Darren Bent

[Woodytom]

All McLeish's appointment has highlighted is the best way to waste the talents of one of our best players.

Is Darren Bent not 1% responsible (at least) for his pathetically woeful form this season? Or are you sleeping with him or summit?

Pathetically woeful form? It's not been great but it's certainly not been that bad either. Get some perspective.

I don't know, has Bent been sleeping with your girlfriend? You seem to hate him so much.

Other than the games hes scored in, hes been awful - which is what I said about him in January. offers nothing unless he scores. Hes not been scoring so hes offered nothing. For 20m and 70k a week I expect much much more.

Dont hate him at all.

He's being isolated by our shit manager's tactics. That's the problem.

Even last season you never stopped criticising him.

Could he have scored more this season?? Yes or No

Im thinking Newcastle, Sunderland, Bolton for starts!

[Mantis]

Of course he could. However, in a season where he's been largely starved of service, I don't think 5 goals by December is all that bad, especially when you consider that he's missed a fair few games with injury.

[VillaAndLoyal]

Oh on this point about us not missing him....

If he had been playing the other night at Stoke we would probably have won because he would have been on hand when Sorenson spilled that freekick from N'Zogbia. McLeish himself was bemoaning the fact nobody had the hunger to score, that nobody had followed in, that nobody had the poachers instinct.

Well Bent has it and had he been on the pitch I think he would have scored and probably won.

We would have less points this season without Bent and his goals and we have less points because of his injury, to say we don't miss him when he isn't playing is none sense in my view.

Don't want it to come across as picking holes in your post, as I agree with a lot of what you and Woodytom have said. But I would like to pick up on this point, as many, included McLeish as you rightly say, have talked about the incident in question.

However, it's quite wrong to suggest nobody in a Villa shirt had the hunger to be looking for the scraps of Sorenson's mistake. If you watch the incident again, you'll see that we actually had two players directly either side of where the ball came to land following the keepers howler. It was, in my opinion, just pure bad luck that it didn't drop to either of them. So to use that point as evidence that Bent would have made a difference is not on the money for me, I'm afraid. We did have players following up, it was just a very unlucky bounce off Sorenson.

As I say, a very minor point. But one which has been bugging me since the Stoke game.

[Richard]

Cant believe that there is an opinion which basically goes "lets get rid of our most valuable player and most natural goalscorer we have had for 20 odd years because the manager is shit" Why not argue that we should actually get shot of Mcleish. That is a better way of taking the club forward than getting rid of our best players because he doesn't know his arse from his elbow

[Woodytom]

Cant believe that there is an opinion which basically goes "lets get rid of our most valuable player and most natural goalscorer we have had for 20 odd years because the manager is shit" Why not argue that we should actually get shot of Mcleish. That is a better way of taking the club forward than getting rid of our best players because he doesn't know his arse from his elbow

You have clearly mis understood my posts Richard as that is not how it goes at all - and I know your a man who demands posts to be read thoroughly.

But FWIW, I dont believe hes our most valuable player

[Mantis]

Cant believe that there is an opinion which basically goes "lets get rid of our most valuable player and most natural goalscorer we have had for 20 odd years because the manager is shit" Why not argue that we should actually get shot of Mcleish. That is a better way of taking the club forward than getting rid of our best players because he doesn't know his arse from his elbow

Absolutely.

[Richard]

Cant believe that there is an opinion which basically goes "lets get rid of our most valuable player and most natural goalscorer we have had for 20 odd years because the manager is shit" Why not argue that we should actually get shot of Mcleish. That is a better way of taking the club forward than getting rid of our best players because he doesn't know his arse from his elbow

You have clearly mis understood my posts Richard as that is not how it goes at all - and I know your a man who demands posts to be read thoroughly.

But FWIW, I dont believe hes our most valuable player

Sorry Tom but that is very much how I read your posts

In terms of transfer fee, who of our current squad would fetch more than him?

[Woodytom]

Cant believe that there is an opinion which basically goes "lets get rid of our most valuable player and most natural goalscorer we have had for 20 odd years because the manager is shit" Why not argue that we should actually get shot of Mcleish. That is a better way of taking the club forward than getting rid of our best players because he doesn't know his arse from his elbow

You have clearly mis understood my posts Richard as that is not how it goes at all - and I know your a man who demands posts to be read thoroughly.

But FWIW, I dont believe hes our most valuable player

Sorry Tom but that is very much how I read your posts

In terms of transfer fee, who of our current squad would fetch more than him?

Thats fair enough Richard, Il try and be more clear..

Its fair to say Im not Darren Bents biggest fan. I know his strengths and I have never shyd from praising him for them. He also has a whole host of weaknesses. I believe he is a very limtited player.

