Uber

[Morley_crosses_to_Withe]

Anyone reformed their opinion on using Uber after all that!? Nah, me neither.

I've read stories about people using online banking and having money stolen.  Quick! Close your bank account down and keep your money under your bed. I've heard of people who've bought stuff online and had their card details stolen! You'd better only purchase directly from a high street shop from now on and wheel your money there in a safe, just in case of pickpockets.

Debit cards!? They can be cloned. You'd better off using physical money and only withdrawing exactly what you need for each and every purchase. But what about ATMs!? People have had money stolen from them, too. Better to go into the bank and use a cashier for each withdrawal instead.  And don't get me started on emails! They can be hacked. You should all go back to sending letters from now on

[bickster]

Seriously, do some more research. its been going on over a year now, still happening and Uber point blank refuse to do anything about it, always blaming the person whose details were used. Thousands and thousands of examples worldwide.

 

America however is different to the UK. The USA only has a one tier Taxi system. Here in the UK we already have a two tier system Hackney vs Private Hire, Uber fall into the latter. The arguments are different in the US to here

[gharperr]

Uber is the best thing ever if youre living/travelling in Manila. Man the taxi's are just atrocious, take long routes, hassle for redic tips constantly and they just refuse to take you anywhere. The difference between taxi's and uber drivers in that part of the world is astonishing and much needed. Will never go back to taxi's. AirCon + Music + able to charge your phone + sweets + drivers using satnav + no whitetax (although i do tip sometimes as manila traffic is one of the worst in the world) just makes uber so much better. As standard though,uber is cheaper than taxi's but more expensive with surge charger. Still only about £3.50 for an hour trip with surge. 

Edited October 28, 2015 by gharperr

[ender4]

Bicks...you don't like Uber do you?

I don't like neoliberalism no

Sharing economy my arse, there is nothing sharing about Uber. As time goes on Drivers will earn less and less, Uber will increase their%. They will also reduce prices not increase with time. Drivers work for them now for the big bucks but all they are doing is effectively killing their own trade. 

There is no sharing go on here

This is actually my biggest issue with Uber.

Its not a sharing economy, its a business that should pay its share of taxes and compete fairly in the marketplace.  Its the one thing that stops me using it more frequently.

[bickster]

Bicks...you don't like Uber do you?

I don't like neoliberalism no

Sharing economy my arse, there is nothing sharing about Uber. As time goes on Drivers will earn less and less, Uber will increase their%. They will also reduce prices not increase with time. Drivers work for them now for the big bucks but all they are doing is effectively killing their own trade. 

There is no sharing go on here

This is actually my biggest issue with Uber.

Its not a sharing economy, its a business that should pay its share of taxes and compete fairly in the marketplace.  Its the one thing that stops me using it more frequently.

Anyone reformed their opinion on using Uber after all that!? Nah, me neither.

I've read stories about people using online banking and having money stolen.  Quick! Close your bank account down and keep your money under your bed. I've heard of people who've bought stuff online and had their card details stolen! You'd better only purchase directly from a high street shop from now on and wheel your money there in a safe, just in case of pickpockets.

Debit cards!? They can be cloned. You'd better off using physical money and only withdrawing exactly what you need for each and every purchase. But what about ATMs!? People have had money stolen from them, too. Better to go into the bank and use a cashier for each withdrawal instead.  And don't get me started on emails! They can be hacked. You should all go back to sending letters from now 

The fact they aren't paying their taxes gives them an unfair advantage over competing platforms

[Stevo985]

Anyone reformed their opinion on using Uber after all that!? Nah, me neither.

 

Nope.

 

[limpid]

Bicks, what are the taxi companies going to do about it? I've used taxis all over the country and had an almost overwhelmingly terrible customer experience. What are you proposing as an alternative?

I use a prepaid credit card  for Uber, but they'd have to crack my Google account (with multiple factor authentication) to get in so that doesn't worry me. I have tens of apps monitoring my location all the time so I don't care that Uber do. I'd turn off location services if that was a worry.

[leviramsey]

You get an Uber but you've been surged? Why is that. The surge is meant to be because demand is high… yet you got a cab straight away so clearly supply isn't outstripping demand is it?

If supply is outstripping demand, surge pricing isn't working: the goal is to keep demand sufficiently below supply in order to allow the car to come straight away.

[leviramsey]

America however is different to the UK. The USA only has a one tier Taxi system. Here in the UK we already have a two tier system Hackney vs Private Hire, Uber fall into the latter. The arguments are different in the US to here

Nearly every large US city makes a distinction between Taxi and Livery (though they're typically regulated by the same authorities). Taxicabs are allowed to pick up street hails, Livery vehicles (typically "black cars") aren't.

[bickster]

America however is different to the UK. The USA only has a one tier Taxi system. Here in the UK we already have a two tier system Hackney vs Private Hire, Uber fall into the latter. The arguments are different in the US to here

 

Nearly every large US city makes a distinction between Taxi and Livery (though they're typically regulated by the same authorities). Taxicabs are allowed to pick up street hails, Livery vehicles (typically "black cars") aren't.

