avfc1982am

Veretout needs to play. It's okay to say he has only looked decent against lower league opposition but the lad has high class pedigree and has proven whether in the premier league or not that he can bang goals in and assist. Leaving him out and giving him cameo appearances is not going to help him settle. Lets be fair here as most are questioning which of the two should play, Westwood has had all his life to settle in English football and how many years at Villa? Has he ever changed a game, or bossed the midfield because I can't genuinely remember? Although Veretout and Westwood are different players I think the former will offer far more to the team as a whole if he plays. It's no disrespect to Westwood either as he is a tidy player but I look at the midfield and our current options and then ask myself, "Who is he better than and and what?". Sanchez and Gana are better DM's, and Westwood for all his passing doesn't penetrate defences, assist or score either. So if we play a 3 in the middle with one DM does he start? If we have 2 holding does he start? Personally I don't think he should. Veretout should be the player with along with Gana that we put our trust in as I think he will give us far more improvement in the team.

I think the bottom line here with Sherwood is that with all the activity in the transfer market this summer and convincing the talent(that's right talent) we have brought in to come and play in the claret and blue he needs to be more accommodating in integrating them into the team. I as most have been pretty chuffed with the majority of the signings as I believe the likes of Richards, Traore, Veretout, Gana, Amavi, Ayew and Gestede are an upgrade on what we already had. If Sherwood doesn't start to at least give game time to Veretout, and Ayew there is a real possibility of him damaging their confidence massively and affecting the squad as a whole- If not already. Whether against lower league teams or not leaving players out after good performances doesn't send the right message to your squad and in the cases of both Veretout and Ayew neither will ever be ready unless they play, it's that simple, and added to the fact that match fitness and peak performance levels will bring out the best in players it's bloody stupid to continually give fragmented game time to players requiring just that. Carles Gil for example has been superb for us for a high percentage of his time since joining the club, and added a dimension that was serverely lacking last season and has continued in the same way this season yet has had to sit out the last 2 games on the bench?! It's incredibly naive to believe he couldn't of added something to out attack last Saturday. Personally I think Sherwood needs to find his nuts and show faith with the players we know are good and those brought in before he f**** it up completely and his managerial career in the process. I was very unsure as to whether he would be right for us but after last season and keeping us up(Although I did say under Lambert our squad was better than the results suggested) he deserved the benefit of the doubt. However I think he is undoing himself with silly decisions especially the subs he is making at times which are baffling if I'm honest. He does though imo deserve time to turn things around however shit that may be for some to take onboard.

Cant agree with that post although nothing against your opinion but I think Gil is the most technically gifted player at the club and on previous performances deserves to be starting at the moment. I think he is a real class act and won't be surprised if one of the top clubs come sniffing for him soon. Definitely in my starting 11 if fit.

