dnmacf Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Guardian reporting we've stated 'no swap deals.' We're a very different club to the last two seasons with Houllier and McLeish, changing manager during summer and lacking clear, decisive direction. http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/jul/09/christian-benteke-tottenham-spurs-villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KjParton Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Contracts are there for the both players and clubs, can't moan at a player for not wanting to 'honour' his contract just like I don't enjoy players like Ireland 'honouring' their deal and staying. Contracts give players security and also clubs. Works both ways. Devastating it's happening this summer when things were looking so rosy but he's an unbelievable talent and will do well wherever he goes I'm sure. I understand this... but the player is not being treated unfairly so he cant throw the contract in saying this-and-that.... He knew Villa were a work in progress... He knew we werent fighting for European spots.... and he also knew that the length of the contract we were offering him to sign was 4 years long... We offered Ireland the deal, he has to stay until we say so... We can either let him sit it out, we can try and sell him or, if we get that sick and tired of him moping around the place, we can pay him off a lump sum and have done with it... Only difference is that we want Benteke to stay and do the job that he agreed to do less than one year ago... He shouldnt have signed if he wasn't willing to honour the agreement... Oh, you dont want to stay anymore because the whole world knows how good you are now? Graphic state of affairs young Christian... You belong to us, you are virtually the property of our club... The reason you are a footballer with an agent and not a neurosurgeon, a barrister or anything else that requires some REAL thought is because you can kick a ball into a net very well and not because you are highly educated and can make your own mind up about what you want to do with your life... For the money you agreed on, you should shut up and do your job for the team you signed a contract with until the EMPLOYER (AVFC) says that you can go or your contract expires Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnmacf Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" 'Villa said he had already been given extra time off until 18 July before the transfer request was made.' (BBC Sport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" Problem is has he burnt his bridges with the fans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnmacf Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Don't see why we should offer him a new contract to be honest if an appropriate bid doesn't arrive in our stated timeframe? Keep him on 20k per week till January or next summer, whenever he eventually goes, unless he comes out and states he will give his all for the club while he's still here and playing in claret and blue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoony Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 We're COMPLETELY in the driving seat here Really? I think we (and other clubs, too) are totally at the mercy of the player('s agents) and finances. I'll clarify: we are indeed at the mercy of the player('s agents) to the extent that this is happening at all. However, it's a WC year, he has 3 years on his contract, we are under no obligation at all to sell him, he can't afford to sulk and not perform if he stays and the 'goal-machine' market is pretty sparse it seems. We don't have to sell. Therefore, we don't have to sell on the cheap. And we won't. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KjParton Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" Problem is has he burnt his bridges with the fans? Not for me. I'd have him at Villa next season with open arms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LockStockVilla Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" Problem is has he burnt his bridges with the fans? Nah, not really. If a 20 goal striker has to stay at your club for another season it ain't that bad. If he stays and gets on with it, I have no qualms, he is no different to 99% of the footballers out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3te Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" Problem is has he burnt his bridges with the fans? Nah, not really. If a 20 goal striker has to stay at your club for another season it ain't that bad. If he stays and gets on with it, I have no qualms, he is no different to 99% of the footballers out there. I dunno, there's about 50 pages of people calling him all kinds of nasty names here alone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMcKenna Posted July 10, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) My take on all this: Benteke wants to sign for Spurs. This is partly because he doesn't want to risk spending lots of time on the bench at somewhere like Chelsea. But Spurs are never going to offer £25m (far less more than that). My guess would be that we might offer £19m, at the very most, and even that would break our transfer record. For argument's sake, let's say the offer was £19m, which is £11m more than you paid for him, or so I gather. Villa would then have a very difficult choice IMO - regardless of those of you will say that a flat rejection should be automatic and easy. Because if the answer is "no", then you end up without £19m (and £11m profit), plus a very unhappy player who is likely to be a disruptive influence within the club. Yes, players who want to leave can be forced to stay. We did that with Modric for a year, but the difference (compared to Benteke) was: * He was on much higher wages already - i.e. without needing to sign a new contract to get them, a new contract that he was not willing to sign (as with Benteke). * He was still always likely to continue to do his best playing-wise (the same might be true of Benteke for all I know, but his past behaviour suggests this is a riskier proposition). * He was at a club that was at least challenging for top 4 and had finished in the top 4 whilst he was there. Of course Villa have every right to stick out for £25m (or whatever the figure is) and every right to say no to lower offers, if that's what you choose. But I don't believe another club will offer more than Spurs, or not at least another club that Benteke is willing to sign for. And it's all very well saying that he's worth £30m (or whatever), or citing the freak money that Andy Carroll was signed for by Liverpool, but the real world of transfers doesn't usually work like that .... or not unless there are several very wealthy clubs competing against each other, or one very wealthy club who are desperate to sign a particular player. Neither club will want a protracted wrangle: Spurs not least because we won't want to risk wasting the summer in a fruitless pursuit. So I believe Spurs will make their best offer and a deadline for Villa's response. And Villa may in any case do the same. So if