When we signed him, I was optimistic. When he scored after 20 minutes I was ecstatic. After 90 minutes I was wary. I text my mate saying that he was going to drive me crazy - and he has.

We all know he relies on service (quite a lot of it becuase his shot/goal ratio is nothing like the Linekers and Mullers that people seem to think he is like). Having supported Villa for 20 years I am aware that we very rarely create a host of chances 'on a regular basis'. We may have games like Bolton a couple of weeks back where we could have had 10 goals, but we do not go into games, expecting it not to be anything but kick and rush 'forcing the issue' football. And thats the way it has been under O'Neill, O'Leary, Mcliesh, Houllier, Taylor, McDonald, Gregory and so on. With that in mind, I predicted fairly early on, that it wouldnt be all hunky dorey regards Darren Bent. And it isnt.

The sale of Young and Downing has only enhanced our lack of creativity (as we knew it would). This coupled with Mcliesh's dire tactics has made it almost impossible to get the best out of Bent. In addition, bent then seems to not be arsed - putting the final nail in the coffin and resulting with ;'in the most part' a completely usless player this season give or take a couple of games.

Now we can either pretend theres a cat in hells chance of Mcliesh leaving anytime soon and call for his head. That said, who would we bring in that is going to turn a team who cant string 3 passes together into the creative machine that Bent needs

or

We can cash in on Bent while he still has value and not put up with more frustration of watching him do next to nothing.

Its not all bents fault Richard, but it is not working and wont work, especially consistently over time.

People say hes what weve been crying out for.............

Yeah he is, along with a creative CM, A RB, A LB, 2 Brilliant CB's who dont hoof it, A defensive Midfielder, A manager with more than 1 plan. A chairman with a shit load of money.

Lets face it, the teams looked clueless going forward for years.

[NowDoINotLikeThat]

Alan Curbishley , George Burley , Steve Bruce , even under Redknapp who wasn't Bents biggest fan

Bent scored goals.

He has played and scored goals for far less fashionable sides than ourself in topflight for 10 years nearly now.

The suggestion that we should sell Bent - a poacher who weve been crying out for for over a decade- because of our managers utter incompetence is ridiculous and farcical.

[Woodytom]

Quick question, What exactly have teams who rely heavily on Darren Bent ever won?

[NowDoINotLikeThat]

Quick question, What exactly have teams who rely heavily on Darren Bent ever won?

:?

seems rather random irrevelant question to me that but to answer your random question :-

League cup with Spurs.

Promotion with Charlton , Ipswich.

Random question back to you - what has Gabby won by the way?

Do you want him sold as well?

[sir_gary_cahill]

Quick question, What exactly have teams who rely heavily on Darren Bent ever won?

:?

seems rather random irrevelant question to me that but to answer your random question :-

League cup with Spurs.

Promotion with Charlton , Ipswich.

Random question back to you - what has Gabby won by the way?

Do you want him sold as well?

the whole team will be off if it was up to him

[Mantis]

Quick question, What exactly have teams who rely heavily on Darren Bent ever won?

Wes Brown's won it all with Man U. Doesn't make him a good player.

[sir_gary_cahill]

Quick question, What exactly have teams who rely heavily on Darren Bent ever won?

Wes Brown's won it all with Man U. Doesn't make him a good player.

imo he's a very good and underrated player

[Mantis]

Quick question, What exactly have teams who rely heavily on Darren Bent ever won?

Wes Brown's won it all with Man U. Doesn't make him a good player.

imo he's a very good and underrated player

That settles it then. He's definitely shit.

[Hanky]

After 90 minutes I was wary. I text my mate saying that he was going to drive me crazy - and he has.

This is a bit of selective quoting but this is my main issue. In that Man City game they were all over us for the last half of the game. The ball was being cleared and came back again. However Bent took his one chance in the game and put it away, which he hasn't done enough of this season but he can't score them all (should have done better once or twice mind).

I'm not advocating Bent isn't responsible because he is, however the way we have played this season has been why IMO, nothing to do with a lack of desire.

We improved a lot against Arsenal and I reckon he'd have had a few chances there from some of the balls we put over in the first half. However, because we haven't played that way, he has had literally nothing to feed on and therefore his confidence is low. He should have stuck a couple of the chances away, which is down to him, but I think the way we have approached games has meant Bent has completely lost confidence.

[PauloBarnesi]

Cant believe that there is an opinion which basically goes "lets get rid of our most valuable player and most natural goalscorer we have had for 20 odd years because the manager is shit" Why not argue that we should actually get shot of Mcleish. That is a better way of taking the club forward than getting rid of our best players because he doesn't know his arse from his elbow

You have clearly mis understood my posts Richard as that is not how it goes at all - and I know your a man who demands posts to be read thoroughly.

