Tom13 Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 2 minutes ago, VillanousOne said: People forget how often Benteke would get injured and how long he would take to regain his form, he was awesome when match fit and firing but as soon as he got some consistency he went to Liverpool... I dunno, I thought he'd already started to slow down when he went to Liverpool...swear that achilles injury ruined him. But let's not go off topic! Back to Ollie 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJBOB Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 (edited) 51 minutes ago, Tom13 said: Ah, can't be if Specs (who?), Jay Bothroyd and Dougie Critchley (who?) say so! You ask other fans and they’d all rank Ollie about the same on that list. All around strikers are a rare breed these days. I can understand frustrations about Ollie’s limitations because they’re plain to see. But it really is a delusion to think any improvement replacement is going to go less than Holjund and in turn, there are very few similar striker profiles that are going to be willing to play second fiddle to Ollie, who has started almost every game for 7 seasons. Edited September 10, 2023 by DJBOB 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tezzaleed Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 19 minutes ago, VillanousOne said: People forget how often Benteke would get injured and how long he would take to regain his form, he was awesome when match fit and firing but as soon as he got some consistency he went to Liverpool... Watkins maybe frustrating but he's still one of the best strikers we have ever had and would take years to replace he's good but he's not Dean Saunders or Dalian Atkinson level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 2 hours ago, Villaphan04 said: As if we wouldn't all swap Evan Fergusson for him 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom13 Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 I need to see more of that Beto but he looked a monster the bit I saw of him. Looked good technically as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 5 minutes ago, paul514 said: As if we wouldn't all swap Evan Fergusson for him and we arent spending the money for him, he is nowhere near a realistic swap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 He’s having a poor season to date 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 1 hour ago, Zatman said: and we arent spending the money for him, he is nowhere near a realistic swap That is my point, ranked below him but is better and worth more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villaphan04 Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 3 hours ago, DJBOB said: But he can’t pass, has square feet, and we should get rid. Easily replaceable. a striker as we know it today is extremely rare, as managers/coaches place different value on different skills. Gone are the days of having a poacher as your starting striker in the PL & expecting him to get 15/20+ goals... teams will get torn apart as the game has become extremely tactically based. 1 hour ago, DJBOB said: But it really is a delusion to think any improvement replacement is going to go less than Holjund and in turn, there are very few similar striker profiles that are going to be willing to play second fiddle to Ollie, who has started almost every game for 7 seasons. I think this really is the point I am trying to make. There are no realistic upgrades on Ollie for us in this current market. That's why we took the 20m ish gamble on Duran (and Wilson in the youth ranks for example)... 2 hours ago, nick76 said: Ignoring order of strikers on this, the Saturday Social is not the authority I would look to on anything given some of those on there. that might be the case, but my point is that Ollie is one of the guys considered to be in the "upper echelon" of strikers in the PL. He starts for at least 75% of PL teams. 1 hour ago, paul514 said: As if we wouldn't all swap Evan Fergusson for him Well, every PL team except from Man City (and even they are being linked with him) would do the exact same based on him only being 18 and what potential he has shown thus far. But if we were only looking at the short-term (this season) for example, I wouldn't be swapping Ollie for Ferguson. Especially considering we know what level Ollie brings to us (upper mid-tier of striker in the PL), while Ferguson has had only 24 PL games. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 4 hours ago, tezzaleed said: he's good but he's not Dean Saunders or Dalian Atkinson level. I loved both Dalian and Dean but Watkins has already got more goals than either and I'd guess more assists. People forget that the level of football has changed, outside of Haaland how many strikers are consistent let alone English ones??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul514 Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 3 hours ago, Villaphan04 said: a striker as we know it today is extremely rare, as managers/coaches place different value on different skills. Gone are the days of having a poacher as your starting striker in the PL & expecting him to get 15/20+ goals... teams will get torn apart as the game has become extremely tactically based. I think this really is the point I am trying to make. There are no realistic upgrades on Ollie for us in this current market. That's why we took the 20m ish gamble on Duran (and Wilson in the youth ranks for example)... that might be the case, but my point is that Ollie is one of the guys considered to be in the "upper echelon" of strikers in the PL. He starts for at least 75% of PL teams. Well, every PL team except from Man City (and even they are being linked with him) would do the exact same based on him only being 18 and what potential he has shown thus far. But if we were only looking at the short-term (this season) for example, I wouldn't be swapping Ollie for Ferguson. Especially considering we know what level Ollie brings to us (upper mid-tier of striker in the PL), while Ferguson has had only 24 PL games. I would swap him for this season too, he is simply better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 12 hours ago, paul514 said: I would swap him for this season too, he is simply better. Not a sensible decision on what we've seen so far. Can Ferguson play 60-70 games a season? That's what we need from our striker. Ferguson has played less than 25 in his career and picked up two knocks already. Ollie is some sort of terminator who shrugs off every clattering he gets. Wouldn't argue Ferguson looks a really really good player. