The Randy Lerner thread

[terrytini]

3 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

The Krulak thing worries me.

 

I actually love the Football Board idea, and I'm sure that's Hollis' idea rather than Lerner as it's far too sensible.

But having Krulak on the actual board sounds like Lerner doesn't quite trust everyone as much as he says he does to run the club, and Krulak is his eyes and ears to run everything back up the ladder to Lerner.

I can see why it would worry you !

I'm not sure it should though.  Whilst an absolute 100% complete distancing from the Club would be lovely, I can see why he still wants eyes and ears here.  As long as its not a brain ! It could even be to satisfy the rest of the Trust.

The key will be how the other Board Members feel about it - if they feel observed I can't imagine they will care, but if they consider that Lerner becomes involved as a result of the 'eyes and ears' I would expect them to be very unhappy and more importantly it could derail the whole thing, depending as it does on the complete uncoupling of Lerner.

 

[sne]

Not really the correct place but anyhow.

ON THIS DAY, 128 YEARS AGO: ASTON VILLA DIRECTOR WILLIAM MCGREGOR SPEARHEADS FORMATION OF THE FOOTBALL LEAGUE

http://www.whoateallthepies.tv/aston_villa/234694/on-this-day-128-years-ago-aston-villa-director-william-mcgregor-spearheads-formation-of-the-football-league.html

Proud History indeed, but thanks to our "custodian" our future is anything than bright.

Thank you Randy!

[TRO]

On 21 March 2016 at 21:57, terrytini said:

Until a month ago I would have disagreed, since Lerner is, however unwittingly, the root cause of the malaise at the Club. It is his incompetence, distance, wretchedness, weakness, and neglect which pervades everything at the Club.  Far more than crap Managers, and certainly more than endless players, he is the half hearted half soaked unspirited essence of the Club.  From him, stems those same characteristics throughout the culture of the Club.  Whilst we have had poor Managers, his sickly influence has magnified their weaknesses, whilst we have had some poor players, his lack of interest or ambition has quickly rubbed off on them and their better quality teammates.

BUT.

I now believe, (rightly or wrongly, but it is a genuine belief) that he has, at last, realised all this, and is no longer going to be a problem.  To the extent that I think the fans chanting the Lerner out song are now both missing the point and wasting their breath. (And I was one of them until a few weeks ago). He has, in my view, gone.

I think the set up agreed in the States was that Lerner now has no input whatsoever into the Club (he always did have, reference each Manager still referred to him aas regards transfers etc).  He has given it over to Hollis, not, as I first thought, to run it down, but to run it.  The Board is as clear an indication of this as could be wished for.  It is far more substantial than we would have if Lerner were retaining control.  Bernstein in particular, and Little to not much less extent, will not have come in as patsys.

I've said it a few times, he has cut his own head off, his mind is now 100% NOT the mind of the Club.  Therefore it is irrelevant - except in circumstances where we got an oil sheik - whether he actually leaves, and could easily be worse.

Because he is now totally isolated away from the Club, providing only funds, those on the Board will build a new culture - pretty quickly IMO - and his effect and influence, which was always far more damaging in greyer terms than just money, will disappear.

Of course, the culture the new guys bring will not necessarily be any good, but it will be good or bad regardless of Lerner still being the owner.

I know a lot of people cant see past getting shot of him, but IF I am correct in what has happened, there is simply nothing to be gained from it (quite apart from it being a remote possibility anyway). In fact we could end up in a position where the only relevance he would have would be to continue to be a target for fans when it was no longer productive - or worse, counter productive.

What the new set up will also do, in tandem, (if it works)is create exactly the right conditions where a sale could be achieved easier.

 

my sentiments entirely.....I am also tired of resenting him.

If there is no sensible and practical alternative and there doesn't seem to be on the horizon......I want these changes to work.

and one of the by products is to actually feel civil towards the owner of the football club I love.

as much as i understand it......I am tired of the hate.

we are pulling up the weeds, now lets allow the flowers to grow.

[TRO]

Would it be feasible to think?

That any new partially interested buyer would turn to his business partners and say

This guy Lerner has invested c £250 million in to Aston Villa......and they hate him.

long silent pause in their meeting

 

......."what was the other sporting proposals we have to consider"

[OutByEaster?]

Absolutely feasible I think TRO. It's why I believe our protests should be engineered at encouraging a sale rather than simply at removing the man at the top. 

