Big_John_10 Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Mantis... Theres a difference between being negative and not having the players to play freeflowing attacking football. We fall in the category of not having the players. Imo. We have one of the best strikers in the prem. Gabby, Ireland and nzogbia are all good attacking players that most top half teams would love to have in their squad. Also no one thinks instantly we would be better. However many people think a better coach and manager would improve our style of play and our results. There is nothing to indicate that we will improve under Mcleish if he is given time or money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 So are we saying Mcallister is a better manager than Houllier???? Come on now... He is showing how a change can lead to an improvement. I notice you ignore his MON and Di Matteo examples also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 How do people KNOW we will suddenly be better once he goes?? I mean, everybody thought we would improve instantly once Houllier left. Look what happened. Im not mocking anybody btw. Im just trying to offer an alternative viewpoint to the usual dross thats took up 700+ pages in this threadActually, not everyone thought we'd automatically improve once Houllier left. I didn't. However, the ones that did thought so because they thought we'd get a better manager. As it happened we ended up with one of the worst Premier League managers ever. Mantis... Theres a difference between being negative and not having the players to play freeflowing attacking football. We fall in the category of not having the players. Imo.Who said anything about free-flowing attacking football? I know we don't have the players for that. However, you don't need world class superstars to show a bit of positivity when approaching games. Under McLeish that's something we rarely do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 You sort of backed up my point there foreveryoung. Di Matteo. Was shite at west brom and got sacked. Takes over at Chelsea and suddenly hes a great manager. What more proof do you need that you can only work with the tools you are given?? Albion : shit tools. Chelsea: good tools. We wont start playing good football and winning games until we get some better tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 So are we saying Mcallister is a better manager than Houllier???? Come on now... Maybe not, but maybe they wanted to play for McAllister and had enough of Houllier. This team will never improve under McLeish, its not changed since the begining of the season, I also worry about the youth under McLeish, he's not much of a development/tactical manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Big John...hate to break this to you but Ireland is shite. Theres a reason that nobody bar MLS teams will touch him with a bargepole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Big John...hate to break this to you but Ireland is shite. Theres a reason that nobody bar MLS teams will touch him with a bargepole. Yes ok. You say he's shite and that means we need to accept the shit delivered to us by Mcleish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 How do people KNOW we will suddenly be better once he goes?? I mean, everybody thought we would improve instantly once Houllier left. Look what happened To be fair nobody could have predicted that Lerner would hire such an unambitious, clueless and negative manager as McLeish and probably thought that 'once bitten etc.' he would go out and get someone half decent to manage us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 You sort of backed up my point there foreveryoung. Di Matteo. Was shite at west brom and got sacked. Takes over at Chelsea and suddenly hes a great manager. What more proof do you need that you can only work with the tools you are given?? Albion : shit tools. Chelsea: good tools. We wont start playing good football and winning games until we get some better tools.Wait, are you trying to suggest that this woeful season we've had is the best we can expect under the current circumstances? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozvillafan Posted April 8, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted April 8, 2012 Big John...hate to break this to you but Ireland is shite. Theres a reason that nobody bar MLS teams will touch him with a bargepole. Ireland ends most games with a sore neck. It's hard spending the entire game watching the ball sail over your head off the boot of Collins, Bannan and co. He'd do better if he had players around him who could retain possession and keep it on the ground like he does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 You sort of backed up my point there foreveryoung. Di Matteo. Was shite at west brom and got sacked. Takes over at Chelsea and suddenly hes a great manager. What more proof do you need that you can only work with the tools you are given?? Albion : shit tools. Chelsea: good tools. We wont start playing good football and winning games until we get some better tools.Wait, are you trying to suggest that this woeful season we've had is the best we can expect under the current circumstances? Amazingly there seem to be fans who think this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Pretty much. It was the same last season and that was with a different manager and better players. I dont see how sacking Mcleish will suddenly change our inabiltiy to string 3 passes together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Pretty much. It was the same last season and that was with a different manager and better players. I dont see how sacking Mcleish will suddenly change our inabiltiy to string 3 passes together Ok then. Well it was the same players the year before houllier and we had one of our best seasons in years. How do you explain that? Houllier doing an awful job doesn't excuse the shit Mcleish is serving up. We're just very unfortunate that we have an owner who has **** up both his managerial appointments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Big John...hate to break this to you but Ireland is shite. Theres a reason that nobody bar MLS teams will touch him with a bargepole. Ireland ends most games with a sore neck. It's hard spending the entire game watching the ball sail over your head off the boot of Collins, Bannan and co. He'd do better if he had players around him who could retain possession and keep it on the ground like he does. You cant blame mcleish for Collins having the footballing ability of an ape. Him hoofing the ball upfield every time it comes near him cant be coached out of him. Its engrained into his DNA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 We probably won't get significantly better, but we'd definitely be winning more and we'd have more points on the board. How many points better off do you think we would have been had McLeish's attitude towards games were more positive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Pretty much. It was the same last season and that was with a different manager and better players. I dont see how sacking Mcleish will suddenly change our inabiltiy to string 3 passes togetherThat's ridiculous. The tools you have do not affect your approach to the game. McLeish's approach is clearly a negative one. It doesn't have to be. Look at MON at Sunderland. I hate the man but the look at how much better they've been since he took over. He's had the exact same tools as Bruce yet they're doing so much better. Your logic is flawed. As I said, this time last season we were in a relegation battle. Was that the best that could be expected under the circumstances? If it was, what about when we went on to finish 9th? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Pretty much. It was the same last season and that was with a different manager and better players. I dont see how sacking Mcleish will suddenly change our inabiltiy to string 3 passes together You did'nt really answer my previous question. Would you be happy to keep McLeish and give him 50-60 million to spend in the summer on a clear out. Is he the way forward with better players?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 We aint got 50-60 million to spend so its a bit pointless answeing that question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Let's see how he sets up for stoke With all the injury problems, 3 points would be a real feather in his cap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 I'm sorry but McLeish is such a poor manager, he'd turn Barca into a mid-table team. It's not the personnel, it's the manner he uses them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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