VILLAMARV

Oh mate I bet there's loads of stuff we can agree on if you want It's just I get the feeling there's a whole bunch of people getting pretty upset about missing out on promotion or the play offs and with each result it magnifies. Then there are a load of us who either thought we'd finish mid table or get relegated again who are more resigned to us being down here for a couple of years. It's not really about who's right but we all surely want the fix to be right. And sustainable. Throwing good money after bad is part of the reason we are where we are. No one WANTS it to take a couple of years. But it's a lot more realistic imho. Even if we made the play-offs this year the odds are we'd end up in the championship next season anyway. It is just based on the fact that we weren't relegated with a team that needed a bit of quality adding to make it alright. We were relegated with a squad of about 30 odd players with around 25 of them needing to be put out to pasture or shot. I'm not a local anymore either and the fact that there isn't even radio coverage available outside of the midlands for the majority of games is utterly infuriating. There's something we can definitely agree on

It's not about fun, it's just realism.

confirmed short term loan with an option to buy on the OS Click

I happen to agree with this although I must say they are mostly all ball watching, Jedi included, but to single him out for that goal is a bit much imho.

Aston Villa >>>>>>>>>>> many clubs.

But a good example I reckon. Could've gone elsewhere but for whatever reason he saw an opportunity to play for Newcastle that excited him.

I agree, and we have to be realistic. The days of Steve Bull and Matt LeTissier are long gone. And I'm getting into 'jumpers for goalposts' territory I know. But as we all know from our own lives and workplaces, attitude and application are the key ingredients to any real success.

Birmingham Mail

If we're to be this big powerhouse as you put it we better all get real about what that actually means. No powerhouse is built on a foundation of sand. It's absolutely frustrating that we've seen Johnstone in and nothing else. Of course it is, we're all fans. All we really care about is that when we pay our hard earned money to support this club that we get entertained. What hurts most to the majority of us is not the losses or relegations, we're Villa fans we've seen it all, it's the loss of pride in our team. I was in a corner shop the other day waiting in line. The guy being served (A Cardiff fan) asked the cashier (A Forest fan) who they were playing on the weekend. He replied that he wasn't sure but he thought it was Villa. Without a moments hesitation the Cardiff fan said "Well, that's 3 points in the bag then". The Forest fan was wrong obviously, we were playing Wolves, but I hung my head in shame. when I got to the till I said to him "is that really what we've become?" That's not solved by buying player x, y or z. That, as many people are well aware of, is the sign of a cancerous tumour that needs removing. We did a lot more in the summer than I thought possible. However just by virtue of how utterly appalling we were last year I never thought it was remotely possible to go back up this year. We need desperately to build a team. Not one perceived to be capable of this or that. Just a team. One that works for each other, that want to play for Aston Villa and most importantly Steve Bruce. Listening back to a podcast interview with God and GT (There's a link in the GT thread) McGrath points out that what GT did was make him want to play for him, he felt he owed a debt to him and the club and for whatever reason he just loved Villa Park, loved playing there, it felt like his second home or words to that effect. He alludes to them all wanting to run and fight for each other. That's a million miles away from Gana walking in the door and saying he can't wait for his debut at this stepping stone club he had just arrived at. I couldn't care less where they come from or who else has spotted them. Platt and Delaney are the stand out players we plucked from relative obscurity I can think of off the top of my head. If we ever get back to having a functioning team it will be nice to be able to start looking at adding the right quality to progress but if anything the last few months in the Championship have proved that the football is actually pretty dire. It is a hard league to get out of. but to be fair you don't have to be that good to rise to the top end of the table. What is doing for us at the moment is that we keep running into these pesky 11 man units that work together to nullify us. The idea that we need to resign a bunch people who, for whatever reason, have already decided they didn't want to play for Aston Villa anymore is just wrong. Not to point out that we have an Ashley clone in Grealish who is only good for winning free kicks already, Every midfielder we have is just as good at Delph at missing the target with a wild shot or not passing to his teammates, and Cleverley was just impotent until he decided he didn't want to come to us and started playing towards the end of the year while he was in the shop window so to speak. Exactly the mercenary attitude we would do well to avoid.

