The, he's finally GONE! Tell us your thoughts Thread

[djamfisher]

thanks good reply. I would ask a question though, why do you think people like me don't like him mainly because he managed the blues. I admit I hate the blues, but his being a blues manager previously has absolutely no bearing on how I feel about him now. In stark contrast I would love him to be successful just so I can turn around to my blue nose mates and gloat that we pinched a great thing from them who will be a legend at our club. So if anything him being at blues and we pinching him I want him to succeed to rub it in my mates faces. Failure they can just say they sold us a lemon. Surely that makes more sense than me wanting him to fail.

His record is my issue, how his teams play, he is unimagative, he makes constant errors, he can't react when other manages do, he's not fixing problems that are happening over and over again, international players don't seem to know what to do, tactics seem one dimensional at best and can't change, his excuses are pitiful and we generally 9 times out of 10 look the poorer team in games......that's my reasoning and that's why I want him gone now. I want to build on a team with a manager over the next 5 to 10 years as we go through this phase we are in with money restrictions.

We, as fans, need to believe in a manager that can do that but with McLeish we can't and the fans seem to be agreeing with me....low crowds, booing at games, forums in meltdown and media commenting.....it's so detrimental to the club that it has to change now or more likely the summer so this club can consolidate and build for the future. McLeish is not the answer and will never be because too many people don't think he's good enough and he isn't, I'm not backing a manager just because I hear the term we need to get behind him....getting behind the wrong person is just foolish. If there is a problem you fix it and move on, we have a problem and it needs fixing before we can move on.

1. AMs past...... when you have 200 Villa fans breaking into Villa Park live on SSN chanting "We Don't Want McLeish" it shows there is a problem. When on camera the guy interviewed says "It a'int about the blouse" when he has "SOTC" written on both sleeves and across his chest you become suspicious about peoples motives. There are too many fans motivated by a hatred of a nothing club that play in a cow shed rather than a desire to support their own team. Which I find pathetic. After all, if we refused to take on ex-blousers we wouldn't have won the European Cup. {quote]

Exactly so why employ him, just becasue 1 bloke has SOTC on his sleeves, really doesn't mean a lot does it really, just banter, probably had that on his top months before that story broke.

Villa fans know exactly about Saunders' past before the Villa that's why employing ex-noses wouldn't be a problem were they qualifies enough. Simple fact is there were better people out there. Like i've said I'd rather take a gamble on a slightly unproven manager that 1 with a track record of relegation.

[Eames]

I'll answer happily.

I think the abuse AM has recieved is pathetic. I think that the attitude of some fans on here is pathetic. The real reason people have a problem with AM is that he used to manage the Blues. His style of football is workmanlike but do you know what.... I'm not sure how else we are supposed to play having sold Downing and Young over the summer.

I think AM needs to be given time to put HIS mark on the team and that will take 2 years, especially with the spending restrictions he is subject to.

I think that posters who resort to "what a clearing in the woods" "Ginger word removed" and other arguements devoid of reasoning or sense need to have a word with themselves.

I appreciate I am in the minority but do you know what, I like the guy... and I really hope he succeeds.

Eames, are you referring to all the fans that don't rate or want McLeish as manager or just those that have slagged him off.

Because, I really didn't want him at the start of the season and still don't want him now. You say his style of football is workmanlike and question how else is he suppose to play. Yet I'd say that his style is 1 dimensional and he is tactically inept, and he has proved that over a number of years. I don’t see how this could be seen as being pathetic.

Secondly, no Villa fan I know has really used the ex-blues thing to criticise him, it's more to do with his shocking premier league record and the fact he got Rangers 3rd in a 2 horse race.

He states he isn’t a quitter yet he quit the Blues, and has set the Villa up on a number of occasions in such a way where we’ve given up hope of even trying to get a goal before a ball has been kicked. This is a mentality of a quitter.

