Comparing and contrasting 2007-09 Villa versus 2023 Villa

[Marka Ragnos]

It's weird to read old newspaper accounts and online posts about Villa from 2007-09.

It feels so long ago and yet, not. I don't think I have the intelligence and knowledge to grasp what has changed with Villa since that era, but I wonder if some of you may have some insights or observations? Would truly love to hear what you had to say, even if you didn't experience 2007-09 Villa personally or weren't as engaged as a Villa supporter back then.

In your view, what's different -- and what's not -- with Villa from then versus Villa today?  

Quote

 

From the Guardian, Feb. 2009: ... It is not all about Chelsea, though. Part of the reason the top-four cartel is breaking up is the continued pressure applied from beneath by organised, well-run clubs such as Aston Villa and Everton. Particularly Villa, who have just that bit more money than Everton and are not content to keep banging their head on a glass ceiling. 

There was a time not long ago when managers such as Kevin Keegan, David Moyes, Sam Allardyce and others would moan about the impossibility of breaking into the top four and the unfairness of competing in such a handicapped event. Keegan famously said last year that the Premier League was "in danger of becoming one of the most boring but great leagues in the world". Not now. Martin O'Neill is going for it and even Everton might have been harbouring Champions League ambitions but for their poor early-season form. ...

 

 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Marka Ragnos

[Wainy316]

We were absolutely flying when that article was written.  Been on a great run of form and after laying Blackburn we were sitting third and only a few points off the top.

We did then lose a crunch game with Chelsea at the end of the month and then Stoke happened...

[The_Rev]

January transfer window happened.  Arsenal buy a bang in form Andrei Arshavin, we turn down the opportunity to sign a 22 year old Radamel Falcao in order to buy a 31 year old Emile Heskey.     Falcao scored 34, 38, 34 & 36 goals in his first four seasons in European football (he signed for Porto who sold him to Atleti for an enormous profit) whereas Heskey scored 2, 5, 6 & 1* goals in his four seasons at Villa Park. 

 

*yes, I'm aware you can't pluralise 1, but it's not my fault Emile Heskey couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo.   

[His Name Is Death]

5 minutes ago, The_Rev said:

January transfer window happened.  Arsenal buy a bang in form Andrei Arshavin, we turn down the opportunity to sign a 22 year old Radamel Falcao in order to buy a 31 year old Emile Heskey.     Falcao scored 34, 38, 34 & 36 goals in his first four seasons in European football (he signed for Porto who sold him to Atleti for an enormous profit) whereas Heskey scored 2, 5, 6 & 1* goals in his four seasons at Villa Park. 

 

*yes, I'm aware you can't pluralise 1, but it's not my fault Emile Heskey couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo.   

Yes, this was key. Turned down the chance of signing Cavani too, apparently.

[Follyfoot]

19 minutes ago, The_Rev said:

January transfer window happened.  Arsenal buy a bang in form Andrei Arshavin, we turn down the opportunity to sign a 22 year old Radamel Falcao in order to buy a 31 year old Emile Heskey.     Falcao scored 34, 38, 34 & 36 goals in his first four seasons in European football (he signed for Porto who sold him to Atleti for an enormous profit) whereas Heskey scored 2, 5, 6 & 1* goals in his four seasons at Villa Park. 

 

*yes, I'm aware you can't pluralise 1, but it's not my fault Emile Heskey couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo.   

He scored on his debut at Portsmouth though

[Tom13]

27 minutes ago, The_Rev said:

January transfer window happened.  Arsenal buy a bang in form Andrei Arshavin, we turn down the opportunity to sign a 22 year old Radamel Falcao in order to buy a 31 year old Emile Heskey.     Falcao scored 34, 38, 34 & 36 goals in his first four seasons in European football (he signed for Porto who sold him to Atleti for an enormous profit) whereas Heskey scored 2, 5, 6 & 1* goals in his four seasons at Villa Park. 

