor in occupied Kherson Vladimir Saldo.

He said it was likely British Storm Shadow missiles were used in an attack "ordered by London".

The bridge is the shortest route from Crimea to the front line in the south.

It is also an important link to the occupied city of Melitopol, which lies on the coastal route from the Russian border across southern Ukraine to Crimea.

Photos posted by Vladimir Saldo showed a gaping hole in one of the two bridges, but he said repairs would be made quickly and vehicles would take an alternative route temporarily.

Russia uses the road as a land bridge to Crimea and Melitopol is thought to be one of the targets of Ukraine's counter-offensive, which began in the southern region of Zaporizhzhia earlier this month.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65982817

[bickster]

Was about to post that myself. Shades of Kherson again

[Buffs]

34 minutes ago, ender4 said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65982817

Surely a storm shadow would put a bigger hole in the bridge than that? 

[bickster]

2 minutes ago, Buffs said:

Surely a storm shadow would put a bigger hole in the bridge than that? 

Yeah, it isn't Stormshadow, there's three different holes and a close miss, they hit it with something more conventional I think and as you say Stormshadow would have made a much bigger mess

[Genie]

35 minutes ago, Buffs said:

Surely a storm shadow would put a bigger hole in the bridge than that? 

I’d expect a hand grenade to make a similar sized hole.

[LondonLax]

It’s reinforced concrete on the deck and the blast has nothing constraining it so most of the force will go upwards and be wasted. 

It’s not going to have as much spectacular damage as when it goes into a building and then blasts out again in all directions. 

Is there anything other than Storm Shadow that would have the range to reach that bridge?

[NurembergVillan]

If there's one thing I've learned about this conflict, it's that my dream job would be coming up with names for military weapons.

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

6 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said:

If there's one thing I've learned about this conflict, it's that my dream job would be coming up with names for military weapons.

"Pebble Dash 2000"

[magnkarl]

18 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said:

If there's one thing I've learned about this conflict, it's that my dream job would be coming up with names for military weapons.

Cloudwhopper.

[Anthony]

20 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said:

If there's one thing I've learned about this conflict, it's that my dream job would be coming up with names for military weapons.

Orcspanker

[LondonLax]

43 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

It’s reinforced concrete on the deck and the blast has nothing constraining it so most of the force will go upwards and be wasted. 

It’s not going to have as much spectacular damage as when it goes into a building and then blasts out again in all directions. 

Is there anything other than Storm Shadow that would have the range to reach that bridge?

From having a read about the storm shadow missile it seems possible that it, if it was one, it has gone right through the deck making the hole then exploded underneath. 

[sidcow]

14 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

From having a read about the storm shadow missile it seems possible that it, if it was one, it has gone right through the deck making the hole then exploded underneath. 

[LondonLax]

It sounds like it’s going to be a longer war than first hoped. 

Quote

In its early phases, Ukraine’s counteroffensive is having less success and Russian forces are showing more competence than western assessments expected, two western officials and a senior US military official tell CNN. 

The counteroffensive is “not meeting expectations on any front,” one of the officials said.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/06/22/politics/ukraine-counteroffensive-western-assessment/index.html

[Genie]

2 hours ago, LondonLax said:

It sounds like it’s going to be a longer war than first hoped. 

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/06/22/politics/ukraine-counteroffensive-western-assessment/index.html

As I alluded to a few days back. They are barely making a dent in the occupied territory map.

The internet is full of Russia’s **** ups but they seem to able to take and then hold the ground quite well.

Its another subject that the media are starting to drift away from. 

[magnkarl]

36 minutes ago, Genie said:

As I alluded to a few days back. They are barely making a dent in the occupied territory map.

The internet is full of Russia’s **** ups but they seem to able to take and then hold the ground quite well.

Its another subject that the media are starting to drift away from. 

Ukraine aren't really attacking yet either, so that's to be expected. They're shutting down logistical routes and probing in areas to figure out Russia's artillery positions.

