Risso Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 A top, top, band (but not the best ever). I maybe could have asked this four years ago, but who do you rate as better Pete? There are bands who I think have made the a better album or single than The Smiths, but for absolute life affirming consistent brilliance, I honestly don't think they can be beaten. Oh and they're Mark Radcliffe's favourite band ever, which is a good enough recommendation for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sellyoakvilla Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Marr has been with the Cribs for the majority of this year...but not officially. He played on the NME tour back in Feb in...Glasgow I think, and that was his first live show with them, but the Cribs did a cover of Panic I think and that's the only reason he played with them as he didn't know many chords for the songs...he's been officially a member since about Reading festival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted November 25, 2008 VT Supporter Share Posted November 25, 2008 Dear god who the hell voted no.....tut tut. I voted no. Not denying they are a great band, just never really appealed to me that much. There are songs that i like and a few I think are really good, just don't really enjoy them as much as others. It's like the Beatles, I am in full agreement that they are one of the best bands ever, I just don't really enjoy their music very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 A top, top, band (but not the best ever). I maybe could have asked this four years ago, but who do you rate as better Pete? There are bands who I think have made the a better album or single than The Smiths, but for absolute life affirming consistent brilliance, I honestly don't think they can be beaten. Oh and they're Mark Radcliffe's favourite band ever, which is a good enough recommendation for me. s'alright, no rush Mart. The reason why I think they are a top top band is because when they come on the radio or on the iPod or whatever, I just think "Yes" a kind of instant connection with the music that's just there - like the first sip of a pint - you can't explain it, it just touches something that connects. But not all their stuff does that. Some of it, for me, misses quite badly. As to who is "the best" - I dunno, but it's not the Smiths for me. There are other bands who have done better songs, there are other bands who may not be as gifted, but who connect more often for me. I realise "who is better?" "I dunno" Is not the best argument, but it's not about winning an argument, it's just...they're not my favourite, but they are, or were, very, very good. I think the Weddoes, who everyone else in the world didn't like as much are better (not musically, but the "connect" thing). I think the Arcade Fire are better, and Sigur Ros and the Blue Nile, and REM (not recently) and Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds (for the past I dunno, 6-8 years or whatever) and Radiohead, Talking Heads, too - basically there's been better Albums by many artists than the Queen is dead, which is the best Smith's album - and, er, that's it, really. I've probably missed out loads of others, but then if I put the Smiths on I might change my choices, and then change them back...etc.. [edited to add talking heads] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR.Smalljob Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 The Cure much better, or was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 I think the Weddoes, who everyone else in the world didn't like as much are better (not musically, but the "connect" thing). I think the Arcade Fire are better, and Sigur Ros and the Blue Nile, and REM (not recently) and Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds (for the past I dunno, 6-8 years or whatever) and Radiohead, Talking Heads, too - basically there's been better Albums by many artists than the Queen is dead, which is the best Smith's album - and, er, that's it, really. I've probably missed out loads of others, but then if I put the Smiths on I might change my choices, and then change them back...etc.. I was going to post that for you earlier on, its true, all of what you said, totally true The Smiths were good, very good, but not the best And just for Mr Barnes, yes Joy Division were better than the Smiths too, two albums but two albums that are better than any one single Smiths album, more influential too. The bands that heavily borrow from Joy Division are generally better tha those that take their cue from the Smiths Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 Oh Yes - Joy Division, too. I knew I'd miss someone out. There's maybe one or two others, too. You could also consider The Clash - inconsistent, but they did stuff every bit as good, as the Smiths and must have influenced as many if not more bands. And Joe Strummer was by all accounts a far nicer person the Mozzer is, which maybe counts for something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 Oh yes and the Bunnymen were better by far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted November 25, 2008 Author Share Posted November 25, 2008 The bands that heavily borrow from Joy Division are generally better tha those that take their cue from the Smiths If that is true isn't it more to do with The Smiths style being so elegant that it is almost impossible to copy without sounding truly awful in the process. The Smiths are in Morrissey's own words a pop band. Rock/Post-Punk or whatever you want to label Joy Division is eminently more easy to reproduce. Being inspired by a band too heavily can also have an adverse effect. You only have to look at the likes of The Editors and Interpol who are so strongly influenced by Joy Division and the Post Punk era that they end up sounding rather dull and contrived in the process. The fact that we've yet to really hear a Smiths copy-cat that sound anywhere near as good as the original is, in my opinion, a plus for them. Edit - I like Joy Division for what it's worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted November 25, 2008 Author