I hope so. By that rational I too am 'one for the future' WOO HOO

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/38624294

Nice bit of realism RV, though I suspect it'll never catch on

I'm sure they're trying, and I can't help but nod my head in agreement. But then we've been saying the same for years. Selling Gabby is a no brainer but to who exactly? that's the issue. We can all get emotional about cancelling contracts and releasing people on a free. In the real world though it's just loads more complicated. We can only speculate on the wage bill but rest assured it's massive for the division we're in. Including the 3 on loan there are 9 central midfielders at the club and we all know we need 2/3 of those. It is ridiculous to think we can ever be in a position where 11 or 12 first team squad members are fighting it out for 2/3 positions every week and afford it. Likewise with the strikers - including RHM we have 6 first teamers and have just sold Gestede. Of those 7, 1 is/was a functioning member of the team. We cant simply go buying striker number 7 and or 8 just because 5 of them are next to useless and pray we go up. I wish there were clubs lining up for Bacuna/Cissokho etc thinking they could snap up a bargain but I doubt any of them will get wage parity anywhere and I cant see them having much incentive to leave. Half a squad of Stephen Ireland's basically.

How many games of football have ever been won with hope though? (Hope Powell does not count due to the lower case 'h' in the question!)

Exactly. Don't forget the guy who we can only assume will never play for us again in Kozak, The kid who wont sign a contract who would definitely be getting a run now if he wanted it and we can only assume will never play for us again in RHM. On top of that, we're waiting for two of the most selfish players we've had in recent memory to come back to be remotely competitive. It's not like Kodjia and Ayew are the saviours of anything. Davis is obviously a work in progress and would arguably be unfair to throw him in in the current atmosphere. Same goes for McKirdy. Of those main 6: I like Kodjia I don't rate Ayew McCormack has been hugely disappointing Gabby and Kozak are finished RHM is playing silly buggers over his contract. Therefore with Kodjia and Ayew away, Gabby, Kozak and RHM unpickable, I suppose I would have had to go McCormack up top, with Grealish in a midfield 5. If McCormack can find a couple of goals we'll be playing an expensive signing into form. The other 3 have nothing to gain and we have nothing to gain from playing them. Having said all that Bruce had something to lose from leaving him out as RDM had done. If Bruce had gone on this run leaving Gabby out, his fans would be calling Bruce out on it. By letting him hang himself publicly he has managed the situation rather well imo. When RDM was here there were plenty of posters in here calling for him to be given a go. Some will say this has cost us promotion yadda yadda yadda but if that's true then the decisions made in the close season are to blame, not Bruce. However pleased we may or may not have been with our transfer dealings in the summer, there were plenty of people pointing out our midfield looked weak. We spent close to £30m on a new strikeforce. Kodjia is everything that Bristol City fan who came in here to chat to us said he was (go back to the start of the Kodjia thread he had him nailed) good player, makes goals out of nothing but a bit greedy and also inconsistent and usually needs a few chances to score. McCormack has just been a huge let down. All the back ups offer is the hope of being better than they've shown here but hanging your hat on Gestede, Ayew, Gabby or Kozak suddenly coming good or being better because the opposition is worse was only ever going to end in tears.

Alright, I'll have a go (nothing against your post specifically btw morley, just the umpteenth time I've read something like this in various threads this morning and I finally bit ). My guess would be because he was one of the worst players I have ever seen in the Villa shirt. Shocking lack of ability. Everyone seems to have forgotten how he wandered around aimlessly game after game doing nothing, offering nothing and contributing less. Hugely overrated in the air because of his physical size. Gabby was done years ago, we all know that in our hearts. I find it quite hilarious that people are even slightly surprised by his performances or lack of application. It aint nice but he's here till the end of next season. He's never going to leave, as others have said no one will be giving him a contract when this one expires. Quite how he got his last extention is beyond me. Resign yourselves to this. It will make the next 18 months easier to bear.