 

*yes, I'm aware you can't pluralise 1, but it's not my fault Emile Heskey couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo.   

Did we actually turn down Falcao though or was that just media talk?

[VillaParkAvenue]

4 hours ago, The_Rev said:

we turn down the opportunity to sign a 22 year old

in order to buy a 31 year old

At least the club has stayed true to this strategy!

[VillaJ100]

Arsenal signed Arshavin after the window as well let's not beat around the bush. Sure it was like the day after.

The absolute worst thing about it was not only were we like 8 points above arsenal but like 12-13 above Everton and they still reeled us in and overtook as the form collapsed. Very similar to being top of the league at Xmas 2000 then collapsing and finishing 6th. This mental midget problem has been pervasive for ages

Edited January 12, 2023 by VillaJ100

[CLARETANDBLUEFOXY]

11 hours ago, The_Rev said:

January transfer window happened.  Arsenal buy a bang in form Andrei Arshavin, we turn down the opportunity to sign a 22 year old Radamel Falcao in order to buy a 31 year old Emile Heskey.     Falcao scored 34, 38, 34 & 36 goals in his first four seasons in European football (he signed for Porto who sold him to Atleti for an enormous profit) whereas Heskey scored 2, 5, 6 & 1* goals in his four seasons at Villa Park. 

 

*yes, I'm aware you can't pluralise 1, but it's not my fault Emile Heskey couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo.   

I remember this well. I honestly think this was the moment Villa dropped off the radar in going forwards. Who knows what could have been had we got Falcao and not Heskey. 

[CLARETANDBLUEFOXY]

10 hours ago, Follyfoot said:

He scored on his debut at Portsmouth though

I was actually at that game. Only decent thing he did haha 

[CLARETANDBLUEFOXY]

5 hours ago, VillaJ100 said:

Arsenal signed Arshavin after the window as well let's not beat around the bush. Sure it was like the day after.

The absolute worst thing about it was not only were we like 8 points above arsenal but like 12-13 above Everton and they still reeled us in and overtook as the form collapsed. Very similar to being top of the league at Xmas 2000 then collapsing and finishing 6th. This mental midget problem has been pervasive for ages

I remember o Neill’s excuse for this being “they just ran out of steam” then sign some players who can actually make it through a whole season! 

[Sulberto21]

11 hours ago, His Name Is Death said:

Yes, this was key. Turned down the chance of signing Cavani too, apparently.

Cavani was the window before. But he was touted to a lot of clubs. Falcao really wanted to come to us because of JPA links. Had we got both and Moutinho we win the league in one the following couple of seasons. 

[His Name Is Death]

17 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

Cavani was the window before. But he was touted to a lot of clubs. Falcao really wanted to come to us because of JPA links. Had we got both and Moutinho we win the league in one the following couple of seasons. 

We were in for Moutinho as well? Didn’t know about that one.

[Sulberto21]

On 12/01/2023 at 08:02, His Name Is Death said:

We were in for Moutinho as well? Didn’t know about that one.

Along with Everton they were linked much more strongly though, ours was a tenuous link. 

Edited January 13, 2023 by Sulberto21

[Pez1974]

17 hours ago, Wainy316 said:

We were absolutely flying when that article was written.  Been on a great run of form and after laying Blackburn we were sitting third and only a few points off the top.

We did then lose a crunch game with Chelsea at the end of the month and then Stoke happened...

One of those sayings which all Villa fans from the time know, and shudder about - and fans from other clubs have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
I genuinely believe this was the sliding doors moment for Lerner at Villa, and we've not yet recovered.

[villanmac]

I found that 2007-2009 side a really hard watch. We played some awful stuff, but it was the most memorable team in my lifetime because it had great moments.

2008/2009 (the big tilt the top 4 season) my memory is us just being awful a lot of the time and just winning.

- Portsmouth away Heskey , they absolutely battered us for an hour then they get a man sent off and batter us even more! Saw it out somehow.