But FWIW, I dont believe hes our most valuable player

Sorry Tom but that is very much how I read your posts

In terms of transfer fee, who of our current squad would fetch more than him?

Transfer Fee and Value to the team aren’t necessarily equal. Personally I would rather sell Bent than Gabby. We sell Gabby and we might as well as give up.

[Ulver]

I'm struggling to see how anyone can question Bent's 'attitude' or 'work ethic'

It's almost as if people want him to change into a player he's never been. We've signed one of the most prolific strikers in Premiership history. EVERYONE that's ever watched him play knows what kind of striker he is. That's why we signed him. To get on the end of the crosses being pumped into the box by Young and Downing.

You take away that service, for around 38m and replace with one player wortha round 10m and you don't need to be a genius to work out what the problem is. And I say problem loosely speaking, for me Bent should be on around 10 goals now, he's on 5. Which by my maths means he's knocking in 1 in 2 chances that come his way. A ratio ANY goalscorer would be proud of

Just like Peter Withe, Andy Gray, Dion Dublin and many Villa strikers before. He's NOT an all round footballer. He doesnt create many for himself, he's there to finish. His incredible goalscoring stats are all down to his movement and awareness and the service provided to him

There was an amazing clip on Sky after one game this season where they analysed Bent's 'movement' by putting one of those digital trails on him. To see him having to run around chasing the ball like a headless chicken was quite depressing. How anyone could say he doesn't do anything is frankly **** ridiculous (but then lets be honest, the ones making such claims are well known for their ridiculous views)

He's not going to be very effective if the system isn't working in his favour. Then again, there can't be many clubs that go out and buy a potential 'last piece of the jigsaw' player and then sell off the **** supply line and wonder why it's not working as well anymore ...

Frankly, it's like buying a top of the range HiFi, and then selling your speakers

[Mantis]

I'm struggling to see how anyone can question Bent's 'attitude' or 'work ethic'

It's almost as if people want him to change into a player he's never been. We've signed one of the most prolific strikers in Premiership history. EVERYONE that's ever watched him play knows what kind of striker he is. That's why we signed him. To get on the end of the crosses being pumped into the box by Young and Downing.

You take away that service, for around 38m and replace with one player wortha round 10m and you don't need to be a genius to work out what the problem is. And I say problem loosely speaking, for me Bent should be on around 10 goals now, he's on 5. Which by my maths means he's knocking in 1 in 2 chances that come his way. A ratio ANY goalscorer would be proud of

Just like Peter Withe, Andy Gray, Dion Dublin and many Villa strikers before. He's NOT an all round footballer. He doesnt create many for himself, he's there to finish. His incredible goalscoring stats are all down to his movement and awareness and the service provided to him

There was an amazing clip on Sky after one game this season where they analysed Bent's 'movement' by putting one of those digital trails on him. To see him having to run around chasing the ball like a headless chicken was quite depressing. How anyone could say he doesn't do anything is frankly **** ridiculous (but then lets be honest, the ones making such claims are well known for their ridiculous views)

He's not going to be very effective if the system isn't working in his favour. Then again, there can't be many clubs that go out and buy a potential 'last piece of the jigsaw' player and then sell off the **** supply line and wonder why it's not working as well anymore ...

Frankly, it's like buying a top of the range HiFi, and then selling your speakers

Good analysis. I would like to add though that we do have the players there that can supply him in Gabby, Albrighton, N'Zogbia and Bannan. It's the manager's negatives tactics that are the problem. When we've attacked teams this season we've done quite well. It was in one of our most attacking displays against Norwich where Bent bagged 2 goals.

[TrentVilla]

Transfer Fee and Value to the team aren’t necessarily equal. Personally I would rather sell Bent than Gabby. We sell Gabby and we might as well as give up.

I can see where you are coming from and the logic behind it and to an extent I share it but I think that is as much a result of our current circumstances as it is a result of their respective abilities.

I don't think there is much doubt Bent is the better goal scorer while Gabby has the better all around game without excelling at anything other than pace.

If we were the club of 2 or 3 seasons ago Bent would be our biggest asset, as it is now Gabby probably is because of his work rate and wider range of attributes.

One excel's at one element of the game and one is more rounded but doesn't really excel, in net value the first is worth more than the later in a team, especially a team such as ours at the moment the later probably has greater value.

I guess where I disagree is that I'd rather we didn't sell either, personally if we sell either I think we might as well give up. That said I think as a club we already have.