Paddy's "Things that cheer you up"

[leviramsey]

????

[chrisp65]

well, I was just kind of thinking of story arcs in our modern culture

 

There is pressure to legalise marijuana, the state is moving ever closer to making it (and other drugs) legal.

 

At some point I expect somebody that would have previously made money with appearances on Springer to get Saul Goodman to claim they only started sucking 60 a day when the state legitimised it. Had it not been ok by the state, they wouldn't have done it. Therefore, it's the state's fault they now have 'x' which was most likley caused by this state endorsed habit.

[chrisp65]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting legal drugs could possibly ever be a bad thing and I certainly don't believe we should concern ourselves with the welfare of others or potential consequences.

 

I'd never be so uptight as to suggest drug caution on a hip place like an internet chatroom.

Edited November 6, 2013 by chrisp65

[dont_do_it_doug.]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting legal drugs could possibly ever be a bad thing and I certainly don't believe we should concern ourselves with the welfare of others or potential consequences.

I'd never be so uptight as to suggest drug caution on a hip place like an internet chatroom.

I should imagine such a case would never make it to court. Free will and all that.

[Anthony]

 

 

 

 

 

Tauntaun?

 

And I thought you smelled bad... on the outside.

[AVFCforever1991]

[Shillzz]

Legalising drugs?

 

That'd sure help to drag Britain out of the gutter.

 

We've already used alcohol to show that we, as a nation, are unable to moderate our excesses. While there are many, many reasons why drugs should be legalised, it's not what this country needs right now. It'd just be another route towards excess, illness and antisocial behaviour for a country that's already had it's fill.

[AVFCforever1991]

Legalising drugs?

 

That'd sure help to drag Britain out of the gutter.

 

We've already used alcohol to show that we, as a nation, are unable to moderate our excesses. While there are many, many reasons why drugs should be legalised, it's not what this country needs right now. It'd just be another route towards excess, illness and antisocial behaviour for a country that's already had it's fill.

 

Why not ban alcohol as well? :-)

Edited November 6, 2013 by AVFCforever1991

[Shillzz]

 

Legalising drugs?

 

That'd sure help to drag Britain out of the gutter.

 

We've already used alcohol to show that we, as a nation, are unable to moderate our excesses. While there are many, many reasons why drugs should be legalised, it's not what this country needs right now. It'd just be another route towards excess, illness and antisocial behaviour for a country that's already had it's fill.

 

Why not ban alcohol as well? :-)

 

 

I think the country already relies far too much on alcohol for trade - banning it would cripple the economy. 

[BOF]

Banning things that can be used to excess is never the answer.  You have to bring those situations to the Nth degree and all of a sudden you're banning chocolate because the place is full of fat words removed who haven't been educated to the dangers of eating too much of it.  Aren't there far fewer actual health issues around marijuana than regular cigarettes?  But you would never ban those as they 1) contribute an enormous amount of tax and 2) kill off smokers before they become old and a drain on the health service thereby saving mbillions too.  There are things that can currently be legally consumed that are far more dangerous than marijuana so either legalise it or make those illegal too.  The current state of affairs makes no sense from a health POV.  Maybe it does from a financial POV but then the discussion needs to be clearly made into a financial one rather than pretending it's being done for the good of the nation's health.  In reality, the real reason is that any mention of a softening attitude towards drugs is a vote loser and politicians don't like wantonly lowering their popularity.

[ME]

well, I was just kind of thinking of story arcs in our modern culture

 

There is pressure to legalise marijuana, the state is moving ever closer to making it (and other drugs) legal.

 

At some point I expect somebody that would have previously made money with appearances on Springer to get Saul Goodman to claim they only started sucking 60 a day when the state legitimised it. Had it not been ok by the state, they wouldn't have done it. Therefore, it's the state's fault they now have 'x' which was most likley caused by this state endorsed habit.

I suspect someone here has already got it in the works. Would NOT surprise me one bit.

[ME]

Anyway, back on topic, this morning it was Cake. (the band, although actual cake would never upset me) I just haven't listened to them much for a while and it was a Cake kind of morning

[Shillzz]

Banning things that can be used to excess is never the answer.  You have to bring those situations to the Nth degree and all of a sudden you're banning chocolate because the place is full of fat words removed who haven't been educated to the dangers of eating too much of it.  Aren't there far fewer actual health issues around marijuana than regular cigarettes?  But you would never ban those as they 1) contribute an enormous amount of tax and 2) kill off smokers before they become old and a drain on the health service thereby saving mbillions too.  There are things that can currently be legally consumed that are far more dangerous than marijuana so either legalise it or make those illegal too.  The current state of affairs makes no sense from a health POV.  Maybe it does from a financial POV but then the discussion needs to be clearly made into a financial one rather than pretending it's being done for the good of the nation's health.  In reality, the real reason is that any mention of a softening attitude towards drugs is a vote loser and politicians don't like wantonly lowering their popularity.

