The Tim Sherwood Thread

[El-Reacho]

We need fans to be on his side today, no matter what.

Why would we want to support a manager that 85% of us cannot wait to be sacked. As I have said previous, I will never wish us to lose, but if it is just one game and Sherwood's reign comes to a conclusion, I am willing to sacrifice the points.

If that's the case you must have resigned us to relegation already then. Have you seen our fixture list over the next few weeks? If we are to stay up with or without Sherwood this game is must win IMHO.

[Guest av1]

The most important thing today is 3 points.

But gaining those, at home to a Swansea side on a terrible run of form should not paper over any cracks or indeed provide a stay of execution for the Manager.

[El-Reacho]

The most important thing today is 3 points.

But gaining those, at home to a Swansea side on a terrible run of form should not paper over any cracks or indeed provide a stay of execution for the Manager.

Agreed but the next few weeks will expose those cracks without any doubt. I'd take three points today and Sherwood staying. The timing of the new manager coming is crucial. Moyes coming in for the Everton game would be nice. A new manager taking over for Man City and Spurs would be too difficult to get any bounce I reckon. Could be flat again before Christmas.

[VillaCas]

                  As for Reilly & Almstadt, i have seen no criticism of them directly.....I have seen some articles questioning their credentials for buying players and I have seen some comments on the manager being uncomfortable with the arrangement.....most decent managers would/will be uncomfortable with the arrangement. Your percentages are interesting, what are they based on?

A couple of things here, firstly (and I know that you are a stickler for this type of thing) we have no idea of the exact system for bringing players into the club - how much of the influence is from scouts (football people)?, how much is from stats and data (if any)?, how much from Reilly & Almstadt beyond the financial side?, how much from the Manager?.  The PL draws players from a global market and very few, if any, managers would have the time and knowledge to scout worldwide - it would be an impossible task. Consequently, almost every club employs a system where a number of people in the club have a hand in the recruitment process.  Without it you cant develop an ongoing strategy (not as ours is at all successful at the moment) and each new manager heralds a whole new set of players and the dreaded rebuilding

This brings me to my second point - you state that decent managers would be uncomfortable with this type of arrangement.  I would argue that a decent manager would make sure that they are right at the centre of the process and that there voice is clearly heard.  What would Mourinho do, What would SAF do or on a different scale could you imagine Alladyce, or Pulis, or Moyes sitting quietly on the sidelines whilst crucial decisions are being made around them

Your status and ability as a manager dictates how much influenece you have in the the process - If Sherwood doesnt feel that he has enough there is only one person to blame

                    The managers you mention to my mind, wouldn't be comfortable with a situation where a committee buys players for them.....whether it happens and they put up with it I don't know.

                     I recognise the changing face of football and its methods and it could well be that this is the way and the managers you mention and I understand as good examples, may be dinasuars.

                     You mention influence, this is Sherwoods first real job and this season he has one win to his credit in the league hardly a prerequisite for putting your head above the parapet or forcing your opinion.....Results make so much difference to everyone......when you win things get overlooked, when you lose its microscope time.

                       Tim Sherwood is a different Tim Sherwood from the one that came in in Feb.....thats what losses do to you, it drains everybody.....I seen it in Martinez at Wigan compared to now.

I would imagine that every premier league club has a committee of sorts - a group of people who have a say in transfers. What we don't know is exactly how that works at Villa and how much influence each element has

This will get even more prevelant as we go forward with wages and transfers getting more and more expensive and clubs wanting to maintain a consistent approach rather than lurch from one playing style and one set of players under one manager and a different style and set of players under the next

Sherwoods fall from grace has happened since the season began - when transfers were being decided in the summer his stock was still high and so if he didn't exert sufficient influence then that is his own fault

To be honest if you don't feel Sherwood is the type of man to put his head above the parapet or make his voice known within Villa Park then I'm struggling to understand how you can reconcile that with your view that he is still the man to take us forward.  If he doen't like the heat etc etc....

[foreveryoung]

We need fans to be on his side today, no matter what.

Why would we want to support a manager that 85% of us cannot wait to be sacked. As I have said previous, I will never wish us to lose, but if it is just one game and Sherwood's reign comes to a conclusion, I am willing to sacrifice the points.

If that's the case you must have resigned us to relegation already then. Have you seen our fixture list over the next few weeks? If we are to stay up with or without Sherwood this game is must win IMHO.

We are not Guaranteed relegation if we lose to swansea. The odds are certainly on though, if we decide to keep Sherwood.

I don't think I have critisised Sherwood from a personal point of view on here (maybe). But What I am beginging to believe is, its not his man management, that seems to be ok, I think he still has the dressing room. I think the problem is his coaching and style. To me its seriously flawed and we cannot continue with Sherwood coaching a squad which is yet to show signs of improvement from the begining of the season.