I'm refering to the "fans" whose level of debate is "he's ginger" or "he's a word removed" Criticise him absolutely, but lets try doing it on the basis of his results and tactis shall we?

For the record I didn't want him either. But he's here. Randy clearly doesn't feel inclined to get rid so why don't we get behind him?

Was he tactically inept when we beat Chelsea? Or when we were 2-0 up against Arsenal on Saturday? We will lose games. We always have done. MON lost his fair share of stupid games that we should have won, it happens.

And on the point of quitting the Blues? No he didn't quit. We offered him a job. He accepted it. Would I have liked to see more attacking football from him? Yes. But no manager sends a team out to lose. They send a team out to get the best result they can. If the plan goes wrong... so be it.

[nick76]

thanks good reply. I would ask a question though, why do you think people like me don't like him mainly because he managed the blues. I admit I hate the blues, but his being a blues manager previously has absolutely no bearing on how I feel about him now. In stark contrast I would love him to be successful just so I can turn around to my blue nose mates and gloat that we pinched a great thing from them who will be a legend at our club. So if anything him being at blues and we pinching him I want him to succeed to rub it in my mates faces. Failure they can just say they sold us a lemon. Surely that makes more sense than me wanting him to fail.

His record is my issue, how his teams play, he is unimagative, he makes constant errors, he can't react when other manages do, he's not fixing problems that are happening over and over again, international players don't seem to know what to do, tactics seem one dimensional at best and can't change, his excuses are pitiful and we generally 9 times out of 10 look the poorer team in games......that's my reasoning and that's why I want him gone now. I want to build on a team with a manager over the next 5 to 10 years as we go through this phase we are in with money restrictions.

We, as fans, need to believe in a manager that can do that but with McLeish we can't and the fans seem to be agreeing with me....low crowds, booing at games, forums in meltdown and media commenting.....it's so detrimental to the club that it has to change now or more likely the summer so this club can consolidate and build for the future. McLeish is not the answer and will never be because too many people don't think he's good enough and he isn't, I'm not backing a manager just because I hear the term we need to get behind him....getting behind the wrong person is just foolish. If there is a problem you fix it and move on, we have a problem and it needs fixing before we can move on.

1. AMs past...... when you have 200 Villa fans breaking into Villa Park live on SSN chanting "We Don't Want McLeish" it shows there is a problem. When on camera the guy interviewed says "It a'int about the blouse" when he has "SOTC" written on both sleeves and across his chest you become suspicious about peoples motives. There are too many fans motivated by a hatred of a nothing club that play in a cow shed rather than a desire to support their own team. Which I find pathetic. After all, if we refused to take on ex-blousers we wouldn't have won the European Cup.

2. Style of football..... like I said... workmanlike. Makes the best of what he's got and what he can get hold of. The one thing MON is outstanding at is getting average players to play like world class ones. AM does not have that ability. We are at our true level. Dunne makes mistakes, and for what ever reason he doesn't seem to fancy Cuellar. Thats fine. I trust him. He's got the coaching badges not me. We sold our two best players over the summer and have not replaced them so we were never ever going to move forward.

3. His record.... YES he steered the blues down... twice. They have always yo-yo'd up and down the divisions. You can't polish a turd. They are shite. They will always be shite whoevers in charge. Hughton getting them back up is not an achievement when they are one of the richest clubs in the Championship with a stack or parachute payments. BUT he took that shower of shite to a Carling Cup Final and won it. MON didn't manage to do that.

4. The fans.... the fans not believing AM will go anywhere IS problem. Not AM himself. He hasn't been given a fair crack of the whip and as I said in my OP he needs time to put his mark on the squad, and given that Randy clearly isn't handing out the levels of cash MON enjoyed that will take time. The players at home look shit scared because every mistake they make the crowd turns on them and AM. (See point 1) If walked into my office and told my staff that everyone thinks they are shit and pounce on every mistake with a barrage of abuse, my team wouldn't perform. Its the same thing here at Villa Park.

