chappy Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 That Stoke equaliser. And Milner's departure a year later confirmed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 McLeish was always a poor appointment not because of his managerial ability but as stated above, because of his City connections. He was always fighting an uphill battle and was a massive mistake on Lerner's behalf because it smacked of someone who was really out of touch with the supporters of his own club. I had a slight amount of sympathy for McLeish because as I say, he was in a no win situation with our supporters from day one, however, he didn't really do himself any favours did he? The McLeish appointment was certainly the time when a lot of the supporters turned on Lerner though because it showed him up to be so far apart from the world of football. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 **** where it went wrong. It did that's all that matters. We will argue over the whys and wherefores but all that does is divide and lose focus. Pick any of the following if it makes you feel bette lerner coming mon walking houllier coming bent signing and then us selling his supply line mcleish coming siging given signing nzogbia lambert joinng not backing lambert sherwood coming spemding the bent eke money badly lerner not selling gettng shot of stride appointng faulkner appointing garde etctectec there's loads to chose from that I've not even listed what I am more interested in is how it is put right, what that even means . What does putting t right mean.? Perhaps this is it for us perhaps this is what we are and all we will be? Who knows. What I do know is that this great club should aspire to be better, should always aspire to be better. We have the catchment, the fans ,he stadium, the history and still have the revenue. We do jot have the culture we do not have the ethos we do not have the football nouse at the club. Do you know who I would approach to come and work for us in an advisory capacity, someone with the club at heart, who has the ethos we need who would be passionate about the club and would take no prisoners until it was sorted. Dennis Mortimer. I would offer him what he wanted and free reign to bring in who he needed to sort this **** shambles out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertoAVFC Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 11 minutes ago, H said: Exactly right. I don't think Lerner was thinking right, this is all the money I'm ever going to invest so have it all now. It was more likely a bit of a shock to his system to realise he was entrusting someone with vast amounts of his own money who wasted a great deal of it. I'm sure it left him with a sense of well I'm not doing that again in a hurry. Of course that's correct. But Lerner allowed it and is ultimately to blame for the lack of foresight. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post StanBalaban Posted January 10, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted January 10, 2016 I can't help but think we'd be in a much better place had Houllier managed to see out his plan for the club. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 6 minutes ago, gilbertoAVFC said: Of course that's correct. But Lerner allowed it and is ultimately to blame for the lack of foresight. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. I think we were all in a bit of a bubble when Lerner and MON first came to the club. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post El Zen Posted January 10, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted January 10, 2016 In hindsight, giving MON too much control over the club. Giving an old school manager near dictatorial powers at a time English football changed dramatically, started a downward spiral that will ultimately result in relegation come May. We were successful at the time, and I enjoyed it immensly, but it was entirely dependent on MON's persona and was economically unsustainable. The modernisation process Houllier started seemed foolish at the time but looking at us now it is a damn shame he wasn't allowed (be it by Lerner or his own health) to finish it. I was happy when he left but I realise now that his departure was actually a terrible thing for the future of Aston Villa. The appointment of McLeish effectively killed the notion of Villa as a top half, ambitious club. It goes down in our history as an incomprehensibly suicidal decision. I still can't make sense of it. Lambert had the right ideas but wasn't strong enough to handle the pressure. Sherwood had no ideas at all. Remi Garde is now asked to correct half a decade of fusterclucks. It will take time and it will get worse before it can get better. My hope is that Garde is now trying to reboot Houllier's project, and I hope he stays long enough to complete it. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilbertoAVFC Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 6 minutes ago, H said: Hindsight is a wonderful thing. I think we were all in a bit of a bubble when Lerner and MON first came to the club. You're right. But I don't have access to Lerner's finances. He does. When I get paid I can work out how much I have to spend that month etc. I'm sure if you're running a large football club and having run a multinational financing business you can manage to have some idea of your limits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, gilbertoAVFC said: You're right. But I don't have access to Lerner's finances. He does. When I get paid I can work out how much I have to spend that month etc. I'm sure if you're running a large football club and having run a multinational financing business you can manage to have some idea of your limits. I don't think it's about having limits though. I think he was perhaps naively swept along in excitement but at the same time I truly believe he believed in MON and was convinced all would be well. If we'd progressed as initially believed, I'm 100% convinced he would have continued to plough more and more money into the club. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 When the Arabs took over at Man City and completely changed the level of the playing field financially and two seasons in a row took our best player... Thats when Randy bottled it and decided he didn't want to play anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 57 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: neither do i because its his money and he never had unlimited funds. No... but after he flogged the Cleveland Browns he had a fair bit... Didn't see him putting that to good use helping us though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 10 minutes ago, DJ_Villain said: No... but after he flogged the Cleveland Browns he had a fair bit... Didn't see him putting that to good use helping us though For the above reasons?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, H said: For the above reasons?? I get what you are saying mate, but the fact of the matter is that Lerner knew sweet **** all about how to run a football club... Ellis brought in O'Neill... Since Lerner pulled the plug (even though we were doing as well as we had since the Brian Little days) we have circled the drain because of that white haired Yank prick... He had the money to put into it... He is just a tosser! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JumpingJack Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Lack of experience; responsibility, passion from the top down, it all lies in the hands of randy Lerner. All through his tenure here, he has used football managers as scapegoats to hide his poor decision making at the top. He has ruined us and it started since day one when he brought the club; he should be ashamed but he won't be, he will bask in the money given to him whilst fans pay extortionate prizes out of hard earned money to follow a completely frigid and passionless football team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 The easy statement is to say McLeish. I wouldn't hugely disagree with that as in June 2011 we'd had a poor season but still finished 9th, we were selling Young to Man. United but still had Downing and Bent at the club and we still went on to spend a decent amount that summer on N'zogbia and Hutton so the funds hadn't been completely withdrawn. Then we appointed McLeish and the 5 year cycle of doom is nearly at an end...at least for the premier league. However I actually go back to when we appointed Houllier as when things started to go wrong. We'd just finished 6th three times in a row. When you think teams like West Ham and Southampton have appointed excellent managers despite not finishing as high (or being recently promoted) I just can't understand why our managerial search was so limited to out of work managers like Houllier and other people like Curbishley. It probably shows you what was to come even then when our managerial search was so unambitious from a position of strength. I guess it didn't help back then that fan expectation was still so high e.g. we should be challenging for 4-6th then which is why when you look back Houllier got so much more fan stick than our next three managers combined. I wasn't a huge fan of him either but if I was to know what was to come next I'd have been far more understanding of what he was trying to do even with us losing more games than usual in that era. I accept the managerial timing of MON f***ing off wasn't an ideal. Again with hindsight but I just wish the club had left MacDonald in charge until a suitable candidate had turned up, he was capable of winning games with that squad so would've kept us ticking over in mid table until a really good candidate became available. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YGabbana Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 It went downhill as soon as MON left didnt it? In terms of league position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 World War 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 11 minutes ago, DJ_Villain said: I get what you are saying mate, but the fact of the matter is that Lerner knew sweet **** all about how to run a football club... I would say he is the most naive man to ever own a football club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, YGabbana said: It went downhill as soon as MON left didnt it? In terms of league position. Yes it did but we did finish 9th the next year so it wasn't like the situation was irretrievable That said I have no idea how we finished 9th that year as we were in a relegation battle for a long period and even on the last day we needed 4 results to go for us just to finish top 10 and they all came up. 13-14th would've been a much more accurate reflection of that season. I'd probably sum up the two appointements as 1. Appointing Houllier when the opportunity was still there to challenge for the top 6 on more reduced and sustainable terms with a forward thinking manager from abroad as teams like Southampton and West Ham have and are doing with people like Pochettino, Koeman and Bilic. 2. McLeish appointment. SIgnalled to me the club had given up on being a competitive top half force and mediocrity and working on a shoestring was the standard fare and that has continued ever since. Those were the two key summers and Lerner messed up both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Bear Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Summer 2011. We started 10-11 very poorly obviously but finished very well and had lots of good players. Then we appointed Alec McLeish and Young and Downing left. The team has got progressively worse since then. Our signings since then have either been expensive flops or League 1/2 shithouses who havent and would never make the grade like Westwood. In that time the very few success stories have been completely outweighed by the many terrible signings. We treaded water every season but this year we dont have a class player to bail us out and win games. The result, relegation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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