[VillaCas]

This brings me to my second point - you state that decent managers would be uncomfortable with this type of arrangement.  I would argue that a decent manager would make sure that they are right at the centre of the process and that there voice is clearly heard.  What would Mourinho do, What would SAF do or on a different scale could you imagine Alladyce, or Pulis, or Moyes sitting quietly on the sidelines whilst crucial decisions are being made around them

Your status and ability as a manager dictates how much influenece you have in the the process - If Sherwood doesnt feel that he has enough there is only one person to blame

 

Unless I have missed something Sherwood hasn't complained about the transfer policy at the club has he? Pete Colley asked him a direct question regarding incoming transfers yesterday and if they were all his recommendations and he gave a straight answer that he put some recommendations forward to the committee, they put some names forward and the committee went away and saw what was feasible and he was happy with what they came back with.

Maybe I am not scrutinizing what he says hard enough or maybe I am not reading quote less crap printed in the rags and believing it or maybe I just don't despise Sherwood enough so am not vicious enough in attacking him on every tiny irrelevant detail. The bottom line is though I fail to see what he has said wrong regarding incoming transfers. In fact I fail to see what he has said wrong on most things full stop.I continually hear him saying he is responsible for results and he said yesterday if he gets the sack after today's game he will be ultimately at fault for that. I don't know what some want from the guy in terms of what he says but it is safe to say some have reached new lows this week in criticizing the guy for having the audacity and arrogance to say he thinks we will win at home tomorrow against a side in the bottom 6. I mean some of us need to get a grip ffs.

Lets concentrate on what matters and that is backing the team today to get three vital points, especially those of us who are going. It is wasted energy and planting further negativity in the minds of supporters to continually bleat on like old washer women by twisting every thing the manger says just so you can beat him a little harder.

Results have been crap this season. Performances little better. If that continues today that is the reason he will get the sack and rightly so. He is here for now though and for 90 minutes at VP today him and his players get my full backing and I hope that is the case for every other fan as we have a part to play in getting the three points. If that results in the manager keeping his job and puts some supporters noses out of place by doing so then so be it. Points on the board matter way more.

                  Brilliant as always Mark, well put and apt.

                   ......must go, off to to mecca.

To be clear TRO, my post was in response to yours which stated that any decent manager would be unhappy with a committee system. Nowhere did I suggest that Sherwood had complained directly

However, I personally beleive that the whole debate around transfer committees and who was responsible for which signings has eminated from the Sherwood camp

I agree that much of what Sherwood says in over analysed and I'm prepared to cut him a lot of slack for off the cuff comments at a press conference. I don't see too much wrong with saying "we will win" for example but Mark may think that the transfer saga is a "tiny irrelevant detail" but I don't - I think its fundamental to the situation and  undermines the confidence of players and I think it is a further example of Teflon Tim's "no my fault guv" approach

 

 

[dudevillaisnice]

Let's see if he takes responsibility for the result at 5pm if it isn't the right one. One suggests he won't based on past experience.

[VillaCas]

This brings me to my second point - you state that decent managers would be uncomfortable with this type of arrangement.  I would argue that a decent manager would make sure that they are right at the centre of the process and that there voice is clearly heard.  What would Mourinho do, What would SAF do or on a different scale could you imagine Alladyce, or Pulis, or Moyes sitting quietly on the sidelines whilst crucial decisions are being made around them

Your status and ability as a manager dictates how much influenece you have in the the process - If Sherwood doesnt feel that he has enough there is only one person to blame

 

Unless I have missed something Sherwood hasn't complained about the transfer policy at the club has he? Pete Colley asked him a direct question regarding incoming transfers yesterday and if they were all his recommendations and he gave a straight answer that he put some recommendations forward to the committee, they put some names forward and the committee went away and saw what was feasible and he was happy with what they came back with.

Maybe I am not scrutinizing what he says hard enough or maybe I am not reading quote less crap printed in the rags and believing it or maybe I just don't despise Sherwood enough so am not vicious enough in attacking him on every tiny irrelevant detail. The bottom line is though I fail to see what he has said wrong regarding incoming transfers. In fact I fail to see what he has said wrong on most things full stop.I continually hear him saying he is responsible for results and he said yesterday if he gets the sack after today's game he will be ultimately at fault for that. I don't know what some want from the guy in terms of what he says but it is safe to say some have reached new lows this week in criticizing the guy for having the audacity and arrogance to say he thinks we will win at home tomorrow against a side in the bottom 6. I mean some of us need to get a grip ffs.

Lets concentrate on what matters and that is backing the team today to get three vital points, especially those of us who are going. It is wasted energy and planting further negativity in the minds of supporters to continually bleat on like old washer women by twisting every thing the manger says just so you can beat him a little harder.