Having paid £10m in compensation to MON and GH plus back room staff, AM is here for the duration of his contract whether the fans like it or not. My suggestion? Get over it. Support your team. Stop the booing and the moaning.

I respect your opinion and I agree with parts but don't agree with others but it's a healthy debate. I do support my team though and I don't boo but outside of games I will moan because I want the best for my club and IMO McLeish is detrimental to that so I will continue outside of games to moan until he either proves me wrong or more likely he is booted out. I will not accept the status quo just because it is the easy option

[P3te]

I'd rather take a gamble on a slightly unproven manager that 1 with a track record of relegation.

redknapp had a track record of relegation

[nick76]

I wanted to be the next Villa manager, does that mean when Alex is fired I will get the job

Well, Nick, what are your credentials?

oh the pressure now well I've never been relegated...good start! I want the job! Ermmmm......I won a raffle once

How did I do?

[Eames]

I respect your opinion and I agree with parts but don't agree with others but it's a healthy debate. I do support my team though and I don't boo but outside of games I will moan because I want the best for my club and IMO McLeish is detrimental to that so I will continue outside of games to moan until he either proves me wrong or more likely he is booted out. I will not accept the status quo just because it is the easy option

But booing AT games isn't supporting the team. Thats my point. (But I would be worried if you DID boo outside games...... in fact I'd have you detained under the Mental Health Act)

I don't accept the status quo either.... we just disagree on the best way to change things.....

[djamfisher]

Having paid £10m in compensation to MON and GH plus back room staff, AM is here for the duration of his contract whether the fans like it or not. My suggestion? Get over it. Support your team. Stop the booing and the moaning.

Eames if fans aren't happy with spending their hard earned cash because they genuinely believe nothing but gloomy days are coming due to the poor quality of managmeent employed surely they are entitled to voice their frustrations, or keep their money in their pocket. I have no complaints with those people staying away or voicing their frustrations, if you think someone's taking you for a fool, you don't go back and let them do it again.

Some people will say your blinded by your faith in Lerner.

why spend an extra 2mill on a bloke barely anyone wanted? Lerner must've knew what was coming.

i genuinely have concerns McLeish will deliver nothing, if he is given time, other than lower league finishes (13-17). Maybe worse.

[Stu_The_Villan]

Did they even try people like C Hughton, I know his a nose now so people will scuff at this, but I honestly believe he'll do a good job at Blues. He did a good job at Newcastle, and believe he's more tactically aware than McLeish and would've done well at Villa.

Eh??

He got them promotion from the championship and then got sacked halfway through his first season in the prem.

AM gets Blues promoted from championship and leads them to a 9th placed finish and a cup, yet he did a worse job there than Hughton did at Newcastle?

Cant have it both ways mate. You give Hughton credit for promotion from championship but cant give it to Mcleish for better achievements.

Is it just because hes ginger?

[GarethRDR]

oh the pressure now well I've never been relegated...good start! I want the job! Ermmmm......I won a raffle once

How did I do?

Naturally I'm impressed with the raffle win, but I'm not seeing much in the way of football to pique my interest here. I need specifics; Sunday league achievements? Junior 5-a-side trophies? That time at school you volleyed a 30 yard screamer past the fat kid goalie? C'mon, really sell yourself here.

[Eames]

Did they even try people like C Hughton, I know his a nose now so people will scuff at this, but I honestly believe he'll do a good job at Blues. He did a good job at Newcastle, and believe he's more tactically aware than McLeish and would've done well at Villa.

Eh??

He got them promotion from the championship and then got sacked halfway through his first season in the prem.

AM gets Blues promoted from championship and leads them to a 9th placed finish and a cup, yet he did a worse job there than Hughton did at Newcastle?

Cant have it both ways mate. You give Hughton credit for promotion from championship but cant give it to Mcleish for better achievements.

