The Randy Lerner thread

[thetrees]

 

 

Lambert's been shit but out of the last 4 shocking seasons he's only been here for 2 of them.

Funding has been used unwisely for the entire time that Randy Lerner has been at the club, which stretches to getting on for 8 years now.

But you are trotting out stats that are related to what has been happening on the pitch. And what happens on the pitch is the responsibly of the manager, who is Paul Lambert

You don't think what happens on the pitch is related to the owner? I fully agree about Lambert but the way this club has been run by Lerner has had a serious impact on the pitch.

 

With the backing afforded to Lambert versus the football that we have had to put up with, and the disgraceful home record no, I don't think that it is related to the owner, save for the fact that he hasn't sacked the manager.

 

Whatever is wrong with the general running of the club, we can all debate. There is no debate about the abysmal performance of the team, and the abysmal performance of the team manager.

[Isa]

I think people forget the total mess Lambert inherited from McLeish. It was always going to take time to build a team that could compete consistently and be entertaining with limited funding and an abundance of young players. Make no mistake this is a tough job, nobody could have done much better than Lambert but many could have done a lot worse. Lambert has done a good job IMO.

 

My great fear is IF we were to sack Lambert, we will end up with somebody like Stuart Pearce (probably recommended to Lerner by Terry Burton or some such person)  . Imagine Stuart Pearce chewing gum and marching up and down the touchline, and then banging on about mental toughness and superstitions in the PCs.  Yuck. It could be a lot worse chaps.

You still don't specify which expectations are aired on here which you deem unrealistic.

Also, I think it is a bit reactionary to stick with this manager just on the basis that we could do worse. You can always do worse in life. We could've done worse than McLeish for example. You are never going to make a risk-free appointment in any situation.

[Risso]

 

We could've done worse than McLeish for example.

 

 

Unbelievably, we did.

[GENTLEMAN]

You still don't specify which expectations are aired on here which you deem unrealistic. 

 

It is hard to specify clear expectations because people are too afraid to commit to a serious answer when directly asked, it is more about the attitude some supporters display to the current situation that disappoints me. It is all black and white to some of our supporters, it is a bad attitude to adopt and will cause the club problems.

 

It is mainly the negative attitudes to the current team and manager where I feel posters' unrealistic expectations become involved. For example, we are "shit" or "this is the worst team/player I have ever seen" is indicative of high expectations. There is also a general unwillingness to allow Lambert to build the club over a significant period of time, and these people also fail to acknowledge the mess Lambert inherited. 

 

It is time some supporters readjusted their expectations and get behind this current Villa team, it needs encouragement and support.

Also, I think it is a bit reactionary to stick with this manager just on the basis that we could do worse. You can always do worse in life. We could've done worse than McLeish for example. You are never going to make a risk-free appointment in any situation. 

 

It was a joke regarding Pearce.    Obviously, I have faith in the "project" under Lambert.

[Risso]

 

It is hard to specify clear expectations because people are too afraid to commit to a serious answer when directly asked, it is more about the attitude some supporters display to the current situation that disappoints me. It is all black and white to some of our supporters, it is a bad attitude to adopt and will cause the club problems.

 

 

It is mainly the negative attitudes to the current team and manager where I feel posters' unrealistic expectations become involved. For example, we are "shit" or "this is the worst team/player I have ever seen" is indicative of high expectations. There is also a general unwillingness to allow Lambert to build the club over a significant period of time, and these people also fail to acknowledge the mess Lambert inherited. 

 

It is time some supporters readjusted their expectations and get behind this current Villa team, it needs encouragement and support.

 

 

I don't have high expectations of Lambert.  I'd just like to him to play better football, and not buy so many bad footballers.  But managers tend not to change their spots, so it's unlikely that Arsene Wenger or Brendan Rodgers will next season turn into hoofball maestros, and I think it's unlikely that we'll ever see consistently decent football under Lambert, he just doesn't have the ability.  He may or may not be allowed to buy slightly better players, but I wouldn't trust him to make the right call to be honest, and I also wouldn't trust him to get us playing a higher standard of football either.

[Rovers13]

Fear of the future isn't a very good defence for a poor manager.

Most of the clubs around villa have been able to spend more money on wages and a per player basis with fees. Considering villa are still competitive and above many of them and won't go down again, how is this a poor job.

[Rovers13]

It is hard to specify clear expectations because people are too afraid to commit to a serious answer when directly asked, it is more about the attitude some supporters display to the current situation that disappoints me. It is all black and white to some of our supporters, it is a bad attitude to adopt and will cause the club problems.

It is mainly the negative attitudes to the current team and manager where I feel posters' unrealistic expectations become involved. For example, we are "shit" or "this is the worst team/player I have ever seen" is indicative of high expectations. There is also a general unwillingness to allow Lambert to build the club over a significant period of time, and these people also fail to acknowledge the mess Lambert inherited.