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonVillian Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 I would cash in Jan if we can get 50m+ for him to be honest. Think he's reached his peak and should get some profit while we can. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 18 minutes ago, LondonVillian said: I would cash in Jan if we can get 50m+ for him to be honest. Think he's reached his peak and should get some profit while we can. Even his peak is good enough for us 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom13 Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 15 minutes ago, VillanousOne said: Even his peak is good enough for us Nah 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJBOB Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 2 hours ago, LondonVillian said: I would cash in Jan if we can get 50m+ for him to be honest. Think he's reached his peak and should get some profit while we can. Sell for 50M in January while we're probably in the thick of Europe, cups, league pile up during a window that's notorious for being difficult to acquire players. That is a take! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJBOB Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 19 hours ago, Villaphan04 said: a striker as we know it today is extremely rare, as managers/coaches place different value on different skills. Gone are the days of having a poacher as your starting striker in the PL & expecting him to get 15/20+ goals... teams will get torn apart as the game has become extremely tactically based. I think this really is the point I am trying to make. There are no realistic upgrades on Ollie for us in this current market. That's why we took the 20m ish gamble on Duran (and Wilson in the youth ranks for example)... that might be the case, but my point is that Ollie is one of the guys considered to be in the "upper echelon" of strikers in the PL. He starts for at least 75% of PL teams. Well, every PL team except from Man City (and even they are being linked with him) would do the exact same based on him only being 18 and what potential he has shown thus far. But if we were only looking at the short-term (this season) for example, I wouldn't be swapping Ollie for Ferguson. Especially considering we know what level Ollie brings to us (upper mid-tier of striker in the PL), while Ferguson has had only 24 PL games. I was being facetious. I agree that Ollie is the tier below an elite striker. My contention has always been that the elite striker is the cherry on top - especially in today's market. We need improved players at probably 5 or 6 positions before replacing Ollie, especially with Duran as an understudy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJBOB Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-boss-unai-emery-27646109 Quote “He has to be demanding of himself but also confident," Emery said when asked about his thoughts on Watkins' omission from the England squad. "He needs to keep going the way he with us - and he’s going to score goals. “He’s playing really well. Last week he didn’t score but he played so well. Being consistent like he has been - and with his mentality, he will go to the national team. I think he’s going to be there. “Not now but he will because he is progressing and playing very well. He has a lot of other very, very good players in the England team too but I think he’s going to be there because he’s playing so well.” On whether he has spoken to Watkins about being overlooked, Emery replied: “No, no, because I’m trying to deal with him to be consistent. “I told him one time before you have to better but you have to be consistent with your mind and the mentality you have. Because he really has a very, very good mentality. He’s a player who is always available to play, to train, to learn and to progress. “He is someone who always wants to work more - that’s a mentality which is a very good example for everyone.” 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 48 minutes ago, DJBOB said: Sell for 50M in January while we're probably in the thick of Europe, cups, league pile up during a window that's notorious for being difficult to acquire players. That is a take! Yeah but at least he be gone and we will be happy with a loan for Ashley Barnes or Dwight Gayle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Tom13 said: Nah Until he starts scoring again and then everything is fine, i'm sure there are many better strikers out there that will come to us... no probs, get Monchi on it bruv he'll sort us right out If you believe half the crap spouted on this forum, about two players are 'good enough' for wherever it is people think we should be, it's called Spurs syndrome, always one striker or midfielder off greatness Edited September 11, 2023 by VillanousOne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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