[DCJonah]

36 minutes ago, TRO said:

Would it be feasible to think?

That any new partially interested buyer would turn to his business partners and say

This guy Lerner has invested c £250 million in to Aston Villa......and they hate him.

long silent pause in their meeting

 

......."what was the other sporting proposals we have to consider"

I would imagine any group with hundreds of millions of pounds to invest would do a little more research than this. 

Anyone who looked into the club properly will see why Lerner is hated and that shouldn't put anyone off. 

[sne]

One would hope thou that any interested party would do their homework and see what an absolute mess Lerner has done with pretty much every decision he's made here.

 

[AndyC]

football is a crazy business and anybody looking to buy a club will be fully aware that if they pump in a fortune and get it wrong the fans will turn on them. Our hatred of the current situation will have no effect on any potential sale.

[terrytini]

1 hour ago, OutByEaster? said:

Absolutely feasible I think TRO. It's why I believe our protests should be engineered at encouraging a sale rather than simply at removing the man at the top. 

Whilst I thought Lerner was the problem I would've agreed to do anything to replace him, no matter what or who with - dangerous and fraught though that could have been.

I think the situation has now - potentially -changed to the extent that I would suggest encouraging a sale, for sales sake and with no criteria being applied to - or control exercised over - the buyer is at best silly and at worst dangerously counterproductive.

Of course, I may be wrong about whether, or to what extent, the situation has changed, (in which case it may turn out to be me who is silly and dangerous) but I would hope that at the very least all supporters are considering the possibility when deciding how to proceed.

[TRO]

4 hours ago, DCJonah said:

I would imagine any group with hundreds of millions of pounds to invest would do a little more research than this. 

Anyone who looked into the club properly will see why Lerner is hated and that shouldn't put anyone off. 

If you think they have that level of research.....like we are only now looking at having football people on the board......you have more faith in these people than me.

[sne]

Difference between Lerner and potential new owners is that they will more than likely have earned their money themselves.

Thus they will probably be better businessmen than him, more cautious and aware of the value of money. This make them less prome to jumping into a major venture they know nothing about. (One would hope)

Lerner was born with a silver spoon in every orifice and acts like it.

[TRO]

At the risk of alienating myself from a lot of fans let me say this.

There has been hours and hours of writing on these sites about the club and who is to blame for our current demise.....and we have all had our penny worth, but let me say this.

be careful what you wish for.

The big worry for me is no knight on a white horse has come and wrestled Aston Villa off our current owner.

Despite his shortfalls and poor decisions.....he is our custodian and never wanted this situation to happen......good decisions are only obvious to those who know.

He may be a rich man, but he has lost a kings ransom in trying to make aston villa work.....he is hurt, we are hurt.

but despite all the trials and tribulations i understand Randy Lerner to be an honourable man, despite his short comings.

We only look at one aspect and understandably so, but very few have got to grips with his situation.

There are other owners they maybe more knowledgeable and would not have got themselves in to this situation.....others would have abandoned their failings much quicker and dropped us even further in the mire.

I have a very mixed view of Randy Lerner.....but I do think he is honourable towards our club.

misguided yes ...........but dishonourable and malicious .....no.

[TRO]

16 minutes ago, sne said:

Difference between Lerner and potential new owners is that they will more than likely have earned their money themselves.

Thus they will probably be better businessmen than him, more cautious and aware of the value of money. This make them less prome to jumping into a major venture they know nothing about. (One would hope)

Lerner was born with a silver spoon in every orifice and acts like it.

I don't doubt your sentiments.....let me tell you in many circumstances successful business men  are lucky failures if you get my paradoxical logic.

The successful ones are not all stephen hawking's prodigals you know.

luck and in the right place, plays a very big part.

[TRO]

3 hours ago, AndyC said:

football is a crazy business and anybody looking to buy a club will be fully aware that if they pump in a fortune and get it wrong the fans will turn on them. Our hatred of the current situation will have no effect on any potential sale.

Will they ?  i thought so too.....now i'm not so sure.

[YLN]

27 minutes ago, TRO said:

At the risk of alienating myself from a lot of fans let me say this.

There has been hours and hours of writing on these sites about the club and who is to blame for our current demise.....and we have all had our penny worth, but let me say this.

be careful what you wish for.

The big worry for me is no knight on a white horse has come and wrestled Aston Villa off our current owner.

