Bollitics: VT General Election Poll #6 - Leaders Debate 3

[Richard]

Collective sigh of relief in the Labour party as Chancellor Alistair Darling says he has "absolutely no interest" in becoming leader of the Labour Party. He adds that he is "very happy" in his current job.

Although Alistair I think that no matter the outcome of Thursday you wont be in a jon on Friday mate

I'm not sure I see the point you are making.

I don't recall the previous Tory governments record on poverty being any better and I'm not convinced if they come to power it will be any better in the future.

Trent I think the point I was making was that AListair Darling wouldn't be in a job on Friday regardless of the result of Thursday.

[bickster]

I think Richards right, no matter what happens with the result, Alistair will no longer be Labour's Darling

in the unlikely event of an outright Victory for Labour he'll get dumped by Gordo anyway

In the case of a Lib / Lab coalition, his job will go to Vince Cable

And if the Conservatives win then………..

[Awol]

Winning this election is the definition of inheriting a poisoned chalice anyway because what needs to be done will be so brutal the public won't forgive it for a long time to come. There would be some justice in Gordo occupying the hot seat when all of his economic chickens finally come home to roost.

[mjmooney]

Winning this election is the definition of inheriting a poisoned chalice anyway because what needs to be done will be so brutal the public won't forgive it for a long time to come.

That's basically the gist of last night's pub conversation. My (solidly Labour) mate reckons there'll be another election within two years as there will be a massive public backlash against the Tories' policies. Probably wishful thinking though.

In other news, after 28 years of marriage, my wife and I had our first ever conflict over politics. Her: "Well, at least I won't have it on MY conscience that I let the Tories in by deserting Labour". Oops.

[LJRM050389]

Brown worst PM says Labour candidate

On the BBC Ian

Wheres the story on the Tory who said they could cure gays? Was the most tweeted story on twitter, yet not reported on any of the main news outlets?

[Richard]

Brown worst PM says Labour candidate

On the BBC Ian

Wheres the story on the Tory who said they could cure gays? Was the most tweeted story on twitter, yet not reported on any of the main news outlets?

Perhaps that points to the credibility of it?

[TheDon]

In other news, after 28 years of marriage, my wife and I had our first ever conflict over politics. Her: "Well, at least I won't have it on MY conscience that I let the Tories in by deserting Labour". Oops.

I can see that viewpoint.

If you don't agree with the Tory policies (and many people don't) then who you vote for is generally either a wasted vote, or Labour/Lib Dem. In my constituency the majority last time was around 2,000 with the lib dem's over 10k behind (with a 38k turnout). There's next to no chance of the lib dem's getting in, so the choice is Labour or Tory.

A lot of people think the Tories will get in anyway, so it's just a question of reducing the majority as much as possible so they can't do too much damage.

[drat01]

In other news, after 28 years of marriage, my wife and I had our first ever conflict over politics. Her: "Well, at least I won't have it on MY conscience that I let the Tories in by deserting Labour". Oops.

women know best Mike :-)

[mjmooney]

In other news, after 28 years of marriage, my wife and I had our first ever conflict over politics. Her: "Well, at least I won't have it on MY conscience that I let the Tories in by deserting Labour". Oops.

I can see that viewpoint.

If you don't agree with the Tory policies (and many people don't) then who you vote for is generally either a wasted vote, or Labour/Lib Dem. In my constituency the majority last time was around 2,000 with the lib dem's over 10k behind (with a 38k turnout). There's next to no chance of the lib dem's getting in, so the choice is Labour or Tory.

A lot of people think the Tories will get in anyway, so it's just a question of reducing the majority as much as possible so they can't do too much damage.

I haven't made my mind up completely. My hand may twitch "Doctor Strangelove" style when I get into that booth. I want to vote LibDem purely on policies and because I'm pissed off with Labour, but your point is valid.

Then again I'm in a very close three-way marginal seat, and the correct (i.e. anti-Tory) tactical vote is not obvious.

[mjmooney]

In other news, after 28 years of marriage, my wife and I had our first ever conflict over politics. Her: "Well, at least I won't have it on MY conscience that I let the Tories in by deserting Labour". Oops.

women know best Mike :-)

They probably do - I changed the subject as I knew I couldn't win. But my feeling is that Labour deserted me.

[blandy]

Big Society

[drat01]

Brown worst PM says Labour candidate

On the BBC Ian

Wheres the story on the Tory who said they could cure gays? Was the most tweeted story on twitter, yet not reported on any of the main news outlets?

Conveniently hidden - despite it being a very interesting story to a lot of people

Following on from Graylings attacks on homosexuals the so called tolerant party are seemingly led by a hypocrite in Cameron. Philippa Stroud ran prayer sessions to 'cure' gay people - "A high-flying prospective Conservative MP, credited with shaping many of the party's social policies, founded a church that tried to "cure" homosexuals by driving out their "demons" through prayer."

Absolutely disgusting that this woman is allowed anywhere near a political party let alone be a chief advisor to Cameron.

The old Tory traits are there shining through but conveniently the media are playing to a different tune paid for by certain people.

[drat01]

They probably do - I changed the subject as I knew I couldn't win. But my feeling is that Labour deserted me.

But could you ever forgive yourself if the Cons did sneak through because of your vote? You know as well as I do Mike what it's like up here and the awful attacks that they made on this area last time. Cameron would be the same.

[drat01]

Tony and I have shared a beer and a sociable chat

[drat01]

Not everyone's cup of tea - stephen Fry

Have a look at his blog, its a good little read about the whole election process - note at the bottom the next page button its easily missed and there are some further pages to it - Note: Not Pro Lab / Lib / Tory

[LJRM050389]

Hauge defends anti gay comments

[Richard]

Big Society

Nothing like a nice bit of Labour scaremongering

[mjmooney]

They probably do - I changed the subject as I knew I couldn't win. But my feeling is that Labour deserted me.