Share Posted November 25, 2008 Also interesting to me is that you never hear of any unreleased Smiths tracks, which means the stuff they did release is basically all there is. Which means they were never shit. Not many bands who can claim that. the Queen is dead, which is the best Smith's album Strangeways, here we come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 ...The Smiths style being so elegant that it is almost impossible to copy without sounding truly awful in the process. The Smiths are in Morrissey's own words a pop band. Rock/Post-Punk or whatever you want to label Joy Division is eminently more easy to reproduce. Being inspired by a band too heavily can also have an adverse effect. You only have to look at the likes of The Editors and Interpol who are so strongly influenced by Joy Division and the Post Punk era that they end up sounding rather dull and contrived in the process.... Copying the Smiths - like you say, not possible - Moz and Marr are both unique. Marr is a brilliant guitarist and tunester too, and Morrissey with his lyrics and the vocal style is inimitable, really. The two of them together made something even more inimitable. But there are plenty of bands tht ape the jangly guitar sound, and plenty others that do the "it's all so unfair" thing. And they would all claim the Smith's as an influence, or inspiration. As for Editors and Interpol, I like them both. A lot. They're not "dull" to me. Editors definitely have the JD, Bunnymen influence, and Interpol have also said as much. Editors sound a lot like Interpol who despite being from NY, took UK 80's indie as their kind of core influence in terms of sound, if not lyrically. I'm not dissing the Smiths - they made some classic music. It's just they're not for me the best ever, even if Mark Radcliffe likes them the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted November 25, 2008 Author Share Posted November 25, 2008 I'm not dissing the Smiths - they made some classic music. For clarification sake I wasn't claiming you were, Pete. Obviously everyone has their own opinion and they're entitled to it. You're wrong, of course. :winkold: My problem with a lot of post punk inspired bands is that despite being the same age as me, they don't seem to sing about me. Many of them follow the same "it's so unfair" line that Morrssey seemed most comfortable with, yet it feels like they're from another world. I've just never found a musician that I've connected with like I have Mozza I guess. Maybe they're out there and I've just not heard them yet, but they would have to be pretty **** special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 Blandy is right as per usual except for one thing, the Editors never did sound like Joy Division, they sounded like another band from Manchester, The Chameleons they don't any more The Editors had never heard of the Chameleons not had they consciously heard them, which I found interesting The Editors certainly sound even less like Joy Division now, hell they don't even sound like the Chameleons any more And if you haven't heard of or just heard the Chameleons, do so, first albums just had the 25th anniversary treatment, its one of those forgotten classics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrogers Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 I'd say The Cure were more influential than the Smiths, The Cure have been around since 1976 until now, The Smith only formed in 82 and spent 5 years together. The Cure > The Smiths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 So come on then, name all these bands that the Cure inspired if they were so influential? the Cure ceased to be a great band the day they released Love Cats, they have had moments since but not many. Pornography is their finest moment and will never be bettered The Cure, First 4 albums were Great and its been a long slide down since with the odd decent song along the way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrogers Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Well I'd say The Smith for a start. I was about the mention Pornography as a classic... A Forest was a definative tune IMO, like I say it's all about opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 I found a lot of what Pete said quite interesting until he mentioned The Clash, who were to my untutored ears, bleedin' awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 25, 2008 Moderator Share Posted November 25, 2008 Well I'd say The Smith for a start. Well I'd have to say you were talking shit in that instance then But Yes Pornography is a top album, the Forest is a great single Now if you were to offer the opinion that the Cure possibly inadvertently invented Post Rock o the Faith album I might have agreed with you But an influence on the Smiths, nope, not at all, now taking it back to the Editors, the Smiths may have had an influence there too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Blandy is right as per usual except for one thing, the Editors never did sound like Joy Division Except that they did of course. Almost too similar at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Designer1 Posted November 25, 2008 VT Supporter Share Posted November 25, 2008 I think the Weddoes, who everyone else in the world didn't like as much are better (not musically, but the "connect" thing). I think the Arcade Fire are better, and Sigur Ros and the Blue Nile, and REM (not recently) and Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds (for the past I dunno, 6-8 years or whatever) and Radiohead, Talking Heads, too - basically there's been better Albums by many artists than the Queen is dead, which is the best Smith's album - and, er, that's it, really. I've probably missed out loads of others, but then if I put the Smiths on I might change my choices, and then change them back...etc.. [edited to add talking heads] Wedding Present? Arcade Fire? Sigur Ros? REM? Nick Cave? And an obvious affinity with The Smiths. Pete, If you had a vagina I would be in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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