- Hull City away around Xmas, we were crap... not a hope of scoring and Ashley Young sticks a cross in on a rare break in the last min and defender scores an own goal somehow.

- Everton (the Ashley Young last min goal (3-2)) camped in our half for the whole game, they had about 3 off the line, hit the bar and we nick it. That winner is probably the greatest moment ive experienced as a villa fan.

- Sunderland away, got dominated we're 1-0 down, Milner scores one with his hand/shoulder on the counter and then we get a penalty for a foul outside the box on another counter and win 2-1 after Young got sent off.

Admittedly, the buzz of winning games in that way (and staying up there in the top 4 hunt) was unbelievable. Away days were insane. It kind of made me think there was something a bit magical about O'Neil how we pulled victories off. But the narrative that we blew it with the Heskey signing and the UEFA Cup thing (MON says we got tired) is false imo. The luck just ran out. Well luck is a bit harsh as it was incredibly resilient side but quality wise we were nowhere near good enough throughout the season, we had some brilliant counter attacking players, Ashley Young was phenomenal and we were great at set pieces but they weren't a good footballing team. 

[The Fun Factory]

Completely different footballing eras though. MON was one the last old school 4-4-2 guys which was getting out of date even then. Big central defenders and full backs who's main role was to defend. Out and out wingers and and big man-pacey man up front.  We were a top 4 side away from home and mid table side at home, which was one of the reasons we never got Champions League.  It was a great chance to get into the elite and in true Villa style we ballsed it up.

[Sulberto21]

8 minutes ago, villanmac said:

I found that 2007-2009 side a really hard watch. We played some awful stuff, but it was the most memorable team in my lifetime because it had great moments.

2008/2009 (the big tilt the top 4 season) my memory is us just being awful a lot of the time and just winning.

- Portsmouth away Heskey , they absolutely battered us for an hour then they get a man sent off and batter us even more! Saw it out somehow.

- Hull City away around Xmas, we were crap... not a hope of scoring and Ashley Young sticks a cross in on a rare break in the last min and defender scores an own goal somehow.

- Everton (the Ashley Young last min goal (3-2)) camped in our half for the whole game, they had about 3 off the line, hit the bar and we nick it. That winner is probably the greatest moment ive experienced as a villa fan.

- Sunderland away, got dominated we're 1-0 down, Milner scores one with his hand/shoulder on the counter and then we get a penalty for a foul outside the box on another counter and win 2-1 after Young got sent off.

Admittedly, the buzz of winning games in that way (and staying up there in the top 4 hunt) was unbelievable. Away days were insane. It kind of made me think there was something a bit magical about O'Neil how we pulled victories off. But the narrative that we blew it with the Heskey signing and the UEFA Cup thing (MON says we got tired) is false imo. The luck just ran out. Well luck is a bit harsh as it was incredibly resilient side but quality wise we were nowhere near good enough throughout the season, we had some brilliant counter attacking players, Ashley Young was phenomenal and we were great at set pieces but they weren't a good footballing team. 

Heskey missed loads though. Back post comfortable header no1 around him 8/10 yards out and he starts a counter attack for them.

We didn’t need heskey we had Carew we needed Falcao and we would have got top 4. 

[Wainy316]

8 hours ago, VillaJ100 said:

Very similar to being top of the league at Xmas 2000 then collapsing and finishing 6th. This mental midget problem has been pervasive for ages

Pedant alert but it was 1998.  Just after Dwight Yorke left and we signed big Dion and Merse.

[Wainy316]

34 minutes ago, Pez1974 said:

One of those sayings which all Villa fans from the time know, and shudder about - and fans from other clubs have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
I genuinely believe this was the sliding doors moment for Lerner at Villa, and we've not yet recovered.

Kindly delivered by Glenn Whelan in the 94th minute too

Edited January 12, 2023 by Wainy316