1. Surely if his tackles are "last ditch" as you put it he is staying on his feet until the last moment before going to ground or making the challenge/block? 2. Generally when a defender makes a challenge it is more often than not in the final third and the last line of defence before opponents are in on goal. Most tackles are at the last moment as players are taught to stay on their feet as long as possible looking to intercept the ball before going to ground. It's what good defenders do! 3. Richards for all the crap from some about not being a CB, or too rash, or the general not good enough, has been absolutely solid carrying out his duties over the first 5 games at centre half. Okay he isn't McGrath, Laursen or Mellberg but he is a definite upgrade on what we have had the last few years and will get better. A massive plus for me having him and one of our stand out players so far. Out of all the posts I've ever read - I think this is the one that I disagree with the most. For ease, I've numbered the various points. 1. That's not what 'last ditch' tackling is and you know that. 2. No, they don't. Defenders make challenges within their own half and at many different times and it's not often that they'll commit if they are the last line. They have to stay on their feet and stay between the attacker and the goal, creating as much pressure as possible - only making a challenge if an opportunity to do so arises, or better still holding the opposition up until another player can double up and take the ball. 3. He really isn't an upgrade on Vlaar or Okore, a downgrade if anything. At 27, how is he going to make up for one of his biggest problems - his lack of experience in that position? You can't just pull it out of your arse. The thing that is most frustrating is that throughout this time, we've had to suffer Bacuna at RB, when we've got a guy who's a top 6 RB playing at being something he's not. You go on about disagreeing with my comments the most yet partially agree and say something similar?! See the bold above? 1. A last ditch tackle is exactly what it says it is. Making the challenge/tackle at the very last moment in order to stop the opponent from scoring or positioning themselves to. If not what else is it then? You've highlighted it yet said nothing to enlighten us as to your definition of a 'last ditch tackle'. 2. Secondly I didn't mention defenders not making challenges in their own half?! The final third was mentioned in relation to the opponents final third if that is what you was getting at, but if you had read on you may have worked that out. Also if a defender or any player for that instance is the last line of defence at some point if not covered or backed by a team mate there will be a moment more often than not where the attacker will force the defender into committing it's called action and reaction and is inevitable. 3. You mention Richards lack of experience as if he is some sort of one trick pony. Like your the all seeing eye that can see into the future and tell us Micah Richards cannot get better at 27+? You talk nonsense! Like Vlaar was captain fantastic. A good defender yes but definitely had more than a rick or two in him and cost us goals with his rashness at times- definitely not the level of previous CB's. Or Okore bless him, who I do think is a good CB and will get better but lets get this straight. The majority of Richards experience is at RB yet his overall experience in a winning environment with better players at a higher level is far greater than Vlaar or Okore. And on top of that he has done nothing really poor for people to question his position or place in the team. Players as they get older will transition into different positions as they grow, gain strength, slow, mature, or just because their skill set increases or decreases. To say a player needs to pull positional experience out of his arse or if they are being asked to play in a different position to previous they are automatically not good enough shows your own level of experience regarding football needs game time never mind Richards.

Surely if his tackles are "last ditch" as you put it he is staying on his feet until the last moment before going to ground or making the challenge/block? Generally when a defender makes a challenge it is more often than not in the final third and the last line of defence before opponents are in on goal. Most tackles are at the last moment as players are taught to stay on their feet as long as possible looking to intercept the ball before going to ground. It's what good defenders do! Richards for all the crap from some about not being a CB, or too rash, or the general not good enough, has been absolutely solid carrying out his duties over the first 5 games at centre half. Okay he isn't McGrath, Laursen or Mellberg but he is a definite upgrade on what we have had the last few years and will get better. A massive plus for me having him and one of our stand out players so far.

How much of a look have we actually seen? Give the lad a chance. No villa89, it's clear that most of our signings this year are massive flops, and we should sell all of them, bar Amavi, for £1m each just to cut our losses and get them off the wage bill. Lambert out! Everyone out! Whilst your sarcasm is clearcut, I'd bite your hand off for 1m for Ayew.. Good job you're not in charge of negotiations then. Well if I was, Ayew and Gestede wouldnt be at the club, Charlie Austin would be and we'd be a couple of mil better off. Wait, isn't this the Jordan Veretout thread? It's the writing off players after 2 games thread!!

The problem is though DK82 will we ever have our strongest 11 playing? Most teams possibly won't for majority of the season. What we need is for all our players knowing their jobs,giving 110%, for the coaches to give them the right instructions and then make the correct changes when needed. I do think we will be fine also, although I say it so often I wonder if I am carrying out some sort of conscious ritual in order to ease my subconscious. A psychological calming of the mind after the last few years me thinks. F****** Villa!

Yeh.......your giving him time alright! Not got a Danny La Rue!

Lambert didn't recognise though and many managers fail to do in game. Rogers at Liverpool- no plan B, hence he is now walking up the steps before the hanging commences. I think it was MarkAVFC40 that mentioned when Gil came off it should have been for Hutton who should have slotted in at RB with Bacuna in front providing the cover, Veretout on for Grealish or Sinclair and drop to a flat 4-5-1- Or something along those lines. I totally agreed with that as I thought we needed to kill the game with numbers in our half when we went 2-0 up as Leicester were pushing us back. He didn't react to that in the slightest the way he should of which was disappointing imo. Anyway what's done is done but it has put a shit load of pressure on us beating the baggies next sat which I don't think we needed right now.