Results have been crap this season. Performances little better. If that continues today that is the reason he will get the sack and rightly so. He is here for now though and for 90 minutes at VP today him and his players get my full backing and I hope that is the case for every other fan as we have a part to play in getting the three points. If that results in the manager keeping his job and puts some supporters noses out of place by doing so then so be it. Points on the board matter way more.

Spot on. 

This thread in recent weeks has made me ashamed to be a fan. I get that people are disappointed by our current plight and I am too, the performances are no way good enough and if he is sacked then fair enough, the most important thing is the survival of the club, not any particular manager or player. The club will always be bigger than individuals. However the vitriol, abuse and mis-truths and wild opinion being spouted as fact here in order to criticise the manager who saved us last year is so extreme it makes me want to give up on the game I grew up loving in the 80's and 90's.

I hope we win today.. not because I want Sherwood to stay but because I want us to get 3 points. That's the most important thing for the club.

 

What element of my post was vitriolic, abusive, or untruthful??? There are elements of opinion (wild or not) in there but if you don't want opinion don't come on a fan forum

Ashamed to be a Villa fan????? Get over yourself

[El-Reacho]

Let's see if he takes responsibility for the result at 5pm if it isn't the right one. One suggests he won't based on past experience.

I didn't ask them to lose that game......

[TrentVilla]

Sherwood has managed 20 points in 22 games.

He has just been taken apart on 5Live by Pat Murphy for the BS he comes out with.

Edited October 24, 2015 by TrentVilla

[bradarmstrong_]

Really hope today is the last time he leads the team.

Every time he talks to the press I find myself shaking my head. Just read his comments about Amavi. Unbelievable. 

[VillaCas]

Sherwood has managed 20 points in 22 games.

4 from the last 33 available

[Xela]

This brings me to my second point - you state that decent managers would be uncomfortable with this type of arrangement.  I would argue that a decent manager would make sure that they are right at the centre of the process and that there voice is clearly heard.  What would Mourinho do, What would SAF do or on a different scale could you imagine Alladyce, or Pulis, or Moyes sitting quietly on the sidelines whilst crucial decisions are being made around them

Your status and ability as a manager dictates how much influenece you have in the the process - If Sherwood doesnt feel that he has enough there is only one person to blame

 

Unless I have missed something Sherwood hasn't complained about the transfer policy at the club has he? Pete Colley asked him a direct question regarding incoming transfers yesterday and if they were all his recommendations and he gave a straight answer that he put some recommendations forward to the committee, they put some names forward and the committee went away and saw what was feasible and he was happy with what they came back with.

Maybe I am not scrutinizing what he says hard enough or maybe I am not reading quote less crap printed in the rags and believing it or maybe I just don't despise Sherwood enough so am not vicious enough in attacking him on every tiny irrelevant detail. The bottom line is though I fail to see what he has said wrong regarding incoming transfers. In fact I fail to see what he has said wrong on most things full stop.I continually hear him saying he is responsible for results and he said yesterday if he gets the sack after today's game he will be ultimately at fault for that. I don't know what some want from the guy in terms of what he says but it is safe to say some have reached new lows this week in criticizing the guy for having the audacity and arrogance to say he thinks we will win at home tomorrow against a side in the bottom 6. I mean some of us need to get a grip ffs.

Lets concentrate on what matters and that is backing the team today to get three vital points, especially those of us who are going. It is wasted energy and planting further negativity in the minds of supporters to continually bleat on like old washer women by twisting every thing the manger says just so you can beat him a little harder.

Results have been crap this season. Performances little better. If that continues today that is the reason he will get the sack and rightly so. He is here for now though and for 90 minutes at VP today him and his players get my full backing and I hope that is the case for every other fan as we have a part to play in getting the three points. If that results in the manager keeping his job and puts some supporters noses out of place by doing so then so be it. Points on the board matter way more.

Spot on. 

This thread in recent weeks has made me ashamed to be a fan. I get that people are disappointed by our current plight and I am too, the performances are no way good enough and if he is sacked then fair enough, the most important thing is the survival of the club, not any particular manager or player. The club will always be bigger than individuals. However the vitriol, abuse and mis-truths and wild opinion being spouted as fact here in order to criticise the manager who saved us last year is so extreme it makes me want to give up on the game I grew up loving in the 80's and 90's.

I hope we win today.. not because I want Sherwood to stay but because I want us to get 3 points. That's the most important thing for the club.

 

What element of my post was vitriolic, abusive, or untruthful??? There are elements of opinion (wild or not) in there but if you don't want opinion don't come on a fan forum

Ashamed to be a Villa fan????? Get over yourself

I wasn't referencing your post, it was a wider point following on from Markavfc40's post. I haven't noticed anything like that in your posts. No need to be so precious. 

[TrentVilla]

Enough of the post on poster and better fan stuff please folks.