Most of the offensive brigades aren't committed, and likely won't be for a while still. Meanwhile Ukraine are using SCALP and Storm Shadow to great effect taking out bridges and roads from Crimea.

The small dents they are making are essentially the same troops that held the line pushing a bit to figure out where weak spots are.

[Genie]

8 minutes ago, magnkarl said:

Ukraine aren't really attacking yet either, so that's to be expected. They're shutting down logistical routes and probing in areas to figure out Russia's artillery positions.

Most of the offensive brigades aren't committed, and likely won't be for a while still. Meanwhile Ukraine are using SCALP and Storm Shadow to great effect taking out bridges and roads from Crimea.

The small dents they are making are essentially the same troops that held the line pushing a bit to figure out where weak spots are.

Time will tell. I guess it’s one of the things that pisses me off, the completely 1 sided reporting we get of this war.

Even the story a day or 2 ago about Ukraine taking out a bridge with a British Storm shadow… I drive over  bigger potholes on the school run.

I do wonder what the long term prospects are for Ukraine here. If they don’t make any real inroads into the Russian occupied regions with billions of dollars worth of Western kit will they keep being backed? 

[chrisp65]

I think people have been fed a diet (and happily sucked it up) of abject Russian incompetence, and absolute western weapon superiority.

It’s easily done, there’s a war so we need a regular diet of not quite propaganda and it has to be good stuff to compete with stranded subs and the latest cup final and the graphics you can get from Call of Duty.

So we get told Russian tanks are essentially Lada’s but without an MOT, we get told western kit is basically alien technology. 

Then we get a lull, we get expense, we get a perceived lack of progress, and the diet of sugar starts to wear off.

People start to see their diesel cost more and their cornflakes cost more and someone mentions the war is costing us all £5.50 and lots of the support suddenly goes very quiet.

I mentioned some time back that the inconsistent drip drip of supplies didn’t really suit Ukraine, and it didn’t really suit the average EU or US punter. It only really benefits the military complex. 

[magnkarl]

27 minutes ago, Genie said:

Time will tell. I guess it’s one of the things that pisses me off, the completely 1 sided reporting we get of this war.

Even the story a day or 2 ago about Ukraine taking out a bridge with a British Storm shadow… I drive over  bigger potholes on the school run.

I do wonder what the long term prospects are for Ukraine here. If they don’t make any real inroads into the Russian occupied regions with billions of dollars worth of Western kit will they keep being backed? 

The potholes as you call them are actually quite large, it's led to queues of several 10s of kms on the only other road out of Crimea. It's done its job, it'll lead to, in combination with the theater wide ammunition depot at Rykove blowing up the other day, a real downtick in Russia's artillery usage. It's the same that happened in Kherson.

Ukraine's tactic was never the lightning advance in Kharkiv, it just so happened that they figured out that the back of Russia's units there was extremely brittle and soft. Ukraine's tactic is death by a thousand cuts, to take out as much supply from a larger enemy that they can, and it's already working as artillery usage is down by 1/2 in just 5 days since the depot blew up in Rykove. Give it another week and it'll be 1/4.

Don't let opsec and the perceived lull get to you, when Ukraine commits its well trained NATO equipped forces, together with the rest of the Leo2's, Challengers, AMX's and Leo 1's there will be movement, maybe not as fast as we'd like but it'll move the front line.

Edited June 23, 2023 by magnkarl

[bickster]

31 minutes ago, Genie said:

Even the story a day or 2 ago about Ukraine taking out a bridge with a British Storm shadow… I drive over  bigger potholes on the school run.

If that was storm shadow, the "pothole" is only the entry wound, that will be the hole the missile made in its first stage to breach the fortification (in a traditional target) the larger explosion comes after the breach, in this case under the bridge and will hopefully have weakened the bridge supports, a far bigger problem to solve