Bolitics UKIP Nutters

[rendelc]

You do know that the two main suspects are British nationals, right?

Of course . What has that got to do with Ukip ? 

[snowychap]

On this thread if you raise any concerns about immigration you are demonized .

It's a damn shame isn't it?

Seriously?

Are you really going to try and hide behind a claim of just 'raising concerns about immigration'?

You'll be claiming next that your deleted comment about muslims from the other night was merely 'raising concerns about personal hygiene'.

[StefanAVFC]

 

 

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/378232/Immigrant-crime-soars-with-foreign-prisoners-rising

 

Pick the above apart. Go on. I'm sure I'm in the wrong again.

 

600 people/63,000,000. when the figures are that small, a 40 percent rise sounds a lot, but realistically, it isn't.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2102895/Immigrant-crimewave-warning-Foreign-nationals-accused-QUARTER-crimes-London.html

 

Or this one. Sorry, I'm being lazy. I can't be bothered to type too much.

 

Accused. Not convicted. And you're talking about London. One place. Not representative of the whole nation.

 

 

Ok, sorry. Let 'em all in then eh? 

 

 

 

Who said that? You're focussing solely on the negatives of immigration without mentioning that immigration brings in skilled workers to do jobs that us British people just don't want to do. People come from impoverished circumstances and are able to maintain a better standard of living. You're saying that because of where you were born, you're entitled to a better standard of living? And somebody isn't allowed to move here to try and better their lifestyle? There is also (less importantly) the cultural benefits. In the wholly metropolitan world we live in today, a knowledge of how different cultures live can only be a benefit. And finally, immigration gives a huge boost to the economy. 

 

Now lets look at your negatives. Natives commit crimes too. Natives go on hateful marches through towns.

 

 

I'm not going to pull up any articles that prove my point. I'm not going to quote any stats. What I'm saying is very general and using a single piece (or 4 pieces) of very specific evidence doesn't really prove anything) Your problem is you're being so narrow-minded and using individual examples to prove your point. A few Muslim women march through a town so that makes immigration a bad thing? Can you HONESTLY not see how daft that is?

[Delphinho123]

You do know that the two main suspects are British nationals, right?

 

Yes. They would never have been if I was in power though.

[StefanAVFC]

 

 

On this thread if you raise any concerns about immigration you are demonized . 

 

Legitimate concerns? Just now is the first 'legitimate concern' we've heard. Before we were just told how I'm more dangerous than the BNP, the liberals have ruined this country and immigration has destroyed this country.

 

If they're legitimate concerns, then your standards are extremely low.

 

Yawn .    Here we go again .

 

 

Excellent retort. Please continue to enlighten me with your intelligent and well reasoned debate.

[StefanAVFC]

 

You do know that the two main suspects are British nationals, right?

 

Yes. They would never have been if I was in power though.

 

 

They were born in Britain. What would you have done with them when they were born?

[rendelc]

 

 

On this thread if you raise any concerns about immigration you are demonized .

It's a damn shame isn't it?

 

Seriously?

Are you really going to try and hide behind a claim of just 'raising concerns about immigration'?

You'll be claiming next that your deleted comment about muslims from the other night was merely 'raising concerns about personal hygiene'.

 

Me ?

[Delphinho123]

 

 

 

On this thread if you raise any concerns about immigration you are demonized . 

 

Legitimate concerns? Just now is the first 'legitimate concern' we've heard. Before we were just told how I'm more dangerous than the BNP, the liberals have ruined this country and immigration has destroyed this country.

 

If they're legitimate concerns, then your standards are extremely low.

 

Yawn .    Here we go again .

 

 

Excellent retort. Please continue to enlighten me with your intelligent and well reasoned debate.

 

 

Thats the thing though, we don't need to. That and we can't be bothered to argue with a man who lives in cloud cuckoo land.

 

 

You do know that the two main suspects are British nationals, right?

 

Yes. They would never have been if I was in power though.

 

 

They were born in Britain. What would you have done with them when they were born?

 

 

They'd never have been born in Britain. 