[foreveryoung]

Sherwood has managed 20 points in 22 games.

4 from the last 33 available

Sherwood has managed 20 points in 22 games.

4 from the last 33 available

Sorry to fans who say we have a shit squad. But the players are much better than this!

[Dodgyknees]

Sherwood has managed 20 points in 22 games.

He has just been taken apart on 5Live by Pat Murphy for the BS he comes out with.

We need more to come out and show him up to be the idiot he is. What did Murphy say?

[VillaCas]

This brings me to my second point - you state that decent managers would be uncomfortable with this type of arrangement.  I would argue that a decent manager would make sure that they are right at the centre of the process and that there voice is clearly heard.  What would Mourinho do, What would SAF do or on a different scale could you imagine Alladyce, or Pulis, or Moyes sitting quietly on the sidelines whilst crucial decisions are being made around them

Your status and ability as a manager dictates how much influenece you have in the the process - If Sherwood doesnt feel that he has enough there is only one person to blame

 

Unless I have missed something Sherwood hasn't complained about the transfer policy at the club has he? Pete Colley asked him a direct question regarding incoming transfers yesterday and if they were all his recommendations and he gave a straight answer that he put some recommendations forward to the committee, they put some names forward and the committee went away and saw what was feasible and he was happy with what they came back with.

Maybe I am not scrutinizing what he says hard enough or maybe I am not reading quote less crap printed in the rags and believing it or maybe I just don't despise Sherwood enough so am not vicious enough in attacking him on every tiny irrelevant detail. The bottom line is though I fail to see what he has said wrong regarding incoming transfers. In fact I fail to see what he has said wrong on most things full stop.I continually hear him saying he is responsible for results and he said yesterday if he gets the sack after today's game he will be ultimately at fault for that. I don't know what some want from the guy in terms of what he says but it is safe to say some have reached new lows this week in criticizing the guy for having the audacity and arrogance to say he thinks we will win at home tomorrow against a side in the bottom 6. I mean some of us need to get a grip ffs.

Lets concentrate on what matters and that is backing the team today to get three vital points, especially those of us who are going. It is wasted energy and planting further negativity in the minds of supporters to continually bleat on like old washer women by twisting every thing the manger says just so you can beat him a little harder.

Results have been crap this season. Performances little better. If that continues today that is the reason he will get the sack and rightly so. He is here for now though and for 90 minutes at VP today him and his players get my full backing and I hope that is the case for every other fan as we have a part to play in getting the three points. If that results in the manager keeping his job and puts some supporters noses out of place by doing so then so be it. Points on the board matter way more.

Spot on. 

This thread in recent weeks has made me ashamed to be a fan. I get that people are disappointed by our current plight and I am too, the performances are no way good enough and if he is sacked then fair enough, the most important thing is the survival of the club, not any particular manager or player. The club will always be bigger than individuals. However the vitriol, abuse and mis-truths and wild opinion being spouted as fact here in order to criticise the manager who saved us last year is so extreme it makes me want to give up on the game I grew up loving in the 80's and 90's.

I hope we win today.. not because I want Sherwood to stay but because I want us to get 3 points. That's the most important thing for the club.

 

What element of my post was vitriolic, abusive, or untruthful??? There are elements of opinion (wild or not) in there but if you don't want opinion don't come on a fan forum

Ashamed to be a Villa fan????? Get over yourself

I wasn't referencing your post, it was a wider point following on from Markavfc40's post. I haven't noticed anything like that in your posts. No need to be so precious. 

Fair enough - you quoted me at the start of a post about vitriol or abuse

Misunderstanding cleared up

Off to the match - lets hope we win and Sherwood gets sacked

[TrentVilla]

Sherwood has managed 20 points in 22 games.

He has just been taken apart on 5Live by Pat Murphy for the BS he comes out with.

We need more to come out and show him up to be the idiot he is. What did Murphy say?

He basically in a very polite way said Sherwood was great for the press but that everything he said should be taken with a pinch of salt, his words. He then gave a list of example of his hypocrisy, when he has contridicted himself and his general BS.

 

 

[Guest av1]

I think it doesn't help that Tim is such a dislikeable bloke, Not since DOL have I actually disliked any of our Manager's as a person. 

Now I appreciate that liking a Manager for the Man should come a very very long way behind his actual ability as a Manager. But being a dislikeable bloke and also a pretty poor Manager means your always going to struggle to gain respect. And if as many of us believe, he has lost the respect of the players, a home win against a poor Swansea side won't change anything.

Whatever happens today he needs to go.

 

[dudevillaisnice]

Last on the manager from me until after the game. Hope we pick up the three points today and hope he walks away or is sacked straight after. A point really isn't good enough either with the fixtures coming up, sorry. Today should really be his last game regardless of the result.