It is time some supporters readjusted their expectations and get behind this current Villa team, it needs encouragement and support.

I don't have high expectations of Lambert. I'd just like to him to play better football, and not buy so many bad footballers. But managers tend not to change their spots, so it's unlikely that Arsene Wenger or Brendan Rodgers will next season turn into hoofball maestros, and I think it's unlikely that we'll ever see consistently decent football under Lambert, he just doesn't have the ability. He may or may not be allowed to buy slightly better players, but I wouldn't trust him to make the right call to be honest, and I also wouldn't trust him to get us playing a higher standard of football either.

If you watched his Norwich side you'd be saying "I don't think lambert can adjust to a defensive, negative style, or if he can organize a defense." Because for the three years they played what I've seen described as "all out attack" and "Glasgow gambler" by Norwich fans. They couldn't keep a clean sheet, but were free scoring. So yes, he has changed style.

As has Rodgers. He's turned Liverpool into a fast counter attacking side when his swansea team was all about slow buildups and possession. When that didn't work for half a year at Liverpool, he adjusted.

[McGregor1888]

 

 

It is hard to specify clear expectations because people are too afraid to commit to a serious answer when directly asked, it is more about the attitude some supporters display to the current situation that disappoints me. It is all black and white to some of our supporters, it is a bad attitude to adopt and will cause the club problems.

 

 

It is mainly the negative attitudes to the current team and manager where I feel posters' unrealistic expectations become involved. For example, we are "shit" or "this is the worst team/player I have ever seen" is indicative of high expectations. There is also a general unwillingness to allow Lambert to build the club over a significant period of time, and these people also fail to acknowledge the mess Lambert inherited. 

 

It is time some supporters readjusted their expectations and get behind this current Villa team, it needs encouragement and support.

 

 

I don't have high expectations of Lambert.  I'd just like to him to play better football, and not buy so many bad footballers.  But managers tend not to change their spots, so it's unlikely that Arsene Wenger or Brendan Rodgers will next season turn into hoofball maestros, and I think it's unlikely that we'll ever see consistently decent football under Lambert, he just doesn't have the ability.  He may or may not be allowed to buy slightly better players, but I wouldn't trust him to make the right call to be honest, and I also wouldn't trust him to get us playing a higher standard of football either.

 

Lambert has made the right call at every crucial stage of his Villa career so far.  

[GENTLEMAN]

Speaking of Rodgers - He rocked up at Southampton with a 4-4-2 Diamond, Lambert educated him at Anfield obviously. 

[Big_John_10]

Funny I don't remember people saying we should adjust our expectations for Doug and DOL.

Not sure why I should embrace shit football and poor results because its Lerner and Lambert.

[TRO]

 

You still don't specify which expectations are aired on here which you deem unrealistic. 

 

It is hard to specify clear expectations because people are too afraid to commit to a serious answer when directly asked, it is more about the attitude some supporters display to the current situation that disappoints me. It is all black and white to some of our supporters, it is a bad attitude to adopt and will cause the club problems.

 

It is mainly the negative attitudes to the current team and manager where I feel posters' unrealistic expectations become involved. For example, we are "shit" or "this is the worst team/player I have ever seen" is indicative of high expectations. There is also a general unwillingness to allow Lambert to build the club over a significant period of time, and these people also fail to acknowledge the mess Lambert inherited. 

 

It is time some supporters readjusted their expectations and get behind this current Villa team, it needs encouragement and support.

Also, I think it is a bit reactionary to stick with this manager just on the basis that we could do worse. You can always do worse in life. We could've done worse than McLeish for example. You are never going to make a risk-free appointment in any situation. 

 

It was a joke regarding Pearce.    Obviously, I have faith in the "project" under Lambert.

 

 

we all have to support....that is unquestionable, that is basically our job as supporters...by definition.

 

The question is do we have our own hidden agenda's in the same way that the club hierarchy may have.

 

for example...I am one of those fans that glean my opinions from the football on display, not the results or the league table( having said that it does have a bearing) I watch the players and decide individually if they are progressing or regressing, then I look at us as a team and how we set about getting results.

 

Paul Lambert has had 2 seasons of austerity, which has been exceedingly difficult, but even if he had been given healthy funds,I am no more certain that much would have changed( could have done, just that I am no certain it would)

 

some managers over the years have displayed a skill at acquiring low cost players and blending them in to decent outfit.....its difficult, but not impossible as some fans are quick to point out.

 

We have unfortunately achieved 4 wins to date at home this season which is poor in anyones language and does not lend itself to an argument that positively promotes progression. We are treading water IMO and the signs are we will be here again next season, baring divine intervention.

