The Chairman Mao resembling, Monarchy hating, threat to Britain, Labour Party thread

[bickster]

18 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

The "funny" thing about ULEZ, specifically the expansion in London, is that it's a Conservative national government policy, that they're forcing Labour local politicians to implement, then having the local tory candidates bang the war drums about how disgraceful it is, and then ignorant voters lap it up and start calling Khan a dickhead for doing it.

It isn't quite that simple, it's the way it's being implemented. I may have said this before (apologies if I have)

Two examples of implementation from the North West.

Greater Manchester - The whole of Greater Manchester will be one big congestion charging zone, so you use your car, you get charged. That sounds terrible when you say it except it's actually much better than....

Merseyside: Each individual borough will decide their own congestion charging policy and therefore there will be a confusing mess of multiple charges potentially for a single journey. One council is going to set three small zones for charging based on the pollution levels, sounds almost reasonable until you realise that the three zones are all by the Freeport, the Freeport where all the big f*** off container ships dock but private vehicles will not be expected to pay, just commercial vehicles including buses and taxis, so that ends up being a tax on people using public transport, people not drinking and driving, people who don't own cars (that's the poor in a lot of cases). I don't even know what the other Boroughs are doing but if I want to take a journey from Sefton to the Wirral, it entirely possible that not only will I have to pay a toll to go through the tunnel but also three separate congestion charges for a ten mile journey. Now given I already know the three zones, I could make a 5 or so mile detour and avoid the Sefton charges, the charge is literally encouraging me to drive further. The whole thing is insanity

So yes, it's a Tory National Government Policy but the implementation is down to each authority and quite frankly some of those local authorities are run by people with the intellectual capacity of a slug

[Jareth]

I understand the strategy that the Labour leadership is pursuing, but to tell Khan to reflect on his ULEZ policy, which Khan himself has so robustly and rightly defended - is galling. But so it must be eh? 

[Demitri_C]

11 hours ago, bickster said:

Isn't the ULEZ aspect of the local anger the bit the media have latched onto but the real issue is the LTNs ?

Its abit of both bicks to be honest 

LTNs are a massive problem as ive stated years ago ( they dont prevent pollution just cause .more traffic and actually increase pollution because of that)

As fos ULEZ blame khan. This guys sabotaging labours bid for government. As most people hate him. He ignores us londoners and does what he wants. Tell us all to get newer cars and pay ulez charges while the word removed gets driven in a 4x4 vehicle which is terrible for the environment 

Livingstone was a much better mayor than this absolute cretin

Edited July 21, 2023 by Demitri_C

[Demitri_C]

9 hours ago, Davkaus said:

The "funny" thing about ULEZ, specifically the expansion in London, is that it's a Conservative national government policy, that they're forcing Labour local politicians to implement, then having the local tory candidates bang the war drums about how disgraceful it is, and then ignorant voters lap it up and start calling Khan a dickhead for doing it.

spoken like a proper labour supporter. Do you never hold labour accountable for anything? If khan was a proper labour man and not a self imposed and ill use your word dickhead. He would have said no chance ill do thia to londoners who have a cost of loving crisis, ive put TFL prices up, allowed the councils to implement maximum increases aftes the government gave the go ahead. He sees alot of poverty in london yet wants to **** us over like the tories. Hw is constantly defwndibg the ULEZ and refuses to meet local groups who oppose it.

Thats not to mention the poor businesses losing money because of this ULEZ.

khan went ahead with it and the councils taking legal action against ulez is tory councils 

Burnham is more of a mayor you can be happy to be called your mayor than this dickhead

Edited July 21, 2023 by Demitri_C

[bickster]

3 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

If khan was a proper labour man and not a self imposed and ill use your word dickhead. He would have said no chance ill do thia to londoners who have a cost of loving crisis, ive put TFL prices up, allowed the councils to implement maximum increases aftes the government gave the go ahead. He sees alot of poverty in london yet wants to **** us over like the tories.

He was selected by the Labour Party as their candidate for Mayor, he was elected by the people of London to that position, he is not self-imposed.