Is it just because hes ginger?

Superb point. The prosecution rests.

[djamfisher]

I'd rather take a gamble on a slightly unproven manager that 1 with a track record of relegation.

redknapp had a track record of relegation

And?

He also had a decent record at Pompey and has a track record of playing good attacking football and bringing through the youth.

[Pricey_1984]

thanks good reply. I would ask a question though, why do you think people like me don't like him mainly because he managed the blues. I admit I hate the blues, but his being a blues manager previously has absolutely no bearing on how I feel about him now. In stark contrast I would love him to be successful just so I can turn around to my blue nose mates and gloat that we pinched a great thing from them who will be a legend at our club. So if anything him being at blues and we pinching him I want him to succeed to rub it in my mates faces. Failure they can just say they sold us a lemon. Surely that makes more sense than me wanting him to fail.

His record is my issue, how his teams play, he is unimagative, he makes constant errors, he can't react when other manages do, he's not fixing problems that are happening over and over again, international players don't seem to know what to do, tactics seem one dimensional at best and can't change, his excuses are pitiful and we generally 9 times out of 10 look the poorer team in games......that's my reasoning and that's why I want him gone now. I want to build on a team with a manager over the next 5 to 10 years as we go through this phase we are in with money restrictions.

We, as fans, need to believe in a manager that can do that but with McLeish we can't and the fans seem to be agreeing with me....low crowds, booing at games, forums in meltdown and media commenting.....it's so detrimental to the club that it has to change now or more likely the summer so this club can consolidate and build for the future. McLeish is not the answer and will never be because too many people don't think he's good enough and he isn't, I'm not backing a manager just because I hear the term we need to get behind him....getting behind the wrong person is just foolish. If there is a problem you fix it and move on, we have a problem and it needs fixing before we can move on.

1. AMs past...... when you have 200 Villa fans breaking into Villa Park live on SSN chanting "We Don't Want McLeish" it shows there is a problem. When on camera the guy interviewed says "It a'int about the blouse" when he has "SOTC" written on both sleeves and across his chest you become suspicious about peoples motives. There are too many fans motivated by a hatred of a nothing club that play in a cow shed rather than a desire to support their own team. Which I find pathetic. After all, if we refused to take on ex-blousers we wouldn't have won the European Cup.

2. Style of football..... like I said... workmanlike. Makes the best of what he's got and what he can get hold of. The one thing MON is outstanding at is getting average players to play like world class ones. AM does not have that ability. We are at our true level. Dunne makes mistakes, and for what ever reason he doesn't seem to fancy Cuellar. Thats fine. I trust him. He's got the coaching badges not me. We sold our two best players over the summer and have not replaced them so we were never ever going to move forward.

3. His record.... YES he steered the blues down... twice. They have always yo-yo'd up and down the divisions. You can't polish a turd. They are shite. They will always be shite whoevers in charge. Hughton getting them back up is not an achievement when they are one of the richest clubs in the Championship with a stack or parachute payments. BUT he took that shower of shite to a Carling Cup Final and won it. MON didn't manage to do that.

4. The fans.... the fans not believing AM will go anywhere IS problem. Not AM himself. He hasn't been given a fair crack of the whip and as I said in my OP he needs time to put his mark on the squad, and given that Randy clearly isn't handing out the levels of cash MON enjoyed that will take time. The players at home look shit scared because every mistake they make the crowd turns on them and AM. (See point 1) If walked into my office and told my staff that everyone thinks they are shit and pounce on every mistake with a barrage of abuse, my team wouldn't perform. Its the same thing here at Villa Park.

Having paid £10m in compensation to MON and GH plus back room staff, AM is here for the duration of his contract whether the fans like it or not. My suggestion? Get over it. Support your team. Stop the booing and the moaning.

well said mate.

