Jareth Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 On 24/02/2023 at 10:17, magnkarl said: As blandy wrote above, when Keir took over the party was a mess created by someone who should've never been allowed to be leader. This ignores the self sabotage that happened, by Labour HQ. Labour happily throwing out jewish members in droves too, still. And lots of talk about uncosted policies too - but they were all costed. Brush it under the carpet - but don't rewrite history - a shit ton of people will not forget what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Jareth said: This ignores the self sabotage that happened, by Labour HQ. Labour happily throwing out jewish members in droves too, still. And lots of talk about uncosted policies too - but they were all costed. Brush it under the carpet - but don't rewrite history - a shit ton of people will not forget what happened. JC lost two elections to two of the weakest, lying cheating governments in history. The JC wing needs to get over it or start their own party, the majority of the voters couldn’t stand him, and still show it in the polls. Starmer for all his faults is actually pushing the party into position while JC was busy cultivating his personality cult at Glastonbury and showing how innately naive he is at foreign policy. Edited February 25, 2023 by magnkarl 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 The media will decide who wins, just like they decided to tell the people Corbyn ate Jewish babies. They shovel it, people ask for more. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 1 minute ago, magnkarl said: JC lost two elections to two of the weakest, lying cheating governments in history. The JC wing needs to get over it or start their own party, the majority of the voters couldn’t stand him, and still show it in the polls. Starmer for all his faults is actually pushing the party into position while JC was busy cultivating his personality cult at Glastonbury. Er - what about the hung parliament? And again ignoring the Brexit effect - fascinated to have seen Starmer as leader pushing a second ref against Bozza in 2019. But can't argue that Starmer is doing everything right to get into power - given the opposition. Also agree the filthy racist lefties need to start their own party - have to say I'm not a lefty meself, but can't stand dirty tricks and blithe rewriting of history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Here's the Guardian on the Berger story - at the end - After her exit from Labour, Berger moved to the Independent Group of MPs, later joining the Liberal Democrats. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/25/luciana-berger-rejoins-labour-after-keir-starmers-antisemitism-apology Not a single mention of Change UK. This is a proper job on history. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 2 hours ago, chrisp65 said: The media will decide who wins, just like they decided to tell the people Corbyn ate Jewish babies. They shovel it, people ask for more. Look at the results. The mugged off still chat shit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Would also be fascinated to hear Labour's view on the censorship of Roald Dahl - it's a culture war issue right? Even the tart Queen consort has weighed in - an opinion on this, well nothing could be more shadowing the torys than that. But then Roald, despite the excellent Tales of the Unexpected, is an antisemite right? So why aren't they loudly saying so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Given Labour will presumably want to Berger to stand next year and will need a seat for her to run in, have they selected their candidate for Islington North yet? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Given Labour will presumably want to Berger to stand next year and will need a seat for her to run in, have they selected their candidate for Islington North yet? Hard agree - they should put it to the test. If you remember, none of Change UK resigned their seats, they just kept on. I'd definitely vote for someone so principled. But then Lucianna is such a delicate flower who needs protecting right? Edited February 25, 2023 by Jareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 26, 2023 Moderator Share Posted February 26, 2023 1 hour ago, Jareth said: Hard agree - they should put it to the test. If you remember, none of Change UK resigned their seats, they just kept on. I'd definitely vote for someone so principled. But then Lucianna is such a delicate flower who needs protecting right? Name the last MP to cross the floor that resigned as an MP? It doesn’t happen Why hasn't Corbin resigned his seat? He’s no longer a Labour MP, maybe he’s a delicate flower too. But considering the anti-Semitic hate Berger faced from her own party members, your comments are rather in bad taste. And before you say she made it up, she didn't, there are a group of former Militant supporters (who shouldn’t be in the party but someone let them back in) who really did abuse, known locally as the pot bangers, after they stood on the Picton Clock roundabout banging their saucepans for weeks on end. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 7 hours ago, bickster said: Name the last MP to cross the floor that resigned as an MP? It doesn’t happen Douglas Carswell to UKIP in 2014? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 (edited) 10 hours ago, Jareth said: Hard agree - they should put it to the test. If you remember, none of Change UK resigned their seats, they just kept on. I'd definitely vote for someone so principled. But then Lucianna is such a delicate flower who needs protecting right? Based on the constant put down of the actual events around Berger I presume you’ve never been the victim of racism? Even though Corbyn’s lot keeps trying to rewrite what happens, she was the victim of AS by people who supported Corbyn. It isn’t over-egging it one bit, and your comments are rather distasteful. Yes, some people (Hodge) did over-egg it, but there’s no denying that there’s been plenty of left wingers who’s had their fair share of anti-semitic incidents. Remember Chris Williamson or Alan Bull? I've been to a fair few Labour events myself where certain people (you can guess where from, starts with M) have heckled Jewish speakers with "ZIOOOO" over and over again. Some people just have a natural blind spot to racism against certain colours, it just doesn't match their colour vision. Edited February 26, 2023 by magnkarl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 So unfortunate how he always accidentally ends up in the same room as just the worst people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 44 minutes ago, magnkarl said: Based on the constant put down of the actual events around Berger I presume you’ve never been the victim of racism? Even though Corbyn’s lot keeps trying to rewrite what happens, she was the victim of AS by people who supported Corbyn. It isn’t over-egging it one bit, and your comments are rather distasteful. Yes, some people (Hodge) did over-egg it, but there’s no denying that there’s been plenty of left wingers who’s had their fair share of anti-semitic incidents. Remember Chris Williamson or Alan Bull? I've been to a fair few Labour events myself where certain people (you can guess where from, starts with M) have heckled Jewish speakers with "ZIOOOO" over and over again. Some people just have a natural blind spot to racism against certain colours, it just doesn't match their colour vision. Berger was abused by far right bastards, some of which were convicted for death threats - but please point me to the leftys that did the same - I clearly remember the intentional vagueness over who was throwing the abuse at the time, and it was never made clear who was behind it and that was entirely a political decision - to suit a political aim. Then we had Change UK. Shit to be an MP who gets abused, look at Jo Cox, but you cannot seriously try to say that Berger's abuse came from a far left - sure she got abused for being a tory - but that isn't antisemetic is it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 17 minutes ago, ml1dch said: So unfortunate how he always accidentally ends up in the same room as just the worst people. Also not a Labour MP - funny how he keeps popping up in the Labour thread, literally more often than the actual leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 26, 2023 Moderator Share Posted February 26, 2023 4 minutes ago, Jareth said: Berger was abused by far right bastards, some of which were convicted for death threats - but please point me to the leftys that did the same - I clearly remember the intentional vagueness over who was throwing the abuse at the time, and it was never made clear who was behind it and that was entirely a political decision - to suit a political aim. Then we had Change UK. Shit to be an MP who gets abused, look at Jo Cox, but you cannot seriously try to say that Berger's abuse came from a far left - sure she got abused for being a tory - but that isn't antisemetic is it? I already have pointed you in the direction of people from her own constituency - AKA the Pot Bangers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 2 minutes ago, bickster said: I already have pointed you in the direction of people from her own constituency - AKA the Pot Bangers Ah, pot bangers drove her out of the Labour party - odd that was never a headline. Also, she's now back in the Labour Party, are there still pot bangers banging pots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted February 26, 2023 Moderator Share Posted February 26, 2023 7 minutes ago, Jareth said: odd that was never a headline. What you mean like the chair chair of the CLP promoting antisemetic Rothschild conspiracy theories on a David Icke show? Or did you miss this? Quote Clare McIntyre, one of Labour’s three councillors in Wavertree, told me that she dreaded going to party meetings because she had been subjected to a campaign of harassment. Though an avowed socialist who has twice voted for Corbyn, she says she has fallen foul of the Momentum group which, according to her, has a stranglehold on the CLP executive. Her crime, she said, was to have supported Berger against antisemitic attacks – “I’ve seen up close the sheer level of abuse and racism she’s suffered” – and to question why Corbyn wasn’t doing more to tackle the issue. Guardian (more on link) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 1 minute ago, bickster said: What you mean like the chair chair of the CLP promoting antisemetic Rothschild conspiracy theories on a David Icke show? Or did you miss this? Guardian (more on link) And obvs that was used to say it was a party wide issue and that Labour was institutionally antisemetic. Meanwhile Bergers ally in charge of processing AS complaints was intentionally sitting on them to create an impression that Labour was institutionally AS. Then Change UK - of which it’s Labour contingent was centre right. This is and has always been left versus right with the right using AS as a football. Now the right is in power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Jareth said: Also not a Labour MP - funny how he keeps popping up in the Labour thread, literally more often than the actual leader. Stuff about disgraced former Tory MPs (Khan, Pincher, Parish et al) appears in the Tory thread. Stuff about the likes of O'Mara and Onasanya has been put in this thread. And I don't think he's really important enought to warrant a thread of his own. Edited February 26, 2023 by ml1dch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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