Ah yes but your livery vehicles would come under the luxury bracket would they not? not the case here. The PH industry #ubered the traditional taxi trade many decades ago since the introduction of the Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act of 1976. So here Uber are trying to do a job that has already been done. They are simply trying to buy their way into the market by paying drivers to do the work. The drivers get stupidly large bonuses for the jobs they do. Once they have enough drivers, the bonuses go and you're left with a huge fleet of drivers who cannot ever make any money. In London they are double shifting Priuses a totally unsuitable car for the job and a car not designed to be on the road 24 hours a day. There are already a fair few instances of Priuses spontaneously combusting in London. Even Toyota have said they aren't meant to be that type of car, yet Uber still push their drivers to buy them

[bickster]

You get an Uber but you've been surged? Why is that. The surge is meant to be because demand is high… yet you got a cab straight away so clearly supply isn't outstripping demand is it?

If supply is outstripping demand, surge pricing isn't working: the goal is to keep demand sufficiently below supply in order to allow the car to come straight away.

Uber in Liverpool has roughly 50 drivers, thats 50 drivers to cover the entire county of Merseyside 24 hours a day. They currently cannot ever cover demand so surging is a. utterly pointless and b. just a rip off as it can never do what it supposedly aims to do, they could make the surge x9 and they'd never cover the demand. They are currently declaring war on our company, and yes their Twitter trolls may actually have used that phrase. 50 drivers most of whom we've actually sacked at one stage or other of their career vs 2200 in our company and we're actually cheaper than them in most instances. The only reason they have drivers is because of the incentives. Surge pricing and economic theory is nonsense. Its just a way of chiseling money out of people. When you can't get more drivers to come out because there are no more to come out, how can surge pricing help that? It can't

Edited October 28, 2015 by bickster

[bickster]

Bicks, what are the taxi companies going to do about it? I've used taxis all over the country and had an almost overwhelmingly terrible customer experience. What are you proposing as an alternative?

I use a prepaid credit card  for Uber, but they'd have to crack my Google account (with multiple factor authentication) to get in so that doesn't worry me. I have tens of apps monitoring my location all the time so I don't care that Uber do. I'd turn off location services if that was a worry.

Uber has terrible customer service. I've given one such example above. Customer service breaks down into 2 sections here. One is the driver, the other is the company. Drivers? The customer for starters is not always right, they might think they are but they aren't. "The driver charged me £25 because I was sick in his car", that customer thinks they are in the right, he isn't. If that instance happened with Uber, the driver would lose out he would get the cleaning charge, he has no way of charging it. All he can do is rate the customer 1 star. He can't refuse to pick them up, Uber won't allow that, he loses his incentives if he cancels a journey (they most definitely aren't rides), the customer can't cancel because they'd get charged a cancelation fee as outlined previously. SO Uber is effectively removing the drivers ability to make his own risk assessment, that cannot be right. Customers again always think they are right, its quite often in the taxi game they aren't, they often think they know the best / cheapest route, they don't. I'm as close as you can get to the worlds leading expert on route selection on Merseyside, involved as I am in the re-design and implementation of two of the local authorities knowledge tests right now. And customers will tell me I've gone the wrong way… I never have. Thinking that an App has good customer service is madness. Most people nearly always rate a driver 5 stars on Uber because a. He knows where they live and b. he's got their phone number. It may work in the second phase of them starting in a city, its turned off in phase one and becomes almost irrelevant in the final phase. In the taxi trade a lot of customer service issues are just that, the customer thinking they are right, often they aren't, then when told very politely that they are indeed wrong, they kick off and whine about it to their friends etc. If the driver is found to be in the wrong by the company and the issue is addressed then customer service is good. Customer service opinions are generally based on whether the customer likes the answer they were given

Our taxi company really doesn't need to do anything about it. We've been doing what they do for years. We're even paying for drivers to purchase chip and pin machines for themselves. Our driver discipline is good, we regularly refuse to rent drivers an MDT over disciplinary issues. We have a dedicated customer service department to deal with issues. We even have a team of fleet inspectors who travel round making sure cars are clean and roadworthy Its why we've got to the size we have. Uber aside, THE 3rd largest PH company in the UK. Its why we beat the competition, Its why people hate us. Its why other taxi companies from around the country come to visit us to learn where they need to take their company. Despite Uber launching here and a small number of our drivers going to them, our driver numbers are still increasing.

Limpid, your security is hardly what 99.99% of the population would consider normal :mrgreen:

[limpid]

The biggest complaint I have with taxi companies is that it's so difficult to get an accurate estimate of when the car will turn up. Even when they do arrive, they'll take the first fare that walks up to them. Most of the time this is because the controller is trying to give his mates the best jobs rather than letting a computer dispatch.

Your company might be different, but if so it's not typical.

[bickster]

The biggest complaint I have with taxi companies is that it's so difficult to get an accurate estimate of when the car will turn up. Even when they do arrive, they'll take the first fare that walks up to them. Most of the time this is because the controller is trying to give his mates the best jobs rather than letting a computer dispatch.

Your company might be different, but if so it's not typical.