We drew 2-2. Two goals apiece for Peter Withe and Mark Falco. Against one of the more legendary of Spurs line ups including Clemence, Hughton, Perryman, Ardilles, Villa, Archibald and Hoddle. In the days before penalty shoot outs the match was drawn and the trophy was shared. Both teams get credited with a win and as I said held the trophy officially for 6 months each. The Charity Shield is a weird competition. Villa wise we have only appeared 4 times. It didn't start until 1908, so 5 titles and 4 FA Cup wins of ours happened before the competition even existed (Although it's predecessor The Sheriff of London Charity Shield was an annual amateurs v professionals match from the 1898/99 season onwards). It wasn't until 1974 that it permanently settled on being between the First Division Champions and FA Cup winners with Wembley as it's permanent home. 1910 was our first appearance after our 6th title. Against Brighton and Hove Albion who were the Southern League champions. Brighton won 1-0 at Stamford Bridge. The only time the Southern Champions ever won. And the only time we would play under that format. 1957 was the next appearance after our last FA Cup win. The Busby Babes exacted revenge for us stopping them doing the double the previous year with a 4-0 drubbing. The match was played at Old Trafford with all the goals coming in the second half. 1972 brought about our third appearance and was definitely the weirdest as Third Division Champions we squared off against Manchester City who had finished 4th in the league after Derby (League) and Leeds (FA Cup) had declined the invitation to play. We lost 1-0 to a Francis Lee penalty at Villa Park. 1981 was the only time we emerged victorious and it was with a draw. So with 7 titles and 7 FA Cups tucked away in the trophy cabinet we have only ever appeared in 4 Charity Shields, never won a match and only ever officially held the trophy for 6 months in our entire history.

And here's the one which incorporates the 1981 Charity Shield. Which both Villa and Spurs won. At the same time. And officially held for 6 months each. The 80's eh? Runs without any domestic trophy 1996/97 - Present - 21 seasons 1920/21 - 1937/38 - 18 seasons 1874/75 - 1886/87 - 13 seasons 1938/39 - 1956/57 - 12 seasons (7 lost to WWII) 1982/83 - 1993/94 - 12 seasons 1961/62 - 1971/72 - 11 seasons 1887/88 - 1893/94 - 7 seasons 1900/01 - 1904/05 - 5 seasons 1905/06 - 1909/10 - 5 seasons 1977/78 - 1980/81 - 4 seasons 1910/11 - 1912/13 - 3 seasons 1913/14 - 1919/20 - 3 seasons (4 lost to WWI) 1957/58 - 1959/60 - 3 seasons 1972/73 - 1974/75 - 3 seasons 1897/98 - 1898/99 - 2 seasons 1975/76 - 1976/77 - 2 seasons 1994/95 - 1995-96 - 2 seasons 1 season: 1894 - 1895 1895 - 1896 1896 - 1897 1899 - 1900 1960 - 1961 1981 - 1982