New original chant formally known as The Kinks 'Follower of Fashion', now named 'Follower of Aston'. They seek him here, they seek him there.... He's just to fast, You best beware, Flying down the wing you know that he is just the best, Cuz he is Aston Villa's Adama Traore..... Oh yes he is....oh yes he is...oh yes he is...oh yes he is, Aston Villa's Adama Traore... Flying down the wing you know that he is just the best, Cuz he is Aston Villa's Adama Traore!!!! I want royalties for this!!

I agree with a lot of this TRO. I do think though that with our manager what I do want to see is a reaction to the changes the opposition makes and a definitive response which leads me to believe he has spotted the problems occurring during games. Whether or not Veretout is ready I would have like to see the changes reflecting the pattern of the game. I was so obvious yesterday that the midfield required the additional back up in the form of another CM and Bacuna needed assistance down our right. I thought the starting line up and formation was spot on and we did play some fantastic football in the first 45min. So he is setting us initially up well, however games are won and lost during the 90 min and if he can't spot danger as it appears we are in for a frustrating time. Still backing him but he needs to shape up just as much as the players imo.

Indeed, if Gana is out busted on the sideline I would like to see Veretout given a chance to prove his worth. I think he has the potential to become a really good player for us and I'm confident he'll want to prove himself at any given opportunity. I hope you're right. So far I'm a little sceptical, but can be easily turned around. Really don't think there is anything to be sceptical about with Veretout. Honestly believe he will be the most all-round midfielder we've had since Milner. Even Richards gave him a mention the other week when asked about Gil. Richards also spoke of his admiration for new boy Jordan Veretout. Veretout impressed in the 5-3 win over Notts County - and Richards believes he's a top player. He added: "Jordan has a lot of energy and he is a one-touch, two-touch player. "He is very technical. He trains very hard too. "I was happy with the way Jordan played the other night against Notts County and it was great for him to get some more minutes in English football because he is still adapting."

Which one? The 4-3-3, the 4-5-1 or the 4-4-2? Rest assured we will use several formations this season and when he adapts to his team mates and the pace he will be fine. Give the lad a chance.

Continually receiving the message 'This Community Is Temporarily Unavailable' Found that between 6:30 and 7:30 last night this was happening on Windows 7 & 8 and also Tapatalk on different devices. Also this evening from 5:45 to 6:30. Also happening at other variable times. throughout the day.

Maybe I should have worded that first sentence differently so you wouldn't need to take it out of the paragraph and highlight it out of context with the rest of what I wrote. I didn't mentioned badge of honour or a financial return as such however when you pump a good percentage of your own fortune into something with no return even in a gratitude sense from some quarters then it's a thankless task. Why the hell would anyone else put themselves into that situation? Lerner's problem was leaving the likes of Faulkner etc to run the club however as I stated in a previous post he has been stung for that. Well and truly.As you also mentioned the profit for an owner should come through the sale of the club and as a fan why the hell would I feel differently? Let's get this straight, I am no fan of Lerner as I wasn't of Ellis and I don't give a toss how much he loses financially when he lets the club go as he will definitely lose out. Both have been poor for different reasons however the continual moaning about the net spend especially this season is what I will back him over. The club has always needed to to be self sustainable and he needed to right the wrongs with his appointments. He's doing that as far as I can see and therefore I have no need to slag him as some do.