He put TFL prices up because he was forced to by the government as TFL needed money due to the loss of income from the pandemic and they made it a condition of bailing TFL out. London still has the best and cheapest public transport system in the country.

As far as I’m aware it’s the government not the Mayor of London that approves council tax rises (I'm prepared to be wrong in that London may be different to the rest of the country) and that’s the same government that has forced all local councils to cut services year on year for over a decade

Its The Tories that have done that to London, not Khan, you really are aiming your anger on those grounds in absolutely the wrong direction

[bickster]

15 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Burnham is more of a mayor you can be happy to be called your mayor than this dickhead

Like I posted above. Burnham's plan is to turn the whole of Greater Manchester into one massive ULEZ. Every day you use your car, you'll have to pay, no matter where you are in the Greater Manchester area

[markavfc40]

18 minutes ago, bickster said:

 

As far as I’m aware it’s the government not the Mayor of London that approves council tax rises (I'm prepared to be wrong in that London may be different to the rest of the country) and that’s the same government that has forced all local councils to cut services year on year for over a decade

I think like all authorities the government say there is a maximum amount they can raise council tax by. 

Since 2010 local authorities have had no choice but to raise council tax though to try to make up for a fraction of the huge cuts to local government funding from the government. In London specifically the cuts to the Police budget have had a massive impact with real terms cuts of over 800 million pound a year to the Met. To try to fill some of that gap they have used money from council tax increases. This is replicated in the fire brigade  and transport.

The trouble is you have short sighted people who blame the local authority for the failings of government. 

[Jareth]

Action against Climate change is a wonderful idea, trouble is when it affects people’s lives it becomes undesirable. Fact is we should be going harder and faster - and I’m not even an eco thinker. It’s a pity Labours mayors are bold enough to call it out whilst labours leader cowers in his shell. What would Rupert think after all. 

[Davkaus]

9 hours ago, Demitri_C said:

spoken like a proper labour supporter. Do you never hold labour accountable for anything?

Bicks dealt with the substance of this post, but on the personal stuff, plenty of things. I'm not a "Labour supporter", they rarely get my vote, and my posts about them, particularly under Starmer's leadership are usually lukewarm at best.

 

[bobzy]

9 hours ago, Demitri_C said:

spoken like a proper labour supporter. Do you never hold labour accountable for anything? If khan was a proper labour man and not a self imposed and ill use your word dickhead. He would have said no chance ill do thia to londoners who have a cost of loving crisis, ive put TFL prices up, allowed the councils to implement maximum increases aftes the government gave the go ahead. He sees alot of poverty in london yet wants to **** us over like the tories. Hw is constantly defwndibg the ULEZ and refuses to meet local groups who oppose it.

Thats not to mention the poor businesses losing money because of this ULEZ.

khan went ahead with it and the councils taking legal action against ulez is tory councils 

Burnham is more of a mayor you can be happy to be called your mayor than this dickhead

Tories have played you pretty well dem.  And I imagine a lot of other people too.

 

 

(Edit:  And before I get labelled a Labour supporter, I vote Green)
(Edit edit:  Although that still makes me a woke leftie )

Edited July 22, 2023 by bobzy

[Jareth]

A Labour government in wales cancelled the M4 relief Road, it was truly annoying but they were right. They have the fortunate fact that the electorate hate the ducking tories. 

[picicata]

13 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Action against Climate change is a wonderful idea, trouble is when it affects people’s lives it becomes undesirable. Fact is we should be going harder and faster - and I’m not even an eco thinker. It’s a pity Labours mayors are bold enough to call it out whilst labours leader cowers in his shell. What would Rupert think after all. 

Well isn't that the truth. For all the issues surrounding the implementation of Ulez the reality is that only with schemes like this that people make necessary changes to their habits. The issue is who is most affected and how to negate the worst problems caused. 

The Tories will attack the Labour Mayor's on the issue because they know it's a vote winner but in reality they know, should they win the next mayor election, that they will continue down the same road.