I also notice my mistake in the OP. In that the question didn't actually mention Europe, or the Charity Shield. So here's the version that actually answers the question Runs without any domestic league, FA Cup or League Cup trophy: 1996/97 - Present - 21 seasons 1920/21 - 1937/38 - 18 seasons 1874/75 - 1886/87 - 13 seasons 1981/82 - 1993/94 - 13 seasons 1938/39 - 1956/57 - 12 seasons (7 lost to WWII) 1961/62 - 1971/72 - 11 seasons 1887/88 - 1893/94 - 7 seasons 1900/01 - 1904/05 - 5 seasons 1905/06 - 1909/10 - 5 seasons 1977/78 - 1980/81 - 4 seasons 1910/11 - 1912/13 - 3 seasons 1913/14 - 1919/20 - 3 seasons (4 lost to WWI) 1957/58 - 1959/60 - 3 seasons 1972/73 - 1974/75 - 3 seasons 1897/98 - 1898/99 - 2 seasons 1975/76 - 1976/77 - 2 seasons 1994/95 - 1995-96 - 2 seasons 1 season: 1894 - 1895 1895 - 1896 1896 - 1897 1899 - 1900 1960 - 1961 The one for First Division, FA Cup and League Cup only: Runs without a 'major' domestic trophy 1920/21 - 1956/57 - 30 seasons (7 lost to WWII) 1996/97 - Present - 21 seasons 1961/62 - 1974/75 - 14 seasons 1874/75 - 1886/87 - 13 seasons 1981/82 - 1993/94 - 13 seasons 1887/88 - 1893/94 - 7 seasons 1900/01 - 1904/05 - 5 seasons 1905/06 - 1909/10 - 5 seasons 1957/58 - 1960/61 - 4 seasons 1977/78 - 1980/81 - 4 seasons 1910/11 - 1912/13 - 3 seasons 1913/14 - 1919/20 - 3 seasons (4 lost to WWI) 1897/98 - 1898/99 - 2 seasons 1975/76 - 1976/77 - 2 seasons 1994/95 - 1995-96 - 2 seasons 1 season: 1894 - 1895 1895 - 1896 1896 - 1897 1899 - 1900

yup. we lost 2 - 0 to Penarol. 12/12/1982. In Japan. As for the Super Cup back then it was over 2 legs and held in January of 1983 meaning we won the 1982 trophy in 1983! And yes, we beat Barcelona. (Plenty of clips on you tube of the whole 2nd leg if anyone has a couple of hours to kill). If I could pick any match in our history to travel back in time to at Villa Park, it would be this one. I can only imagine the atmosphere that night.

'running around' is a bit of a stretch

I'm glad you found that. I was reminding someone of this earlier this afternoon.

He looks bigger than me and you to me that guy.

I bloody hate this thread. I only came here to vent about the semi final against Bradford 4 years ago. In those 4 years I have mostly avoided it. I hate it more than any other thread, more even than that annoying bit of thread that sticks out the leg of my pyjamas and tickles my leg when I get up for a wee in the night. It is like the bit under the bridge where the clippy cloppy goats don't really wanna go. It must hold the record for the most homer sinking into the hedge gifs. The thing is, it's never changed ever. Everyone else's thread seems to change mood or tone with each passing performance, each trick that delights or own goal that infuriates. This one just keeps plodding along getting angrier and angrier with each sentence. But it's the sort of thread where you can post a link to the funniest thing ever said about 'real men' and get no likes (no really it's ok), where Britains got Talent makes my eyes bleed LESS!! Where the same people come eveyday to have the same argument over and over and over again with the same people as yesterday. That's a definition of insanity right there. This thread is so weird @sir_gary_cahill isn't even the most positive person about a player in here. Where avatars mean more somehow than anywhere else even to James Cameron himself. It's just all too easy, as a wise fictional despotic madman once said, to get the result you want in here with a big pokey stick. Players get insulted everyday in threads up and down the land, why is Ashley Westwood so bloody important that his honour needs defending to the hilt. I don't get it. Goals, Assists, Key passes, good moments on the pitch and definitely no more corners, that's how to change people's opinions. If he's an honourable, decent, stand up, hard working honest player as he comes across he'll know he's been poor and his focus will be on improving but as others point out the bare minimum seems to be now used as a catalyst for praise with this entire collection of lost souls we dare to call a squad. It's insane. Variety is the spice of life people and life is too bloody short to go wandering around full of hate or anger. Meditate. Talk to a tree once in a while. And then find a way of channeling all that energy into a big ball of love to be played merrily with in the garden of your dreams. GT would knock all our bloody heads together. And then buy David Platt.