is this not mainly down to health and age reasons though? Because for the majority of premier league seasons under Doug, we were not in debt and finishing top half on a regular basis. I'd also guess that less teams were earning more money than us each season, as we seem to have dropped in that respect under Lerner. I think they're different worlds, finances have moved on an awful lot since Doug's times and indeed a fair bit between now and when Lerner bought in. I think Lerner thought at the time that he'd be able to put this club into the champions league for an investment of £20m a season and that once he was there, that £20m wouldn't be needed any more. Within ten years, the game added another zero to those numbers and became beyond what Lerner could afford to do. In some ways, since he decided to sell the club, he's become a better owner - as a caretaker with a desire to ensure a stable business, he's more effective than as an owner that wanted to get involved and make things happen - he's put better people in place, they're making good decisions and he's letting them get on with it; everything a good owner should do. There have almost been three ages to Lerner - the first, where he had an ambition and the sort of money that mattered back then; our lost opportunity. The second where he floundered in trying to figure out what he wanted, what he was doing and what the point of it all was, and this final act, where I think he's quite sensibly managing an asset that's for sale. The outstanding question mark is to how long this third act can hold. As a final point, and one that should be repeated every single time this comparison is made - Lerner has invested/lost/wasted around £200m of his own/his families money in this football club - Doug Ellis never ever put a single penny of his own money into it. Health and age notwithstanding, the game had moved on from owners like Doug, the age of local businessmen was over and he could no longer afford to be involved - that had been true for a decade before he left and it was becoming more and more acutely obvious as time went on - the same is possibly true for Lerner, but at least he has the good sense to have noticed and to be trying to make an exit. Great post. The thing people need to realise is exactly what lerner has already pumped into our club with absolutely no return. 10 years ago he had the funds to play the premiership owner game and now after a catalogue of poor decisions he just doesn't have the clout to continually throw good money after bad. He chased a dream and fell short mainly through being badly advised, and although we have had 5 years of misery and uncertainty I personally will never cry over the lack of investment as he has invested far beyond what the previous owner did into our club in monetary terms. My gripe is with poor decision making regarding the management of the team and backroom staff, and since the beginning of the year it appears measures are being taken to ensure these poor decisions are rectified. That is enough for me at the current time, sure we can all moan about what we ain't got but equally we could be owned by someone far worse than Lerner. I would just be happy this season with a team that stabilises our status in the league and if new owners are just around the corner then great, if not we crack on and improve with what we have. It really is that simple at the moment.

I think you make good points however the current situation although very much of Lerner's own doing is also down to massive mismanagement within the footballing side of things. Lerner whether people like it or not has already spent a fortune since he arrived and I believe under the pretences that those spending it knew what they were doing. The club was always going to have to become self sustainable in the long term and we are doing now what should have been done when O'Neil arrived imo- Bring in high quality youth with long term resale value. We didn't and ultimately paid the price with the cutbacks over the last few years after paying high wages for ageing footballers. It needed to happen though and now with the investment from the sale of tekkers and the delph we are addressing the quality of the squad as a whole. Personally I don't buy into the crap that you have to spend fortunes to remain competitive or build. Or that we need to keep spending thee same net £'s as everyone else. No doubt you need funds however getting in the right manager and coaching staff is just as important. Most people have been unhappy and like you last season I had enough however Lambert has now gone, Lerner is staying(at least for now), and we as a club, although not spending the amounts as some, have invested very well in the transfer market this summer. We have rid ourselves of the majority of players enjoying a free ride and have players with ambition and points to prove. All the ingredients to move forward as a club again. A cracking summer imo. We have a clean slate to now work with including the fans. New journey's to travel and heroes to build along the way. After the bullshit of the last few years I think we all need a break. A break from negativity! The crowds need to be brought back Villa Park with entertaining football and we need to encourage our team and not cry about net spend. I also think we are competing with Everton and Sunderland this year and think we will finish above both.

Exactly where I am at. These are my fantastic four!

It's just obvious though Andre is the better player, he has torn United apart today. Our Ayew just looks average thus far I don't by that we have x amount if new players. If you have natural footballing ability your able to adapt What like Di Maria at Utd or Falcao?! There are so many players that have masses of ability that were unable to adapt to different clubs for varying reasons. Saying that players who have ability don't need to adapt is very naive thinking imo.

