BOF Posted August 10, 2012 Moderator Share Posted August 10, 2012 A church is where people go to pray. Surely you do not have to be in a church to pray ? According to Matthew 6:5 there is no place for churches in Christianity. You must not pray in public.By the by, that's a PussEKatt quote, not a BOF quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted August 10, 2012 Author VT Supporter Share Posted August 10, 2012 (From Wikipedia's Jonathan Edwards entry, with a shortlink-resistant url): He initially refused to compete on Sundays due to his devout Christian beliefs, a decision which cost him a chance to compete in the 1991 World Championships. However in 1993, after much deliberation and discussion with his father (a vicar), he changed his mind, deciding that God gave him his talent in order for him to compete in athletics. He once said "My relationship with Jesus and God is fundamental to everything I do. I have made a commitment and dedication in that relationship to serve God in every area of my life." Edwards presented episodes of the Christian television show Songs of Praise until 2007. However, in February 2007 it was widely reported that Edwards had lost his faith in God. The Daily Mail described Edwards as a "man deeply troubled by the collapse of his Christian faith" but revealed that a friend said "They still go to church as a family" The Daily Mail article also quoted Edwards as saying that he was going through a difficult period in his life, one that was deeply personal to him and his family such that he did not wish to comment on it. In an interview in The Times in June 2007, Edwards said: "If there is no God, does that mean that life has no purpose? Does it mean that personal existence ends at death? They are thoughts that do my head in. One thing that I can say, however, is that even if I am unable to discover some fundamental purpose to life, this will not give me a reason to return to Christianity. Just because something is unpalatable does not mean that it is not true." Furthermore, in the interview with The Times he also stated "When you think about it rationally, it does seem incredibly improbable that there is a God." In the same interview he also said "I feel internally happier than at any time of my life." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I completely agree wih Edwards on the being happier aspect . The realisation that you aren't a metaphsical slave is very liberating . After years of reflection I came to the conclusion that not only is religion not true , but there is no good reason to want it to be true. If it were true and you were a creation of a higher entity, who punishes or rewards you in regards to your behaviour or belief, then you are nothing more than a slave. You are property . An ant on an ant farm created for your owners amusement . The lure of an afterlife offers me no inspiration either . An eternity of anything would be incomprehensible and it is more than likely that the time after your death will be like the endless billions of years before your death . Just nothing . And that is more comforting than an infinite amount of time worshipping something. The whole idea of being subservient to anything just doesn't seem right to me and I can not believe that the whole of reality is based on such a concept. There are a bucket load of other reasons upon why I don't believe in a God but the reasons I have just gave were very compelling to me. Life has no meaning or purpose. You create your own and therein lies the true beauty of life. You have one life and that's it. You should spend it trying to be as happy as possible with people you love and endeavouring to make them happy too. Do not forsake this one opportunity believeing a lie in the hope that you get another go when the lights go out. Evangelicals will tell you they are trying to save people from despair when in reality it is they who need saving the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted August 10, 2012 Author VT Supporter Share Posted August 10, 2012 It must have been tough for Jonathan Edwards, with his dad being a vicar and his wife a strong believer. He said on TV that he thinks his (then) faith undoubtedly inspired him to his sporting successes, even though he doesn't believe in any of it now. I'm impressed by the way he thought it through and made the change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legov Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 That's right, Meseret Defar, the Virgin Mary made you win. Funny how she didn't seem to bother about the other runners though. Really, intercessory prayer is so egotistical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 That's right, Meseret Defar, the Virgin Mary made you win. Funny how she didn't seem to bother about the other runners though. Really, intercessory prayer is so egotistical. Indeed . God spends more time helping Tim Tebow throw touchdowns than he does preventing suffering it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted August 10, 2012 Author VT Supporter Share Posted August 10, 2012 That's right, Meseret Defar, the Virgin Mary made you win. Funny how she didn't seem to bother about the other runners though. Really, intercessory prayer is so egotistical.Indeed. Shouldn't the truly humble Christian pray only on behalf of others, and ask for punishment for his unworthy self? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 That's right, Meseret Defar, the Virgin Mary made you win. Funny how she didn't seem to bother about the other runners though. Really, intercessory prayer is so egotistical.Indeed. Shouldn't the truly humble Christian pray only on behalf of others, and ask for punishment for his unworthy self? As Jesus would have done. Jesus was awesome(regardless of his existence). His fan club on the other hand are the most hypocritical group of people in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legov Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Was I too harsh? She was so emotional during the victory ceremony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PussEKatt Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Not sure if this should be in the "things that piss you off " thread or this one. Relegious people that knock on your door "spreading the word of God" What is that all about ??? I mean if they really think they can convert you that way then what about the next relegious lot that come knocking on your door ? Will they convert you again. ! I mean, if it is that easy to convert a person then you could follow a different relegion every second day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted August 13, 2012 Moderator Share Posted August 13, 2012 God spends more time helping Tim Tebow throw touchdowns than he does preventing suffering it seems. He better not help him so much this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted August 13, 2012 Author VT Supporter Share Posted August 13, 2012 Not sure if this should be in the "things that piss you off " thread or this one. Relegious people that knock on your door "spreading the word of God" What is that all about ??? I mean if they really think they can convert you that way then what about the next relegious lot that come knocking on your door ? Will they convert you again. ! I mean, if it is that easy to convert a person then you could follow a different relegion every second day.Don't try and attribute rational thought to these people, it doesn't apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazdavies79 Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I can't be bothered listening to anything that man (Hitchens) had to say on religion any more. A complete islamaphobe and one of the most outspoken supporters of Tony and George's bloody rampage through Iraq and Afghanistan. A spokesman for atheism? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
limpid Posted August 17, 2012 Administrator Share Posted August 17, 2012 I think you are going to need to defend those accusations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Hitchens is a legend. Love this damning verdict on the death of the twisted http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52yTqMcwuQE. Doesn't beat around the bush at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazdavies79 Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I think you are going to need to defend those accusations. Well if someone wants to challenge them directly I will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted August 17, 2012 Moderator Share Posted August 17, 2012 I think you are going to need to defend those accusations. Well if someone wants to challenge them directly I will. An islamaphobe that is also an anti-zionist? That is indeed a novel position. Yes he supported the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, that does not make him an islamaphobe though. He's also been highly critical of Bliar and Bush (esp speaking out about the US's use of waterboarding as an interrogation technique - he considers it torture) so he hardly an ally of either of them. When it comes to religion he often talks sense, when it comes to politics, he often talk bollocks But an actual islamaphobe? no, sorry I can't see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazdavies79 Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 He held a deep prejudice against Muslims, so much so he thought an indiscriminate killing spree in Islamic countries was a worthy course of action, does than not qualify as Islamophobia? To be fair he had many phobias you could level against him, at least he was consistent in his hate. I never said he was a supporter of Blair or Bush, but he very much supported the war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted August 17, 2012 Moderator Share Posted August 17, 2012 He held a deep prejudice against Muslims, so much so he thought an indiscriminate killing spree in Islamic countries was a worthy course of action, does than not qualify as Islamophobia? To be fair he had many phobias you could level against him, at least he was consistent in his hate. I never said he was a supporter of Blair or Bush, but he very much supported the war. He held a deep prejudice against all religions, so no, that doesn't count as islamaphobia. You can't be an islamaphobe and defend the Palestinian right to self determination, nor would you openly speak out about the waterboarding of Islamic "terror" suspects in Guantanamo. Supporting a war does not make you an islamaphobe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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