Despite his shortfalls and poor decisions.....he is our custodian and never wanted this situation to happen......good decisions are only obvious to those who know.

He may be a rich man, but he has lost a kings ransom in trying to make aston villa work.....he is hurt, we are hurt.

but despite all the trials and tribulations i understand Randy Lerner to be an honourable man, despite his short comings.

We only look at one aspect and understandably so, but very few have got to grips with his situation.

There are other owners they maybe more knowledgeable and would not have got themselves in to this situation.....others would have abandoned their failings much quicker and dropped us even further in the mire.

I have a very mixed view of Randy Lerner.....but I do think he is honourable towards our club.

misguided yes ...........but dishonourable and malicious .....no.

 

He is hurt because he has lost some money. He still has hundreds of millions. Hundreds of millions. We are hurt because he has destroyed our club with his ineptitude. You might say he has been unlucky to have employed and trusted the wrong people at the wrong time, but to do it so consistently is an indication of incompetence, not misfortune.

Honourable. Kicking out fans for having banners. Appointing Alex McLeish. The contempt for fans shown by the disappearance of Krulak from the fan sites. I'm not sure if these things were done out of malice, but there was certainly dishonour involved. 

Short of someone who comes in and starts selling off the contents of the trophy room on eBay, I'm not sure we could do much worse.

[OutByEaster?]

7 hours ago, sne said:

Difference between Lerner and potential new owners is that they will more than likely have earned their money themselves.

I'm not sure that's true - there's both new money and old money in the league - Abramovich stands out as someone who 'earned' their own money, but the City owners didn't, they inherited theirs, the Liverpool owners inherited theirs, the Utd owners borrowed theirs, Arsenal's owner married his, Pornodwarf made his own I s'pose - but there's all sorts of different money in football. 

It's increasingly becoming too expensive for any businessman other than a hedge fund manager or a dotcom billionaire to buy a club with money they earnt themselves - and sadly I don't think there's a dotcom billionaire out there for us.

 

[DCJonah]

13 hours ago, TRO said:

At the risk of alienating myself from a lot of fans let me say this.

There has been hours and hours of writing on these sites about the club and who is to blame for our current demise.....and we have all had our penny worth, but let me say this.

be careful what you wish for.

The big worry for me is no knight on a white horse has come and wrestled Aston Villa off our current owner.

Despite his shortfalls and poor decisions.....he is our custodian and never wanted this situation to happen......good decisions are only obvious to those who know.

He may be a rich man, but he has lost a kings ransom in trying to make aston villa work.....he is hurt, we are hurt.

but despite all the trials and tribulations i understand Randy Lerner to be an honourable man, despite his short comings.

We only look at one aspect and understandably so, but very few have got to grips with his situation.

There are other owners they maybe more knowledgeable and would not have got themselves in to this situation.....others would have abandoned their failings much quicker and dropped us even further in the mire.

I have a very mixed view of Randy Lerner.....but I do think he is honourable towards our club.

misguided yes ...........but dishonourable and malicious .....no.

Wow.

I haven't disagreed with a post this much in a long time. I'm amazed any villa fans feel this way. 

[Jareth]

I hope that after a decade of poor stewardship, Randy being hands-off will lead to better times. I find it difficult to assign any positive thought in Randy's direction given what we've had to put up with for five years.

[Blasterpocket68]

1 hour ago, DCJonah said:

Wow.

I haven't disagreed with a post this much in a long time. I'm amazed any villa fans feel this way. 

I'm struggling with this if he was doing the right thing and being the honourable man , shouldn't he have sold us?

[sne]

5 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

I'm not sure that's true - there's both new money and old money in the league - Abramovich stands out as someone who 'earned' their own money, but the City owners didn't, they inherited theirs, the Liverpool owners inherited theirs, the Utd owners borrowed theirs, Arsenal's owner married his, Pornodwarf made his own I s'pose - but there's all sorts of different money in football. 

It's increasingly becoming too expensive for any businessman other than a hedge fund manager or a dotcom billionaire to buy a club with money they earnt themselves - and sadly I don't think there's a dotcom billionaire out there for us.

 

True.

But many of those owners have vastly more money than Lerner, leaving them bigger margins.

The point I was making is that Lerner showed a lack of understanding of the value of money by going into a business he knew nothing about without first surrounding himself with people who knew football. Both the sport and the business side of it. Only a very naive person would do that.

Hopefully if we ever get new owners they will be a bit more, well, not like Lerner.