[Demitri_C]

2 hours ago, bobzy said:

Tories have played you pretty well dem.  And I imagine a lot of other people too.

 

 

(Edit:  And before I get labelled a Labour supporter, I vote Green)
(Edit edit:  Although that still makes me a woke leftie )

Im not a tory fan 

And labour have played you  very well also bob

[Demitri_C]

2 hours ago, Davkaus said:

Bicks dealt with the substance of this post, but on the personal stuff, plenty of things. I'm not a "Labour supporter", they rarely get my vote, and my posts about them, particularly under Starmer's leadership are usually lukewarm at best.

 

Thanks for clarifying your position but you never seem to criticise them? Doesnt seem very balanced to me just my opinion

[Demitri_C]

11 hours ago, bickster said:

Like I posted above. Burnham's plan is to turn the whole of Greater Manchester into one massive ULEZ. Every day you use your car, you'll have to pay, no matter where you are in the Greater Manchester area

Thanks.Wow i didnt know that. So basically the same as what khan wants to do.  Lovely thoughts for single parents 

Edited July 22, 2023 by Demitri_C

[bobzy]

9 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Im not a tory fan 

And labour have played you  very well also bob

They aren’t in charge pal!

[Demitri_C]

1 minute ago, bobzy said:

They aren’t in charge pal!

I bet they will still get the blame when labour take control still and they will never be held accountable for poor policies or unpopularthings s they do. 

You in favour in burnhams plan to turn manchester into a ulez zone?

[bobzy]

34 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

I bet they will still get the blame when labour take control still and they will never be held accountable for poor policies or unpopularthings s they do. 

You in favour in burnhams plan to turn manchester into a ulez zone?

I don’t know enough about Ulez zones (not impacted me yet), but I’m generally in favour of getting people not to use their cars. So maybe?

[ml1dch]

Says quite a lot that the narrative on the day of two of the worst by-election defeats in history for the Tories is "this shows we are still competitive and gives us a good footing for the next election", while Labour narrowly not taking a seat they've never won leads to hand-wringing introspection and self-doubt.

[blandy]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

Thanks.Wow i didnt know that. So basically the same as what khan wants to do.  Lovely thoughts for single parents 

The Government has made it compulsory, by law, for Cities to reduce air pollution. They did that because they were forced to by the courts. Air pollution is causing huge health problems and early deaths for people living in cities and the Government was forced to act to get this major problem down. It's why diesels cars and older more polluting cars and buses and stuff are more heavily taxed and going out of favour - they kill people and make people ill.

There's basically no one things killing people and making people ill, when it is avoidable is a good idea. Yes the Tory Government was forced into acting by the EU, as well as UK legal stuff, but it's a good thing.

The next question, is that given they are legally required to reduce air pollution to safe levels, how do you do it? Clearly reducing the number of polluting vehicles (as well as other sources of pollution like wood fires and coal fires and etc. is a key part of that.

So Khan has to do it, Burnham, same for Liverpool, Brum, Bristol ...etc.

The next thing is how do they manage to a) reduce the number of polluting vehicles while also providing an alternative means for people to travel, so that particularly those with not much money aren't shafted. And while at the same time the Cities are deprived of resources by the Central tory government.

In central london, there's the best public transport system in the UK - so that's an easy win for Khan. But outside central London it's harder. Yes Manchester has trams, but the network is not that extensive, everywhere else public transport is mostly some small (relatively) tram/rail connections plus diesel buses - which doesn't help, either.

The various mayors are basically stuffed - they legally have to reduce traffic from polluting cars and vans, but they're not given (enough) funding to allow people to trade in their dirty bangers for newer clean cars and they're not given enough money to improve the rail and tram and (clean) bus networks.

That's why people don't like ULEZ and they blame the (Labour) city mayors. But it's central Tory government who should be getting most of the flak for it. It's the lack of coherent joined up, integrated planning and thinking that's to blame, not Khan, or Burnham or whoever who are trying to make the best of a difficult situation, to stop people dying and getting sick.