[StefanAVFC]

How do I live in cloud-cuckoo land? You still haven't told me.

 

Immigration HAPPENS. By denying the positives and focussing purely on the negatives aren't the one that isn't living in the real world? You know, the real world that has immigration.

 

Why would they have never been born in Britain? 

[PompeyVillan]

 

Both are right wing Tory supporting newspapers I might add, not that that would alter the integrity of any story they may publish...

 

and you are a left wing socialist. Not that that would alter the integrity of any counter-argument you may publish.

 

Round and round we go.

 

 

But if you can't read between the lines and question the sources that you're using to substantiate your argument, it does lead people to question the integrity of your argument. 

 

I skim read those articles, they don't wash with me. Have a closer look. 

 

They say we have more Polish prisoners since 2011. Perhaps, since 2011 we have more Polish immigrants to the country. If we have more Polish people, then it stands to reason that they'll be more prisons of that nationality. A better analysis would look at the % increase in Polish immigration and compare that the % increase in crime by Polish people. That would tell us, proportionally, whether Polish people are committing more crime than they were before. The author hasn't used this approach, because the way they've written it has more shock value and unfortunately, there are people out there that will believe what they read without questioning it. 

 

Romanians are responsible for 92% of ATM fraud. That sounds scary. 92% of what, how much ATM fraud is there each year? It may happen all the time, but the author doesn't know that. From my own anecdotal experience, I've never known anyone who has been defrauded at an ATM by a Romanian.

 

Etc, etc. 

 

The articles are full of half truths or 'facts and stats' that are spun and used and not questioned in order to suite the author's agenda. Personally, I like to question what I'm being told before I accept it as 'the truth', and when I question articles like the ones you posted, I find them ridden with a hateful and xenophobic agenda. 

[snowychap]

Me ?

Sorry - no, not you.

I see how that could have come about but no, the other poster.

[Delphinho123]

Right, I'm done here. Politics makes me angry.

 

[peterms]

They were born in Britain. What would you have done with them when they were born?

 

They'd never have been born in Britain.

Your first act in power would be to commission a time machine? Interesting.

[StefanAVFC]

Xenophobia and ignorance makes me angry.

Edited May 27, 2013 by StefanAVFC

[snowychap]

You do know that the two main suspects are British nationals, right?

Yes. They would never have been if I was in power though.

They were born in Britain. What would you have done with them when they were born?

They'd never have been born in Britain.

And what do you mean by that?

[drat01]

 

 

They'd never have been born in Britain. 

 

Intrigued - how exactly would you have made sure they were not born in Britain?

Edited May 27, 2013 by drat01

[Chindie]

On this thread if you raise any concerns about immigration you are demonized .

Legitimate concerns? Just now is the first 'legitimate concern' we've heard. Before we were just told how I'm more dangerous than the BNP, the liberals have ruined this country and immigration has destroyed this country.

If they're legitimate concerns, then your standards are extremely low.

Yawn . Here we go again .

Excellent retort. Please continue to enlighten me with your intelligent and well reasoned debate.

Thats the thing though, we don't need to. That and we can't be bothered to argue with a man who lives in cloud cuckoo land.

You do know that the two main suspects are British nationals, right?

Yes. They would never have been if I was in power though.

They were born in Britain. What would you have done with them when they were born?

They'd never have been born in Britain.

What'd be your reasoning for not allowing their parents into the country?

[StefanAVFC]

 

 

They were born in Britain. What would you have done with them when they were born?

 

They'd never have been born in Britain.

 

Your first act in power would be to commission a time machine? Interesting.

 

 

Spot on. What grounds would they have not been born here? He gets asked questions then buggers off without an explanation. If you have to label somebody who actually articulates their point of view as a 'liberal' or 'leftie' then you don't have much of an argument.

[snowychap]

How do I live in cloud-cuckoo land?

Do you share a border with cloud nine?

[villaajax]

I don't expect we'll get an answer on why the family wouldn't allowed in under Delphinho's hypothetical leadership. I'm sure we can speculate as to why.