AntrimBlack Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 13 hours ago, bose said: With the benefit of hindsight I think even Sherwood is not as bad a manager as he appeared. I don't think he's anywhere near a decent one though. Sherwood did what he was brought in to do, got the new manager bounce, then the wheels came off. But he was his own worst enemy, should have kept his mouth shut and tried to work with the players he had. I think his attitude was just wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 2, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, KHV said: He can't get the vast majority of players to play for him I don't agree with that. He did get them to play for him. They've given up now, but that's more to do with our inevitable relegation than Garde, imo. When we were still alive the players played for him. So yes, he can't seem to do it now, but it's not a case that they've never played for him. IMO obviously 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntrimBlack Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 12 hours ago, Uppernorthstander said: Except Timmy didn't sign his own players he signed paddy and almstad's players I'm sure if he'd of got what he wanted Tim would of done a better job... IMO Paddy and Almstrad's players are our better players. The signings Sherwood had a hand in are the signings that have let us down. Together with the dross already at the club. And still here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 2, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2016 10 minutes ago, AntrimBlack said: Paddy and Almstrad's players are our better players. The signings Sherwood had a hand in are the signings that have let us down. Together with the dross already at the club. And still here. Sherwood had a hand in all the signings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 10 minutes ago, AntrimBlack said: Paddy and Almstrad's players are our better players. The signings Sherwood had a hand in are the signings that have let us down. Together with the dross already at the club. And still here. so the good players signed were by Riley and Almstadt and the bad ones by Sherwood? any real proof of this or is that guesswork 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 7 minutes ago, AntrimBlack said: Paddy and Almstrad's players are our better players. The signings Sherwood had a hand in are the signings that have let us down. Together with the dross already at the club. And still here. All of the signings are shit, some less shit than others but still shit. It was a disaster of a window, the club tried to do things on the cheap and did not want to spend money on the likes of Lennon,Townsend,Cambiassio,Adebayor etc who we were strongly linked with and others. It has turned out far more costly now by trying to do things on the cheap with the club being relegated in embarrassing fashion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 2, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, Zatman said: so the good players signed were by Riley and Almstadt and the bad ones by Sherwood? any real proof of this or is that guesswork As above, Sherwood had a hand in all of them. He's a big part of why this squad is woefully short of what's required to stay in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 10 minutes ago, KHV said: He can't get the vast majority of players to play for him, being able to get players to play for you is one of the key things a manager does at a club regardless of whether they are his players or not. Other managers can take over clubs and get a response from players, even though we were in a poor run of form we were only 4 points from safety when he arrived, there has been zero improvement in anything since he arrived. He has been a total flop, the players don't like training for him and they don't want to play for him, they don't respect him at all. A manager that can't command any kind of respect from a group of players is a disaster which is what Garde has proved to be. Many pundits and ex players were baffled by his appointment and said he would not be up to the task and that we had made a mistake. He has without doubt been a mistake and an utterly woeful appointment. Thats all nonesense of course and mainly/wholely made up or your opinion I won't bother debating because I'm sure your mind is made up Four managers all with the same problems? We just need a new manager and everything will be alright - I don't think so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 1 minute ago, Stevo985 said: As above, Sherwood had a hand in all of them. He's a big part of why this squad is woefully short of what's required to stay in the league. His part is nowhere near as big as Lerner's, Fox's or Riley's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntrimBlack Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Too many of our players are just not of the required standard. We are carrying too many players, and you cannot afford to have passengers. It all needs to change, and I don't think the names being bandied about for yet another manager can do it. Perhaps Garde is not the manager to do it either, but he at least brings something new. You will think it laughable when we are facing relegation, and possibly not being able to return to the Premier League for years, but I am fed up with struggling in the bottom half of the table, and am vaguely excited at the chance to rebuild. I am a `mature supporter', so I am used to better things. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 2, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2016 (edited) 4 minutes ago, KHV said: His part is nowhere near as big as Lerner's, Fox's or Riley's I'm not so sure about that. I doubt Randy had any input other than setting a budget (and £55m should have been enough to stay in the league) I doubt Fox had any more input than actually going out and signing the players (as opposed to which players we wanted). I'd say it's impossible for us to know how well or bad he did in that respect. For me the main culprits are Sherwood and Reilly. They would have been the guys identifying what we needed, and who to bring in to satisfy those needs. They failed miserably. I don't KNOW any of this. But we have no reason to assume that our transfers work any different from any other club. We seem to be absolving Sherwood from blame based on one or two newspaper reports from months ago which have been largely rubbished by all involved. Edited March 2, 2016 by Stevo985 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Its got that bad that I think Redknapp would be a good choice as manager. he has experience dealing with foreign players thrown at him and has a good Championship record Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 2, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2016 Just now, Zatman said: Its got that bad that I think Redknapp would be a good choice as manager. he has experience dealing with foreign players thrown at him and has a good Championship record Ludicrous (and also completely contradictory to your usual opinion on managers) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 I felt sorry last night for a number of players - they are trying but are just not good enough at this level and it's probably not their fault I watched Westwood - he really seemed to be trying, really trying, but he just doesn't have the abilities to do what is required. Garde shook his hand when he came off and you could see the subtext "well done Ashley, your keen but crap - thanks for trying" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PussEKatt Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 We lost 2 players, Benteke and Delph.Why did we have to replace them with 13 players and none of them was/is a striker.FFS. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: Ludicrous (and also completely contradictory to your usual opinion on managers) true but we have got from bad to worse under Garde that im willing to contradict myself to get out of the Championship. Could do what West Ham did with Allardyce and sack him if he keeps us up after promotion cant be as bad as Garde has been, the French McLeish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 2, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2016 Just now, Zatman said: true but we have got from bad to worse under Garde that im willing to contradict myself to get out of the Championship. Could do what West Ham did with Allardyce and sack him if he keeps us up after promotion cant be as bad as Garde has been, the French McLeish I'm going to chalk this opinion up to your usual "nobody else will have this opinion so I'm going to have it instead" stance. as I can't believe anyone would seriously suggest Redknapp. Probably the one manager in the world I'd actually want less than Sherwood. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 The players have completely given up playing for him. Not all his fault but it's also not a great sign. The problem is how does this help for our challenge next season. Will they play for him next year? Can he trust them? I can't imagine the rest of this year is going to form a strong bond between squad and manager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dn1982 Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 34 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: I don't agree with that. He did get them to play for him. They've given up now, but that's more to do with our inevitable relegation than Garde, imo. When we were still alive the players played for him. So yes, he can't seem to do it now, but it's not a case that they've never played for him. IMO obviously I agree with you but that's what worries me. Why have the players seemingly lost their desire? We had a little run from Jan and I belved we could make it interesting by getting back in touch with the others but from Liverpool on we just look dead on our feet. What happens prior to the Liverpool game to kill us? I think Garde is collapsing under the pressure and without help from a board that's basically cut him adrift it's a shame. We never had a hope once we never replaced Benteke with someone fit to lace his boots. A thin unbalanced squad without any leaders or quality would never stay up and will struggle next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted March 2, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2016 Just now, dn1982 said: I agree with you but that's what worries me. Why have the players seemingly lost their desire? We had a little run from Jan and I belved we could make it interesting by getting back in touch with the others but from Liverpool on we just look dead on our feet. What happens prior to the Liverpool game to kill us? I think Garde is collapsing under the pressure and without help from a board that's basically cut him adrift it's a shame. We never had a hope once we never replaced Benteke with someone fit to lace his boots. A thin unbalanced squad without any leaders or quality would never stay up and will struggle next year. I think the desire's gone because they know they're not going to stay up. Maybe they viewed Liverpool as a winnable game and as soon as we went behind that was it. It's over. Not absolving Garde form blame here. Like I said previously if we'd stayed more in touch by winning some of those games over xmas, then the players would still be fighting. That's down to him. But from this position, I think it's an almost impossible task to get this group of players to be fully motivated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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