 

I'm not sure how a better quality player will be able to slot in to our side when we continue to play the style of football we do.....this.. no respect for possession, direct style...will not attract the players, some of us crave.

 

I really don't see the progression that is been intimated and I really don't see this argument, that time will deliver us from low grade football in the arms of expansive, progressive football that can believably give us a chance of honours.

 

In my eyes we have let the big boys go out to party, while we stay at home.....We will be in this mediocre state in 10 years time having the same conversations.

 

Ps With the Owners we had in 1980/81/82 we would have been in the same stale state as we are today.......If it was'nt for the ambition,drive and determination, not to mention the Nous of Ron Saunders,Tony Barton and Roy McLaren.....that wonderful spell would still be a dream.

 

 

Over to you Paul L 

Edited March 15, 2014 by TRO

[villan_007]

Funny I don't remember people saying we should adjust our expectations for Doug and DOL.

Not sure why I should embrace shit football and poor results because its Lerner and Lambert.

That'll be your selective memory kicking in again.

[TRO]

I could talk about owners until the cows come how...

 

.....Its all about managers and their staff for me.

 

Sturridge - 12 mill

Bent        - c 20 mill

 

just a little tiny drop of criteria in a Vat of excuses.

 

 

says it all for me.

 

Ps no doubt someone will say just one incident, because I couldn't be bothered to write the boat load.

[Big_John_10]

Funny I don't remember people saying we should adjust our expectations for Doug and DOL.

Not sure why I should embrace shit football and poor results because its Lerner and Lambert.

That'll be your selective memory kicking in again.

So people were adjusting their expectations to back Doug and DOL? That will be your fantasy dreams kicking in again.

[shaggy]

Lambert is NOT the problem. A bigger problem is the lack of patience and understanding from certain supporters who live in a fantasy world and expect everything to be perfect. Get real guys.

Comments like this sort of lose any credence with unnecessary embellishment like this.

Isa it is not unnecessary embellishment when you have "some" supporters admitting they will never lessen their high expectations (perfection), which causes all sorts of problems for a club looking to rebuild slowly. Lambert is being judged on the wrong criteria IMO.

Wrong criteria? What do we judge a manager on then if not results?

[GENTLEMAN]

Funny I don't remember people saying we should adjust our expectations for Doug and DOL.

DOL was at the club for three years and we regressed each season. 

Edited March 15, 2014 by GENTLEMAN

[TRO]

Randy Lerner for me has one problem only.

 

.....to date can't pick Managers or CEO's

 

if Paul Lambert comes good, I'll retract that......but in the meantime, will wait and see.

Edited March 15, 2014 by TRO

[Big_John_10]

Funny I don't remember people saying we should adjust our expectations for Doug and DOL.

DOL was at the club for three years and we regressed each season.

And his last season got us more points than our previous 2 and potentially more than this current year.

Randy Lerner for me has one problem only.

.....to date can't pick Managers or CEO's

if Paul Lambert comes good, I'll retract that......but in the meantime, will wait and see.

That's a pretty big problem for an owner of a club.

The only other major thing he has to do is control finances and he's shown to be a complete **** up in that department.

[GENTLEMAN]

 

 

 

Lambert is NOT the problem. A bigger problem is the lack of patience and understanding from certain supporters who live in a fantasy world and expect everything to be perfect. Get real guys.

Comments like this sort of lose any credence with unnecessary embellishment like this.

Isa it is not unnecessary embellishment when you have "some" supporters admitting they will never lessen their high expectations (perfection), which causes all sorts of problems for a club looking to rebuild slowly. Lambert is being judged on the wrong criteria IMO.

Wrong criteria? What do we judge a manager on then if not results?

 

It is dangerous to judge purely on a few disappointing results in a "long term" project. The end of next season will tell us more about the direction we are going under Lambert.

Edited March 15, 2014 by GENTLEMAN

[TRO]

 

 

Funny I don't remember people saying we should adjust our expectations for Doug and DOL.

DOL was at the club for three years and we regressed each season.

And his last season got us more points than our previous 2 and potentially more than this current year.

Randy Lerner for me has one problem only.

.....to date can't pick Managers or CEO's

if Paul Lambert comes good, I'll retract that......but in the meantime, will wait and see.

That's a pretty big problem for an owner of a club.

The only other major thing he has to do is control finances and he's shown to be a complete **** up in that department.

 

John, I don't want to get in to a long winded debate about finances, but my view is had the players that we over paid in both fee's and wages had of turned out to be top quality individuals that formed a team to win things the finances may have not been the issue they turned out to be, because extra revenue would have been enjoyed.

 

For me (and I accept you disagree with me) the issue that caused all the problems, was most of our signings over the last 8 years have been poor and not delivered their value.