Villa think it'd be better to force him to stay rather than to accept £19m (the "for argument's sake" max figure IMO) and be able to move on with clear water ahead into the rest of the summer window - then obviously that's your perogative. Personally I think it'd be a mistake, but then I'm not an unbiased spectator. And who knows, you could keep him and then be able to sell him next summer for more than the notional £19m Spurs offer. But with one year less on his contract this would seem unlikely ... unless he plays very well for you again this time around. So much about this is simply wrong. If Levy and Spurs fans think they can tap a player who was a prolific scorer in a pretty average team and poach him for £19 million, I think they are in for a shock. FFS we sold Downing for £20m and he isnt half the player that Benteke is. I do not have a lot of time for Lerner, but as he illustrated when Liverpool originally came in for Barry (albeit at MONs request) he was prepared to stand his ground. He didnt care about a "protracted wrangle" he effectively stuck up two fingers and said "you are under contract son and we will sell you in a year - if the price is right!" When it suited us he went and ended up chasing the money at Man City and Liverpools bid was history. Lerner may know **** all about football but he knows a lot about how a market works, the value of assets, how they appreciate and how he holds all the cards when it comes to when Benteke leaves and where he goes. IF Spurs or any club think that the specious arguments about wages, the players attitude, lack of competition etc will have any bearing on Lerner imho I they will learn differently. He is on low wages and has 3 years to run on his contract. If no one offers £25m, imo Benteke will be a Villa player till at least January. Edited July 10, 2013 by MikeMcKenna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KjParton Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" Problem is has he burnt his bridges with the fans? Nah, not really. If a 20 goal striker has to stay at your club for another season it ain't that bad. If he stays and gets on with it, I have no qualms, he is no different to 99% of the footballers out there. I dunno, there's about 50 pages of people calling him all kinds of nasty names here alone People overreact. Its expected. I'm sure if he signs an extended deal at Villa people would forgive him - Unlikely to sign a new deal though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) We don't have to sell. Therefore, we don't have to sell on the cheap. And we won't.We may well have to sell to balance the books (or to give them a level of respectability).Edit: The 'no obligation to sell', world cup year, sulking, toys out of the pram, sitting on the bench stuff seems to me rather unrealistic messageboard/pundit discussion.Everyone chucks it about until people do actually throw their toys out of their prams, go on strike, claim that some other club would do them better, stand up for their career prospects and wot not and whatever and moves thus transpire.We've pretty much declared that we are a club that needs to buy players and sell them on in order to not lose over £20m a year; it should be no surprise that a player that we bought for x with at least half a view (if not much much more) to selling for 2, 3 or more times x also views himself as a commodity. Edited July 10, 2013 by snowychap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3te Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 He shouldn't be offered a new deal if no agreement can be met with a new club. He's got a 3 year contract as it is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMcKenna Posted July 10, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted July 10, 2013 He shouldn't be offered a new deal if no agreement can be met with a new club. He's got a 3 year contract as it is WOW that's insightful! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3te Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Almost as insightful as your post... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMcKenna Posted July 10, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted July 10, 2013 Almost as insightful as your post... As Benjamin Franklin said "Halfwits talk much but say little" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMcKenna Posted July 10, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted July 10, 2013 We don't have to sell. Therefore, we don't have to sell on the cheap. And we won't.We may well have to sell to balance the books (or to give them a level of respectability).Edit: The 'no obligation to sell', world cup year, sulking, toys out of the pram, sitting on the bench stuff seems to me rather unrealistic messageboard/pundit discussion.Everyone chucks it about until people do actually throw their toys out of their prams, go on strike, claim that some other club would do them better, stand up for their career prospects and wot not and whatever and moves thus transpire.We've pretty much declared that we are a club that needs to buy players and sell them on in order to not lose over £20m a year; it should be no surprise that a player that we bought for x with at least half a view (if not much much more) to selling for 2, 3 or more times x also views himself as a commodity. Lerner did it with Barry, why several years later is it "rather unrealistic messageboard/pundit discussion"? If we don't upgrade his contract, it will cost us say £5m between now and January. By then his price could be £30m if things are not going well for various top clubs strikers. Lerner and AVFC hold all the cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LockStockVilla Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 There's a cut off point isn't there? 18 July? Off the top of my head. Rumours going round because he hasn't burnt his bridges with Lambert that if Spuds don't place the 25m bid he'll sign a new contract with Villa. He doesn't want Chelsea because he can't be guaranteed starts in a WC year. Stress on the word "Rumours" Problem is has he burnt his bridges with the fans? Nah, not really. If a 20 goal striker has to stay at your club for another season it ain't that bad. If he stays and gets on with it, I have no qualms, he is no different to 99% of the footballers out there. I dunno, there's about 50 pages of people calling him all kinds of nasty names here alone People overreact. Its expected. I'm sure if he signs an extended deal at Villa people would forgive him - Unlikely to sign a new deal though! Yeah, I was more so speaking personally, but if he stays and has a few good matches, everything will be peachy again. Football fans can have very short memories at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3te Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Almost as insightful as your post... As Benjamin Franklin said "Halfwits talk much but say little" Must've been going through your posting history at the time, was he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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