Demitri_C Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 Yeah for sure bad times ahead. I think the housing markets starting to slow down as the intial boom is fading. When agents were 1st opening they were busy and struggled to do viewings for me. Now they calling me offering me viewings emails the works. Also becoming more pushy now compared to before. I get the sense of more urgency now to sell as a lack of buyers out there. Good time to buy id imagine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, blandy said: He wrote them a letter didn’t he? IIRC that’s what kicked off the uproar. dunno is the honest answer , I'm only aware of a video as a result of googling on yahoo yesterday , didn't see any mention of a letter in the articles I read , just the video .. The uproar seems to have come from people not really understanding the govt scheme and how it would operate ... which at that time 24th March , I'm not really sure anyone did ? Think I mentioned it at the time in the virus thread , but we got bombarded with people who we employ on ad hoc work (they work for numerous companies without contracts) demanding we give them the money that the government had given to us , people kinda panicked and then clearings in the woods like Martin Lewis gave out bad and factually incorrect advice , it was a real minefield , we had to argue the case for weeks to get the Ok to furlough all these people as the initial advice was they would not be entitled to money. We have projects again and will end furlough from 30th June , these same people are now writing to me saying "It's not costing you anything, so I'd like to stay on furlough and take the government money" .. again , not what the scheme was for and not what the scheme actually says ... had they written and said I'm concerned for my health , then a different proposition , but writing to basically say please help me scam the government , I'm not entertaining . Edited June 24, 2020 by tonyh29 so much bad spelling 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 There were three things that Martin did during the two-week period before and after the imposition of lockdown that irritated people: 1] the video to staff: He was arguably trying to help, but at a time of great uncertainty and fear, not least among his thousands of employees, the message came off as 'I'm abandoning you to your fate'. 2] They threatened to withhold payments to suppliers (I don't know to what extent they followed through with this threat) 3] Martin gave an incredibly stupid interview on the Friday before lockdown began in which he claimed, as if he had any way of knowing whatsoever, 'There's been hardly any transmission of the virus within pubs', which was both stupid and dangerous as a comment. The impression created was of a bad employer not concerned about either the financial or physical wellbeing of his staff, the physical wellbeing of customers, or of dealing with suppliers responsibly and within contractual bounds. He already has a reputation of being an anti-science denialist (his views on smoking in pubs) so this played in to an already negative perception of him and his leadership. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 (edited) There's very little wrong with that video, besides the fact it's Tim Martin, he looks a bit of a state, and people have previous (legitimate) grievances against him. He's not telling anyone to do anything. The idea that it might make sense to take a similar type of job in a sector which is still actively working and hiring, is hardly controversial. For all he knew at the time, pubs might be shut for a whole year, and half his premises might have to be closed. Nobody knew how long the furlough scheme would last. It was sensible advice. Edited June 24, 2020 by KentVillan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 Weird thing to beat him with. Sounded pretty solid that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 4 hours ago, Demitri_C said: Yeah for sure bad times ahead. I think the housing markets starting to slow down as the intial boom is fading. When agents were 1st opening they were busy and struggled to do viewings for me. Now they calling me offering me viewings emails the works. Also becoming more pushy now compared to before. I get the sense of more urgency now to sell as a lack of buyers out there. Good time to buy id imagine If the IMF forecast I saw today for 20/21 is anything to go by, there's better buying opportunities ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 Intu are warning they might have to go in to administration. With lots of shops being advised by the government to seek rent holidays and rent reductions.... Intu are that Landlord. They’re probably a portion of your pension too. If Intu were to collapse, then there would be no insurance or maintenance on shopping centres and they would have to close. The shopping centres impacted would include: Merry Hill Trafford Centre, Manchester Arndale, Manchester Lakeside, Essex Glasgow Newcastle Derby Norwich Nottingham (two in Nottingham) Cardiff (two in Cardiff) Stoke Watford Cribbs, Bristol Gateshead Uxbridge We could see a tory govt underwriting or nationalising shopping centres. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 35 minutes ago, KentVillan said: There's very little wrong with that video, besides the fact it's Tim Martin, he looks a bit of a state, and people have previous (legitimate) grievances against him. He's not telling anyone to do anything. The idea that it might make sense to take a similar type of job in a sector which is still actively working and hiring, is hardly controversial. For all he knew at the time, pubs might be shut for a whole year, and half his premises might have to be closed. Nobody knew how long the furlough scheme would last. It was sensible advice. I guess he could, if he wanted to, learn the lesson that if you spend your life being an asshole in public, then even when you're not being an asshole, people will judge you through that prism. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post HanoiVillan Posted June 24, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 24, 2020 23 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: We could see a tory govt underwriting or nationalising shopping centres. 2020 is nearly complete, but it won't finally be over until they've nationalised sausages. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 24, 2020 Moderator Share Posted June 24, 2020 5 hours ago, tonyh29 said: The uproar seems to have come from people not really understanding the govt scheme and how it would operate ... which at that time 24th March , I'm not really sure anyone did ? I don’t think it’s related, really. The spoons workers had done their work, served the pints and food and Spoons had received customer cash for that. But spoons man said , effectively, I’m banking the money and I’m not paying you for work you’ve already done, until the government gives me some money as well. Meanwhile the workers had no wages to pay for food and rent etc. The bloke’s an utter word removed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 1 hour ago, KenjiOgiwara said: If the IMF forecast I saw today for 20/21 is anything to go by, there's better buying opportunities ahead. Probably in other parts of the uk but i doubt london. Its such a rip off here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 1 hour ago, blandy said: I don’t think it’s related, really. The spoons workers had done their work, served the pints and food and Spoons had received customer cash for that. But spoons man said , effectively, I’m banking the money and I’m not paying you for work you’ve already done, until the government gives me some money as well. Meanwhile the workers had no wages to pay for food and rent etc. The bloke’s an utter word removed. I don't think the bit in bold is right. https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/business-consumer/wetherspoons-boss-tim-martin-pay-21747229 Quote He said the group will pay employees for all work done until the pubs last opened, but will not make any further payments to staff until the Government fulfils its promise to cover 80% of the wages of workers affected by the Covid-19 shutdown. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 24, 2020 Moderator Share Posted June 24, 2020 11 minutes ago, KentVillan said: I don't think the bit in bold is right. https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/business-consumer/wetherspoons-boss-tim-martin-pay-21747229 Fair enough. Thank you. So just his suppliers he stopped paying for goods they’d delivered then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 1 hour ago, blandy said: I don’t think it’s related, really. The spoons workers had done their work, served the pints and food and Spoons had received customer cash for that. But spoons man said , effectively, I’m banking the money and I’m not paying you for work you’ve already done, until the government gives me some money as well. Meanwhile the workers had no wages to pay for food and rent etc. The bloke’s an utter word removed. It’s a nice story but it’s not what happened .... the video is quite clear that people will be paid for the work they have done up to 22nd March , so your statement in the absence of any contradictory evidence is not true( happy to be shown otherwise ) ...he like many businesses said he would pay furlough once he’d been paid , this is where people misunderstand the furlough scheme , it was about keeping a business afloat so that jobs were protected long term ... he may still be a word removed of course .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 5 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: he like many businesses said he would pay furlough once he’d been paid I regard that as a problem unless it would necessarily have caused insurmountable cash flow issues for the business(es). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 24, 2020 Moderator Share Posted June 24, 2020 4 minutes ago, snowychap said: I regard that as a problem unless it would necessarily have caused insurmountable cash flow issues for the business(es). Indeed. And he changed his stance after the uproar, so he and his company clearly could afford it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 So do I take that there is no proof of him refusing to pay staff then ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 (edited) 24 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: So do I take that there is no proof of him refusing to pay staff then ? I have no idea. Is that important? Do you mean 'ever'? For a short period? Until the government have already given them the money? Edited June 24, 2020 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 1 minute ago, snowychap said: I have no idea. Is that important? In the context of someone calling him an utter word removed on the back of not paying staff money they had earned , then yes I’d say it was important , for the sake of this particular discussion 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 1 hour ago, tonyh29 said: In the context of someone calling him an utter word removed on the back of not paying staff money they had earned , then yes I’d say it was important , for the sake of this particular discussion Ha ha. Brilliant. Quote Do you mean 'ever'? For a short period? Until the government have already given them the money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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