chrisp65 Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 I actually saw him live supporting the red hot chili peppers in Hyde Park in 2004 and it was one of the weirdest live acts I've ever seen, like 14 minute long version of living in America in which he sang 7 words danced around a bit and let his backing singers do the rest, it's put me off him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted March 19, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted March 19, 2023 (edited) James Brown/The Famous Flames/The JBs were a pernicious influence on soul, imo. They created this idea that the groove was way more important than the song, leading directly to funk, disco and that shite that passes for 'r&b' these days. Similar things happened in other genres. I call it 'the distillation fallacy' - picking on one aspect of a style, and emphasising it to the exclusion of others. Led Zeppelin used heavy riffs and volume in the service of the song, but the the acts that followed fixated only on the riffs and volume, thus the degradation of heavy metal. Edited March 19, 2023 by mjmooney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 James Brown's discography is quite confusing. He's fairly naff at the start, but gets better after the track 'Cold Sweat'. Different versions of the same tracks can be found across his releases. Sometimes these weren't re-recordings, but additions to the original multitracks of songs he already had out there. Some would say his best album is perhaps this? You wouldn't necessarily think so, as his name's not on the front. 'Blow Your Head' is a banger. The 'Funky People' compilations are good. People Records was James Brown's label, you get his band and sound but with the likes of Lyn Collins and Hank Ballard on the mic, which some might prefer? 'Think' by Lyn Collins is another absolute tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 a definite drop off point yesterday for my other half, she was with me on the painting party all through the Kinks and Beach Boys, then I went JB’s and she went greenhouse… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veloman Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 @chrisp65. Excellent clip from you. Among bass players I've played with they argue who kicked off this technique first; Bootsy or a great bassist (IMO) called Larry Graham. I saw Bootsy at the Odeon; I think he was on with Ray Parker Jnr. I have to say it wsa the loudest bass I have ever heard - but then I've never seen Motorhead 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 2 hours ago, mjmooney said: James Brown/The Famous Flames/The JBs were a pernicious influence on soul, imo. They created this idea that the groove was way more important than the song, leading directly to funk, disco and that shite that passes for 'r&b' these days. Similar things happened in other genres. I call it 'the distillation fallacy' - picking on one aspect of a style, and emphasising it to the exclusion of others. Led Zeppelin used heavy riffs and volume in the service of the song, but the the acts that followed fixated only on the riffs and volume, thus the degradation of heavy metal. The thing about Black American music is that it is rarely static. The soul crooning style that James Brown did in the 50's and early 60's fell right out of favor with Black audiences along with the Chicago Blues. @Xannis right, "Cold Sweat" was the turning point where the songs became more aggressive and "funky". You're also right that his music lead to Disco, House, Rap, etc. But where you say pernicious, I say essential... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted March 19, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted March 19, 2023 29 minutes ago, maqroll said: But where you say pernicious, I say essential Fine, whatever floats your boat. And I'm clearly in a minority.But I like songs. The Motown stuff was classic pop music, but still had a shit-hot funky groove from Jamerson and the Funk Brothers mob. Likewise, southern soul (Stax/Volt etc.) had the Muscle Shoals crew, but a recognisable blues heritage. From the mid 70s on, it all just lost much of its magic for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 1 minute ago, mjmooney said: Fine, whatever floats your boat. And I'm clearly in a minority.But I like songs. The Motown stuff was classic pop music, but still had a shit-hot funky groove from Jamerson and the Funk Brothers mob. Likewise, southern soul (Stax/Volt etc.) had the Muscle Shoals crew, but a recognisable blues heritage. From the mid 70s on, it all just lost much of its magic for me. Brown was basically washed up by 1976. But those records he did from 1967-74 were ferocious. I totally get what you're saying about "liking songs". I do too. A well crafted 3 minute pop song is a delight. And that live musicianship from the old days was somewhat lost with the advent of rap music and modern production techniques. So I understand what you mean. But I also think music can be anything it's creator chooses it to be, so I don't limit myself. And those songs from the 60s are always just fingertip away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veloman Posted March 20, 2023 Share Posted March 20, 2023 I am well aware of the poster who dislikes 'Disco' but the thing is, if you are playing in a band for people to dance to (as I was) that 16's/ 4 to the floor is great. In fact if , as a drummer, you couldn't crack those 16's on the hi hat you were stuffed. No less a person than Bernard (Pretty) Purdie identifies disco as different from Motown, Stax etc. Rap !!! well , there is very little musicianship in that these days (IMO ) but some might rememeber a lady called Millie Jackson who was an early 'rapper' and her stuff was great - if not somewhat explicit ; eg The Phuck You Symphony.:) Have you all looked up Screamin' Jay ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted March 20, 2023 Share Posted March 20, 2023 I would wager the majority of regular contributors to this thread don't need to look up Screamin Jay Hawkins. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted March 20, 2023 Author VT Supporter Share Posted March 20, 2023 58 minutes ago, veloman said: Have you all looked up Screamin' Jay ? He’s the one my mama warned me about, yeah? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veloman Posted March 20, 2023 Share Posted March 20, 2023 50 minutes ago, Seat68 said: I would wager the majority of regular contributors to this thread don't need to look up Screamin Jay Hawkins. Thank you for your somewhat condescending comment. Merry Christmas ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted March 20, 2023 Share Posted March 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, veloman said: Thank you for your somewhat condescending comment. Merry Christmas ! Was it? I was responding to you suggesting that we look up Screamin Jay Hawkins, with the majority of people not needing to. If it came over as condescending I don't see it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted March 20, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted March 20, 2023 1 hour ago, veloman said: No less a person than Bernard (Pretty) Purdie identifies disco as different from Motown, Stax etc. It was. It got very boring, very quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
il_serpente Posted March 20, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted March 20, 2023 10 hours ago, Seat68 said: Was it? I was responding to you suggesting that we look up Screamin Jay Hawkins, with the majority of people not needing to. If it came over as condescending I don't see it. You must have put a spell on him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted March 20, 2023 Share Posted March 20, 2023 Sister Sledge was on. She danced whilst emptying the washing machine and putting the clothes on the dryer. That's the uplifting power of disco. Sticking with the theme of uplifting, and bringing harps back. This guy is my favourite thing right now. That's one of the tamer tracks. The album is an overload of joy. Heaps of it, steaming gobbets. Still not impressed? Judging from Youtube and the biog he's a multinstrumentalist, and it's him playing the harp.across these recordings. @il_serpente - There's a song called 'El Siquisiri', it seems to be a song to show off your harpist. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted March 21, 2023 Share Posted March 21, 2023 Disco Demolition Reading through the getting older thread and upstream in this thread reminded me of this… Quote a giant crate full of records was placed in the outfield. Dahl, the disgruntled disc jockey, donned a combat helmet and military jacket and led chants of "disco sucks." Then they blew up the crate. The explosion scattered records high into the air and left a crater in center field. And my annual mantra that music is music, and the Kingdom of Heaven is within. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted March 21, 2023 Share Posted March 21, 2023 49 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: Disco Demolition Then he went home and put his new steaming pile of turd Kiss album on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted March 21, 2023 Moderator Share Posted March 21, 2023 17 minutes ago, Xann said: steaming pile of turd Kiss album 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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