But could you ever forgive yourself if the Cons did sneak through because of your vote? You know as well as I do Mike what it's like up here and the awful attacks that they made on this area last time. Cameron would be the same.

As I said upthread, the anti-Tory tactical vote is not obvious in my constituency, it's a very close three-way marginal. My bet is that there will be a drift to LibDem, so I may as well join it. But how many people will change their mind and stick with Labour at the last moment? I still may - it would feel very strange to change my vote after 38 years of Labour loyalty.

[Richard]

Hauge defends anti gay comments

Another fantastically accurate (not) headline that Hague defends anti gay comments when the actual interview that appeared on Radio 5 bears no resemblence whatsoever to that or the artical on that left wing webiste in the quote

Desperate indeed

[Chindie]

One of the most fascinating sights I've witnessed thus far during the coverage of the 2010 election campaign is Gordon Brown's visit to a branch of Tesco in Hastings on 16 April, which was broadcast live and uninterrupted for about five minutes on Sky News.

"Hello, good to see you," says Gordon, shaking someone's hand. "It's great to be here," he continues, waving at a well-wisher. He looks around. "This is a good store, isn't it?" he enquires of no one in particular. He spots a young boy. "How old are you?" he asks. The boy is eight. "That's a good age," Gordon concludes. "Which football team do you support?"

As he continues walking through the supermarket, the pictures carry on moving, but the sound appears to be stuck on a loop, because Gordon's repeating the same words. "Hello, good to see you." "It's great to be here." "This is a good store, isn't it?" "How old are you?" "That's a good age." "Which football team do you support?" The same handful of phrases, over and over again, for five minutes.

When you watch the footage repeatedly, as I have, distinct patterns start to emerge. Throughout the visit, Brown looks marginally less comfortable than a horse crossing a rope bridge, and his internal dialogue tree is starkly visible. Whenever he meets a boy of eight years old or older, for instance, Gordon briefly asks which football team they support, then chuckles, whatever the answer, before moving on to say "Hello, good to see you" to someone else. That's the way he's been programmed. (He occasionally breaks up his repetitive mantra with brief statements of the obvious: at one point, he glances at a shelf full of produce and says, "There's a lot of produce here." It almost makes you wish he was being shown around an orgy instead. Almost.)

The footage is funny, yet somehow heartbreaking. Brown looks clumsy, ungainly and chronically unsure how to behave around everyday shoppers. He reminds me of me. I can scarcely look people in the eye in supermarkets either. But I've learned to survive in demanding public situations – such as standing in front of an audience of expectant strangers – by adopting a babbling, deliberately awkward, vaguely nihilistic persona that is 50% me and 50% comic construct.

It's a shield of radioactive bullshit that hopefully provides just enough entertainment value to stop the crowd physically attacking me, and just enough psychological distance to stop me crumpling to the floor and ripping my own face off at the sheer uncomfortable weirdness of it all.

Thing is, this performance wouldn't withstand five minutes of serious scrutiny. I could open a supermarket, no problem, but sit me opposite a combative Jeremy Paxman and I'd have a massive nervous breakdown within five minutes. With Brown, it's the other way around. In the supermarket, he looked so anxious I half-expected him to climb inside a freezer compartment and refuse to come out until everyone else had left. In his interview with Paxman, held in the wake of the preposterous Bigotgate storm and a widely criticised final debate, he was frighteningly confident. At times, he even seemed to be enjoying himself. Technical in the social situation, sociable in the technical situation? That's the hallmark of a nerd. And most nerds are simply too gawky – gawky, not aloof – to connect with the general public.

So he's not endearing. The press held up Brown's Bigotgate outburst as evidence that he's two-faced and contemptuous of everyday people, especially those who mention immigration, a subject so taboo in modern Britain that even fearless defenders of free speech such as the Mail and the Express only dare mention it in hushed capitals tucked away on the front page of every edition.

Two-faced contempt is the basic mode of operation for many newspapers: mindwarping shitsheets filled with selective reporting and audacious bias. The popular press is a shrill, idiotic, bullying echo chamber; a hopelessly poisoned Petri dish in which our politicians seem resigned to grow. Little wonder they develop glaringly artificial public guises. Picking a modern leader boils down to a question of which false persona you prefer. At least Brown's is almost admirably crap. It's easy to see through it and catch hints of something awkwardly, weakly human beneath.

Clegg's persona is roughly 50% daytime soap, 40% human, and 10% statesman. Cameron is 100% something. He isn't even a man; more a texture-mapped character model. There's a different kind of software at work here, some advanced alien technology projecting a passable simulation of affability; a straight-to-DVD retread of the Blair ascendancy re-enacted by androids. Like an ostensibly realistic human character in a state-of-the-art CGI cartoon, he's almost convincing – assuming you can ignore the shrieking, cavernous lack of anything approaching a soul. Which you can't.

I see the sheen, the electronic calm, those tiny, expressionless eyes . . . I glimpse the outlines of the cloaking device and I instinctively recoil, like a baby tasting mould. Don't get me wrong. I don't see a power-crazed despot either. I almost wish I did. Instead, I see an avatar. A simulated man with a simulated face. A humanoid. A replicant. An Auton. A construct. A Carlton PR man who's arrived to run the country, and currently stands before us, blinking patiently, blank yet alert, quietly awaiting commencement of phase two. At which point, presumably, his real face may finally become visible.

The Grauniad

Sorta sums up what I've felt about the leaders. It's worrying I almost like Gordon Brown.