 

There's no disputing a lot of what you say here, but my personal stance on it would be quite different.

 

The fact that Marijuana poses less of a health threat than cigarettes doesn't mean that it too should be legalised, in my opinion. Cigarettes are one of the most ridiculously stupid items that are available to be purchased legally and I suspect people will look back on their consumption with horror in a couple of hundred years' time. For me, it should be a matter of moving forward, not legalising drugs because they're slightly less harmful than other problem causing products. For what it's worth, while I don't think for one minute that outlawing cigarettes would be a practical move, were they a new product to the market, then I would very much back a move to ban them.

[BOF]

I completely agree with what you say in principle. That logic applies to many things when you say that by simply being better than something that's currently available on the market, it isn't reason enough to make that thing available too.

But, from my admitted position of relative ignorance isn't marijuana far far safer than cigarettes (and alcohol for that matter), as in it is not even nearly in the same league as the stuff?

To me it seems that the reluctance to legalise it up to now has been based on scaremongering of tenuous health fears and an overwhelming dollop of politicians petrified for their careers.

I also agree with the opinion that if cigarettes were a new phenomenon they wouldn't be getting on to the market easily and probably wouldn't stay there as a relatively new product if/when their health issues came to light. You can thank the hugely powerful (and rich) tobacco lobbyists for that one.

[Shillzz]

I think you're probably right there. I've had a quick read around t'internet and there does seem to be a number of health benefits that elevate marijuana above cigarettes in terms of safety. As you say, the health risks involved with marijuana probably aren't substantial enough for politicians to hide behind, not on their own anyway.

 

That said, they've still not been proven to be beneficial to the average user's health, and most people seem to accept that while they're a better alternative to cigarettes, they're still harmful in some way. If you were to put them forward as a healthier alternative to cigarettes, then why would you need to look past the perfectly legal, and presumably less hazardous electronic cigarette?

 

My personal 'beef' is really more concerned with the social implications of legalising cannabis. Our city & town centres are already put under immense stress by the country's drinking culture. Adding Dutch-style coffee shops would just be another mess for the police to deal with.

Edited November 6, 2013 by Shillzz

[BOF]

Yeah true and to me that becomes a different discussion altogether. It becomes one of social freedom and of personal responsibility. I'd always be an advocate of allowing people to do as much as we can and making them responsible and accountable for their actions, rather than preventing everyone from doing it in the first place. If you ban something, you deny it to the responsible people aswell (of which there are far more people) and that to me isn't really fair. It means 1 idiot can deny 100 people the pleasure of experiencing something (anything, not specifically mary jane) and to me the balance is wrong there.

[chrisp65]

Anyway, back on topic, this morning it was Cake. (the band, although actual cake would never upset me) I just haven't listened to them much for a while and it was a Cake kind of morning

 

yay for cake!

 

scientifically proven fact best ever version of 'I will survive'

[Shillzz]

Hmmmm. You may have a point there. As someone who's not particularly interested in smoking cannabis, my concern lies more with the trouble makers who will inevitably go on to cause a nuisance of themselves, rather than the larger group of responsible users. 

 

I'm not entirely sure now...

 

On the one hand, what you say make a lot of sense. It isn't necessarily fair to ban Cannabis under the premise that some people will act like idiots under it's influence. And the health implications alone probably aren't enough to keep Cannabis from the legalised list either.

 

On the other, perhaps more pragmatically than theoretically, there's no need to cause that extra level of trouble that Cannabis would inevitably bring. I don't think people necessarily have a right to it, and i'm also entirely sure that allowing people to be responsible for their own actions isn't a good idea for everyone. While it wouldn't be the greatest problem faced by the country, I still think it would be a problem, and hence there's no need to legalise it IMO. In the same way that increasing the national speed limit to 90mph would be a move that would benefit many, the idiotic actions of the few would cause more damage than it's worth.

[adw95]

I've always thought legalising marijuana in the UK/Britain is a terrible idea for the people that smoke it, and for one reason; tax. The government would tax it to **** which would lead to the equivalent of £10s worth going up by 50-100% or more. Nobody seems to think this way though?

[villaajax]

I've always thought legalising marijuana in the UK/Britain is a terrible idea for the people that smoke it, and for one reason; tax. The government would tax it to **** which would lead to the equivalent of £10s worth going up by 50-100% or more. Nobody seems to think this way though?

 

But then you'll get all these brain damaged people... like my brother.