Genie Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 1 minute ago, ciggiesnbeer said: lol. nah life long lefty who opposed and opposes Brexit with a passion. I am just a realpolitik guy. Its all about power. The UK is in a very strong position. The UK is weaker outside of the EU, there surely is no doubt about that is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 1 minute ago, Genie said: The UK is weaker outside of the EU, there surely is no doubt about that is there? Politically yeah I agree, I am a pro EU guy. I naturally think that we would be much stronger within the EU. But thats my belief. So far the UK seems to be having as much clout now as before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Just now, ciggiesnbeer said: Politically yeah I agree, I am a pro EU guy. I naturally think that we would be much stronger within the EU. But thats my belief. So far the UK seems to be having as much clout now as before. We’re talking about the economy though, are you suggesting the UK is outperforming the scenario of if we’d remained? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 23, 2022 Moderator Share Posted February 23, 2022 1 minute ago, ciggiesnbeer said: So far the UK seems to be having as much clout now as before. Another not sure if serious Have you seen Boris much with the likes of Macron, Sholtz, Biden in relation to Ukraine, they've almost cut him out completely. Anything him and Truss are doing and saying is for a domestic audience, hell even Putin said Britain couldn't be trusted to keep their word We've got less clout than Sticky Vicky 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted February 23, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, bickster said: We've got less clout than Sticky Vicky So we'll be ok when the projectiles need to fly? Edited February 23, 2022 by sidcow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 2 minutes ago, Genie said: We’re talking about the economy though, are you suggesting the UK is outperforming the scenario of if we’d remained? Nope. I think we are aligned. I think we would have been even stronger within the EU. But we are strong post Brexit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 23, 2022 Moderator Share Posted February 23, 2022 Just now, sidcow said: So we'll be ok when the projectiles need to fly? as long as Russians retreat from ping pong balls, we're onto a winner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 2 minutes ago, bickster said: Another not sure if serious Have you seen Boris much with the likes of Macron, Sholtz, Biden in relation to Ukraine, they've almost cut him out completely. Anything him and Truss are doing and saying is for a domestic audience, hell even Putin said Britain couldn't be trusted to keep their word We've got less clout than Sticky Vicky I dont see that at all. I cant stand Boris. I see our allies and Labour rallying around Boris in the time of crisis. As it should be. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 23, 2022 Moderator Share Posted February 23, 2022 Just now, ciggiesnbeer said: I dont see that at all. I cant stand Boris. I see our allies and Labour rallying around Boris in the time of crisis. As it should be. Wow, I'm genuinely astounded by that. It's just that far removed from reality 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, bickster said: Wow, I'm genuinely astounded by that. It's just that far removed from reality Different perspectives. its all good. PM's questions seeme to be Starmer saying Labour supported Johnson fully in standing up to Putin and in fact urged even stronger action. Providing the government with the political back up to go further. Thats what the loyal opposition should do. Edited February 23, 2022 by ciggiesnbeer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 23, 2022 Moderator Share Posted February 23, 2022 Just now, ciggiesnbeer said: Different perspectives. its all good. PM's questions seem to be Starmer saying Labour supported Johnson fully in standing up to Putin and in fact urged even stronger action. Providing the government with the political back up to go further. Thats what the loyal opposition should do. Not seen PMQs but Labour is criticising the governmnet not supporting them, it's telling them they haven't gone far enough and that they are compromised by Russian money. They aren't offering them support, they are telling them they've willfully fallen short of the mark 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 6 minutes ago, bickster said: Not seen PMQs but Labour is criticising the governmnet not supporting them, it's telling them they haven't gone far enough and that they are compromised by Russian money. They aren't offering them support, they are telling them they've willfully fallen short of the mark Boris was hinting at it being a collective decision between allies to start soft and then ramp it up as a unit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted February 23, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2022 20 minutes ago, bickster said: as long as Russians retreat from ping pong balls, we're onto a winner They don't like it up em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted February 23, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2022 6 minutes ago, Genie said: Boris was hinting at it being a collective decision between allies to start soft and then ramp it up as a unit. The Germans have pretty much said exactly the same. They're holding back more Sanctions for any further escalations. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, bickster said: Another not sure if serious Have you seen Boris much with the likes of Macron, Sholtz, Biden in relation to Ukraine, they've almost cut him out completely. Anything him and Truss are doing and saying is for a domestic audience, hell even Putin said Britain couldn't be trusted to keep their word We've got less clout than Sticky Vicky I’d take a stab and say Macron and Sholtz are linked by the Minsk protocol which was a Russian , Ukrainian , OCSE initiative with France and Germany as the designated mediators from the EU side …you might just as well criticise Salah for not scoring enough goals this season for Villa when comparing the U.K. in this situation. On Monday Biden and Johnson held calls , are we to suggest Germany and France have no influence because they weren’t on this phone call ? I appreciate your hatred of Tories but you’re clearly not watching the news if you think the U.K. is behind Vicky in world influence , unless I missed Vicky’s speech at the Munich Security Conference and her meetings with world leaders Edited February 23, 2022 by tonyh29 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 51 minutes ago, ciggiesnbeer said: I dont see that at all. I cant stand Boris. I see our allies and Labour rallying around Boris in the time of crisis. As it should be. This is hilarious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted February 23, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2022 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 6 minutes ago, choffer said: I’ve not seen acting that bad since Harry Kane winning his penalty after Cash tried to tackle him 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Part of me hopes Putin gives it another two or three weeks so Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, France, UK, the US and so on can prop up the Ukrainian army to the point where it can bloody Putin’s nose to a point where every step forward will cost him soldiers and popular support. Like Afghanistan, a bogged down invasion in Ukraine can be an instigator for change in Russia. Obviously there’ll be masses of dead soldiers and civilians, but with Putin I think he only understands hard power. Bog him down, sanction them and make Ukraine a quagmire. He’s not going to understand anything else. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted February 23, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2022 2 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: I’ve not seen acting that bad since Harry Kane winning his penalty after Cash tried to tackle him Glasshouses 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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