maqroll Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 London has overtaken NYC in homicides recently. What explains this surge in violence? Is it any safer in Birmingham? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) 45 minutes ago, maqroll said: What explains this surge in violence? Has there been a 'surge' in violence? Are we not looking at two of the safest cities in the world? Edited April 6, 2018 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daweii Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 1 hour ago, maqroll said: London has overtaken NYC in homicides recently. What explains this surge in violence? Is it any safer in Birmingham? With Birmingham it's tricky as stuff doesn't seem to be reported here as frequently. In 2016 it was reported that there were 12 murders in 12 months, but since then I have heard very little. Most of the crime in Birmingham is petty shit like shoplifting, or street crime and stuff that has a victim, but the victim lives to tell the tale. I don't know what is happening in London. I have a feeling that much of it is likely gang related, I don't think most of the people killed were innocent people, but maybe I'm wrong there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted April 6, 2018 Author Share Posted April 6, 2018 4 hours ago, snowychap said: Has there been a 'surge' in violence? Are we not looking at two of the safest cities in the world? 6 stabbings in 90 minutes across London yesterday apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 BBC Reality Check Quote Claim: London has overtaken New York for murders for the first time in modern history after a surge in knife crime across the capital. Verdict: A selective use of statistics from the start of 2018 appears to bear this out - but the reality is that New York still appears to be more violent than London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) London is horrendous nowdays its not safe as it use to be. the sad thing is its youth on youth crime. Stop and search being stopped and the cuts dont help either Edited April 6, 2018 by Demitri_C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ml1dch Posted April 6, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 6, 2018 13 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: ... the cuts dont help either That's definitely the big problem with knife crime. (sorry) 5 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Awol Posted April 6, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 6, 2018 55 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: London is horrendous nowdays its not safe as it use to be. the sad thing is its youth on youth crime. Stop and search being stopped and the cuts dont help either Have a few mates in the Met & they say exactly the same, cuts in police numbers & stop & search being curtailed are the two biggest factors, plus the amount of resources going into non-discretionary counter-terrorism activity. I get the argument about racial profiling with stop and search, but when the facts apparently show it’s primarily young black men killing and being killed, you’ve got to ask what’s worse, feeling victimized or being a victim? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Stop and search won't solve the problem, but it was an important and effective tool that could be effectively deployed, it has to be brought back in the capital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 24 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said: Stop and search won't solve the problem, but it was an important and effective tool that could be effectively deployed, it has to be brought back in the capital. I agree it wont solve all the problems but its a start. i think they need to start introducing programmes to youngsters to show them the impact of the consequences of murdering someone. like punishing kids and making them see what life like is in prison. 32 minutes ago, Awol said: Have a few mates in the Met & they say exactly the same, cuts in police numbers & stop & search being curtailed are the two biggest factors, plus the amount of resources going into non-discretionary counter-terrorism activity. I get the argument about racial profiling with stop and search, but when the facts apparently show it’s primarily young black men killing and being killed, you’ve got to ask what’s worse, feeling victimized or being a victim? Yes and they are restricted by doing certain things. For example if someone is on a mo-ped or bike the police are encouraged not to chase them in case something happens to that person and a complaint goes against the police. completely ridiculous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post LakotaDakota Posted April 6, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 6, 2018 Rather unfortunate timing from David Lammy talking about the lack of police on the street. 4 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Well we all know what root cause is but no one is willing to do anything about it. Certainly not the current government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 5 hours ago, maqroll said: 6 stabbings in 90 minutes across London yesterday apparently. That doesn't equate to a 'surge in violence', though. What we can be sure of is that pretty much every single violent incident which helps to fuel these headlines is going to get reported on the national (and international) news. And pretty much none of it will be reported in context. 2 hours ago, Dr_Pangloss said: Stop and search won't solve the problem, but it was an important and effective tool that could be effectively deployed, it has to be brought back in the capital. Was it effective? Is there any data to back that up? Was there little or no knife crime in 2009/10/11 when there were, apparently, about three times as many annual stop and searches than now according to the graph on the link that @Seat68 gave above? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, snowychap said: That doesn't equate to a 'surge in violence', though. What we can be sure of is that pretty much every single violent incident which helps to fuel these headlines is going to get reported on the national (and international) news. And pretty much none of it will be reported in context. Was it effective? Is there any data to back that up? Was there little or no knife crime in 2009/10/11 when there were, apparently, about three times as many annual stop and searches than now according to the graph on the link that @Seat68 gave above? I've seen a report suggesting that it can work in known 'crime hotspots' (i.e. when it's highly targeted), it's very short term but if it potentially saves lives then it's worth it/ Edited April 6, 2018 by Dr_Pangloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 2 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said: I've seen a report suggesting that it can work in known 'crime hotspots' (i.e. when it's highly targeted), it's very short term but if it potentially saves lives then it's worth it/ So there's a suggestion that it can work in very specific circumstances? That doesn't sound like the basis on which to return to previous levels of capital-wide stop and searches (not saying that you were suggesting this but that sounds like what people more generally are talking about). It sounds like the crux of the matter is more intelligent policing (which would undoubtedly need better funding). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Just now, snowychap said: So there's a suggestion that it can work in very specific circumstances? That doesn't sound like the basis on which to return to previous levels of capital-wide stop and searches (not saying that you were suggesting this but that sounds like what people more generally are talking about). It sounds like the crux of the matter is more intelligent policing (which would undoubtedly need better funding). It's a basis to deploy it tactically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 The public and indeed the people in power are always concerned with short term wins. It may fix things for a few months or a year but issues will still arise. We need give youth some hope in this society. Currently there is none. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, omariqy said: The public and indeed the people in power are always concerned with short term wins. It may fix things for a few months or a year but issues will still arise. We need give youth some hope in this society. Currently there is none. Yes but short term actions can save lives and I think we can all agree that's very important, just as solving the 'long' term issues. They aren't mutually exclusive. Edited April 6, 2018 by Dr_Pangloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, Dr_Pangloss said: It's a basis to deploy it tactically. Not a very convincing one and even if so, would it be deployed 'tactically'? And is that what is being called for because it doesn't sound like it. Edited April 7, 2018 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 40 minutes ago, omariqy said: Well we all know what root cause is but no one is willing to do anything about it. Certainly not the current government. Not many stabbings in Amsterdam in the last decade or so yet you can buy drugs everywhere. They don't understand the problem and will never grasp the solution even if you smashed their face into it. It will end up like Baltimore in the US. It's a bit like Grenfell, if they or their family is not burning or bleeding, they are not that bothered I suspect. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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