Not sure about the second goal but the set up off his wall and positioning for the first goal was dreadful. Gave himself far too much ground to cover. I personally think he's a bit headshot at the moment and has been for a long time- maybe man city. He just seems to panic continually when the ball is played back to him and puts the full backs under pressure.. Think a replacement will deffo be on the cards soon unless he gets his shit together.

Still backing Sherwood 100% but I was baffled with the line up today. Starting with Sanchez, Westwood and Gana was poor imo and thought we should've had Gil on from the start even if for only 60min. Thought Gestede was very static as someone else mentioned and his as well as the rest of the team's off the ball movement was shocking at times. Really thought Kozak should have come on with at least 20 to go as Sunderland were there for the taking. I also thought Bacuna was terrible terrible today, looked like he has spent so long playing at RB that he has forgotten how to move forward with the ball at times, always checking his run to play backwards. Gil's booking also looked an atrocious decision from the Holte. 2 points dropped today instead of 1 point won, imo.

Sorry but after reading this post I felt the need to respond. I think most of us feel the right to criticise when necessary so let me criticise your post if that's okay as I feel it's necessary. As for those who say the manager needs time to work out where a player plays best, I say, rubbish. Players continually grow and develop strengths and weaknesses in different areas. One example is Gareth Barry, played everywhere and was more than the CB he started out at Villa, as he developed and ended up playing DM for England. Thank the lord no one was listening to your rational on potential growth and development. A manager should know what formations he favours against different clubs. He should then only purchase players he has had extensively scouted, that he knows can play in those formations. How the hell as a manager are you going to make a decision on what strategy your going to set up against your opposition until you are aware of the players they will possibly line up with? Injuries, suspensions, loss of form, will all factor in the decision making process not only in your own team but your opponents.Not to mention culture changes for new players, language barriers etc. By your illogical way of thinking this will all be done in the summer before the season has started?! Now I am more than willing to give Mr Sherwood time but, I would like to see a little proof that he is learning. One way of showing that proof of learning, would be in not making obvious errors consistently. 3 Games in, 1 win and 2 loses and your giving him time? You for real or are you Flavio Briatore? There is proof if you look properly. The defence is stronger and we have a better midfield than last season. As I and many others have also stated... There are question marks over the appointment of Sherwood, however we will spend the 2015-16 playing premier league football, something that before TS came in didn't seem probable. It's easy as a fan to question decisions managers make regarding formations, line up, tactics and subs etc. The truth is nobody knows whether or not their own decisions would have anymore of a impact on what is about to transpire or has transpired. It's pure guess work and hypothetically based. TS could have brought the most versatile players in the world worth untold millions, put them all in their favoured positions and play only to their strengths. It still does not guarantee the team will be a success in the short or long term. And the bottom line is no matter how much you research once you take a human being from their comfort zone and put them in an alien environment you don't know how they will react. We could all pick top players out that flopped for reasons most wouldn't have anticipated. I think it's reasonable enough to question especially when there is a continual repetition of the same mistakes as with the last manager. We are however only 3 weeks into TS's first proper season, and after a summer of mass upheaval whereby we as a club were continually battered in the media and with our main players leaving, it hasn't actually turned out that bad at all imo. TS has brought in experience to help him, contracts are being dealt with in the right way finally and most agree that we have also brought in some fantastic young talent into the squad. Still having said that things will take time to click on the pitch as there are far too many changes to personnel for instant success and maybe next season will be the season we truly progress the way we would all like. As long as we are moving forward though that's just fine by me and after the Lambert debacle I think it's unreasonable to really expect anything more especially without a massive injection of cash.

Heard that he has a release clause in his contract that WBA haven't allowed him to activate after a bid. He has therefore asked the PFA to get involved. Think the baggies are desperate for a CB as Lescott will definitely be leaving.

I agree andy. Thought he was by far the best player in the back line.

Came on for Gil I think and slotted into DM allowing Veretout to get forward.