On the first point, you are expecting the impossible. Uber are no different, their estimated time of arrival uses Google maps, which is absolutely woeful as a sat nav and a road timing device. Taxi companies cannot control the following. Road conditions, the weather or car availability in any area at any given time. They can tell you what the current delay is but that is only a guide, the car could be there quicker or later as prevailing conditions allow and change. What a reputable company will do is not even take your booking if the delay is too long.

Our company is mainly computer dispatch, manual intervention is generally only used for outer area jobs or jobs that have ballsed up in someway. Like a car breaking down with a passenger on board so we have to get them a replacement asap. Out of the 11 million journeys we undertake a year I reckon the manual interventions are in the 10k range. Drivers who pick up the wrong fare risk a 24 hour suspension of service. It still happens  though quite often with us it is a genuine mistake, similar sounding names etc, but we just swap the drivers over as soon as we find out, which is generally when the second car gets there a couple of mins later. Those taking Jane when their job was for Mustafa get 24 hours off

.You want a taxi service that can give you an exact time of arrival, you need to go up the food chain past Hackney Carriage to a chauffeur service. In this instance you pay not only for the journey but all the time pre-journey that a particular driver has to take off to ensure he is at the booked place at the correct time. Its one of the reasons (not the only) that type of service is more expensive

Edit: I want to give a driver a job manually I have to give my reason at the time. Giving a "good" job to a friend is considered gross misconduct and instantly sackable. Its happened twice in my 16 years in the job

Edited October 28, 2015 by bickster

[bickster]

Like I said, we #ubered Liverpool before Uber was even a twinkle in Travis' eye.

[chappy]

Out of interest, which firm is yours? PM if you don't want to go public. I haven't used Uber on principle but have had various issues with a couple of the firms around here recently and am looking for a reliable one.

[leviramsey]

America however is different to the UK. The USA only has a one tier Taxi system. Here in the UK we already have a two tier system Hackney vs Private Hire, Uber fall into the latter. The arguments are different in the US to here

 

Nearly every large US city makes a distinction between Taxi and Livery (though they're typically regulated by the same authorities). Taxicabs are allowed to pick up street hails, Livery vehicles (typically "black cars") aren't.

Ah yes but your livery vehicles would come under the luxury bracket would they not? not the case here. The PH industry #ubered the traditional taxi trade many decades ago since the introduction of the Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act of 1976. So here Uber are trying to do a job that has already been done. 

If anything, the black cars work the poorer areas of cities.  In New York (apart from airport trips), the taxis generally won't go outside of Manhattan (or even that far north of roughly 110th Street in Manhattan): partly because of pedestrian density making it easier to get street hails, and also because they're more likely to get a good tip (that the driver typically has to pay the owner of the medallion (or the bank they borrowed from to finance a medallion) anywhere from $100 to $200 per 12-hour shift reinforces this); related to this is the general tendency of taxi drivers in the US to only let people who look poor (e.g. black) ride as a last resort.  In the Outer Boroughs (and Harlem), if you need a ride, you call a black car (or Uber).  Complicating things a little is that the black cars will pick up street hails in the neighborhoods where the taxis don't generally go, with the police and Taxi and Limousine Commission looking the other way.

There is the black Town Car (whatever will they do when the last of the Town Cars gives up the ghost?) luxury end of the livery business as well, generally only doing business alongside the taxis

[leviramsey]

You get an Uber but you've been surged? Why is that. The surge is meant to be because demand is high… yet you got a cab straight away so clearly supply isn't outstripping demand is it?

If supply is outstripping demand, surge pricing isn't working: the goal is to keep demand sufficiently below supply in order to allow the car to come straight away.

Uber in Liverpool has roughly 50 drivers, thats 50 drivers to cover the entire county of Merseyside 24 hours a day. They currently cannot ever cover demand so surging is a. utterly pointless and b. just a rip off as it can never do what it supposedly aims to do, they could make the surge x9 and they'd never cover the demand. They are currently declaring war on our company, and yes their Twitter trolls may actually have used that phrase. 50 drivers most of whom we've actually sacked at one stage or other of their career vs 2200 in our company and we're actually cheaper than them in most instances. The only reason they have drivers is because of the incentives. Surge pricing and economic theory is nonsense. Its just a way of chiseling money out of people. When you can't get more drivers to come out because there are no more to come out, how can surge pricing help that? It can't

You've genuinely gone off the deep end bicks.

First, it's "demand is clearly not outstripping supply, because you get a car straight away".  Then it's "the supply can never cover the demand."  Which is the case?

[leviramsey]

Like I said, we #ubered Liverpool before Uber was even a twinkle in Travis' eye.

And you seem to be beating the crap out of them, so why the borderline-deranged aggro (e.g. the rambling from topic to topic within the space of a paragraph)?

[bickster]

Like I said, we #ubered Liverpool before Uber was even a twinkle in Travis' eye.

And you seem to be beating the crap out of them, so why the borderline-deranged aggro (e.g. the rambling from topic to topic within the space of a paragraph)?

Because they can keep chucking money in our faces until they win. Plus their ultimate goal is to destroy an industry to levels where its actually financially impossible to actually make a living, London is pretty much bordering on this already from reading their driver forums.

Edited October 29, 2015 by bickster