[djamfisher]

Did they even try people like C Hughton, I know his a nose now so people will scuff at this, but I honestly believe he'll do a good job at Blues. He did a good job at Newcastle, and believe he's more tactically aware than McLeish and would've done well at Villa.

Eh??

He got them promotion from the championship and then got sacked halfway through his first season in the prem.

AM gets Blues promoted from championship and leads them to a 9th placed finish and a cup, yet he did a worse job there than Hughton did at Newcastle?

Cant have it both ways mate. You give Hughton credit for promotion from championship but cant give it to Mcleish for better achievements.

Is it just because hes ginger?

Newcastle were 9th when he got sacked, it wasn't his fault. Ashley had a plan in place and acted it on it. How was that Hughton's fault. Nothing in his record so far suggests he's a poor manager.

2 relegations in 3 years, and a 3rd place finish in Scotland with rangers suggest a poor record.

This is my opinion remember, sadly people like Eames can't respect that.

[wiggyrichard]

I'd rather take a gamble on a slightly unproven manager that 1 with a track record of relegation.

redknapp had a track record of relegation

And?

He also had a decent record at Pompey and has a track record of playing good attacking football and bringing through the youth.

Bringing through the youth? No he doesnt!

[P3te]

right, so a track record for relegation isn't everything. that's what you're saying? just to clarify? that doesn't necessarily make a manager bad, yes?

[djamfisher]

Did they even try people like C Hughton, I know his a nose now so people will scuff at this, but I honestly believe he'll do a good job at Blues. He did a good job at Newcastle, and believe he's more tactically aware than McLeish and would've done well at Villa.

Eh??

He got them promotion from the championship and then got sacked halfway through his first season in the prem.

AM gets Blues promoted from championship and leads them to a 9th placed finish and a cup, yet he did a worse job there than Hughton did at Newcastle?

Cant have it both ways mate. You give Hughton credit for promotion from championship but cant give it to Mcleish for better achievements.

Is it just because hes ginger?

Superb point. The prosecution rests.

Sadly it doesn't.

[wiggyrichard]

Did they even try people like C Hughton, I know his a nose now so people will scuff at this, but I honestly believe he'll do a good job at Blues. He did a good job at Newcastle, and believe he's more tactically aware than McLeish and would've done well at Villa.

Eh??

He got them promotion from the championship and then got sacked halfway through his first season in the prem.

AM gets Blues promoted from championship and leads them to a 9th placed finish and a cup, yet he did a worse job there than Hughton did at Newcastle?

Cant have it both ways mate. You give Hughton credit for promotion from championship but cant give it to Mcleish for better achievements.

Is it just because hes ginger?

Superb point. The prosecution rests.

At the end of the day, AM never had a cat in hells chance of winning the fans over. You only have to look through this thread to see that. The are poster on this site that will never warm to AM regardless of what he achieves.

[Denis_B]

djamfisher wrote

Villa fans know exactly about Saunders' past before the Villa that's why employing ex-noses wouldn't be a problem were they qualifies enough.

All your credibility has gone mate if you think Sir Ron came from the B-lose! - I think the OP meant Peter Withe #getyoutfactsright

[Richard]

we will always be between 6th & 10th

We wont even be doing that this season I'm afraid.

Your support of Mcleish, though admirable, is at best misplaced

Given our current league position, I would say your prediction that we wont be finishing 6th - 10th could be deemed misplaced as well Richard

Well Tom we will certainly see but given that we are currently outside that 6-10 position, have a quite appalling home record and have not strengthened in key areas or in fact any areas for the remainder of the season, for me it doesn't look promising.

[wiggyrichard]

right, so a track record for relegation isn't everything. that's what you're saying? just to clarify? that doesn't necessarily make a manager bad, yes?

With a shit team, no it doesnt make him a bad manager. If someone took over at Spurs now and got them relegated then that would constitute a bad manager.

Brings us back to the whole, who is best...McLeish or Martinez? The table doesnt lie, yet everyone want Martinez.