Bolitics The New Condem Government

[chrisp65]

I do actually enjoy a bit of champagne.

As a ranting lefty, should I feel guilty?

 

I'm a sort of Ferrari's for everyone kind of communist. As long as they still eat pasties whilst driving.

[thetrees]

 

 

 

Imagine if MP's were paid as much as he was... that would be a talking point.

there is a great article on they're of his wages think it was in the Indy

 

I afforded myself a wry smile yesterday.

Had a prominently positioned person of the non-left suffered such a premature demise, then there would be left ranters calling for scrutinisation of his expenses, to determine how much rich food and expensive wine had contributed to said demise.

 

But that's the nice thing about the champagne of socialism. It's always free and completely unquestionable.

 

Interestingly I think you are mixing up your perceptions of accountability and scrutiny.

 

Could show real examples of the assumptions you are making especially based on political leanings?

 

The wry smile is on my face especially when right wingers resort to the silly name likes "champagne socialism", shows a complete and utter weakness IMO in their argument.

 

Ian, please do not confuse my dissatisfaction with the general hypocrisy of people who would call themselves 'Socialist' and 'Socialism' in general, with 'right wing'.

Because I dislike one thing doesn't instantly make me 'the other'.

[TrentVilla]

 

 

 

Perhaps you should read what you post rather than what you think is posted.

I agree with the above inflation rise but it is a matter of fact that said rise will have an impact upon labour costs. That will to some extent or another have an impact upon both public and private sector employers and potentially on their willingness or ability to recruit.

I would love to see something to support the notion that most people living in poverty will be earning more than next years NMW.

Your last line literally makes no sense.

In short I said October's rise is so small it's irrelevant. It won't effect employers. A rise to the living wage level of I think around £7.75 would have an effect on small businesses which could be absorbed by reduced rates.

The NHS is an interesting example. The problems the NHS are facing and are going to face are those created by Labour and now the Tories through these crazy PFI schemes not the cleaners at the bottom.

And in short I'm saying you are talking utter rubbish if you think a 3% rise in NWM will have no affect upon employers. As for the living wage being absorbed by reduced rates... I'd love to see how that one would work.

As for the rest of this post about the NHS and PFI that really has nothing to do with the topic of NMW.

You think I'm talking utter rubbish then immediately attribute to me a conclusion I never even gave. I propose a rise, in conjunction with other policies, up to a living wage.

...'Oh no that's impossible, unworkable blah blah blah'. It's funny how everything is impossible - until it comes to fleecing the poorest, that's dead easy, it seems.

 

 

You might want to read your post again I've not attributed any conclusion to you simply quoted back what you've said.

 

I note you have yet to provide anything to back up your previous claim about those living in poverty and NMW.

[thetrees]

Just for clarity re his wages that seem to preoccupy the right wing maybe a read of this may sort of clear up some of the myth

 

http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/03/12/the-myth-of-bob-crows-145000-salary/

Again, I had no idea of his salary. £125k is indeed a lot less than £145k.

 

But then 'motoring expenses' of £149k can certainly hide a lot of chauffeuring.

 

Ah well, at least a needy, working class person might get off the council house waiting list now

[Kingfisher]

Perhaps you should read what you post rather than what you think is posted.

I agree with the above inflation rise but it is a matter of fact that said rise will have an impact upon labour costs. That will to some extent or another have an impact upon both public and private sector employers and potentially on their willingness or ability to recruit.

I would love to see something to support the notion that most people living in poverty will be earning more than next years NMW.

Your last line literally makes no sense.

In short I said October's rise is so small it's irrelevant. It won't effect employers. A rise to the living wage level of I think around £7.75 would have an effect on small businesses which could be absorbed by reduced rates.

The NHS is an interesting example. The problems the NHS are facing and are going to face are those created by Labour and now the Tories through these crazy PFI schemes not the cleaners at the bottom.

And in short I'm saying you are talking utter rubbish if you think a 3% rise in NWM will have no affect upon employers. As for the living wage being absorbed by reduced rates... I'd love to see how that one would work.

As for the rest of this post about the NHS and PFI that really has nothing to do with the topic of NMW.

You think I'm talking utter rubbish then immediately attribute to me a conclusion I never even gave. I propose a rise, in conjunction with other policies, up to a living wage.

...'Oh no that's impossible, unworkable blah blah blah'. It's funny how everything is impossible - until it comes to fleecing the poorest, that's dead easy, it seems.

You might want to read your post again I've not attributed any conclusion to you simply quoted back what you've said.

I note you have yet to provide anything to back up your previous claim about those living in poverty and NMW.

I'm saying the October increase won't effect employers in any significant way. If you think otherwise then I'm not the only one obliged to present evidence.

Most people in poverty will be earning above the October rise. That's the group we need to address if we are serious about ending in work poverty. If that's false, I'd like to see the evidence.

I'm working off common sense, I will go out there an get evidence if you really want. (Not tonight, I'm nackered lol).

Edited March 12, 2014 by Kingfisher

[Risso]

Just for clarity re his wages that seem to preoccupy the right wing maybe a read of this may sort of clear up some of the myth

 

http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/03/12/the-myth-of-bob-crows-145000-salary/

 

Yeah you right wing nutters at The Mirror, get it right!

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/bob-crow-dead-best-quotes-3229344

[peterms]

 

I don't agree with your conclusion that employers that pay NMW are "the shabbiest employers" by the way or that benefits are subsidy for these employers.

Shabbiest is a value judgement. I suppose if you pay nmw you won't agree with it. Perhaps there are some struggling charities who pay nmw who aren't poor employers, but generally, if you imagine a Venn diagram of poor employers and those paying nmw, there will be very large overlap.

The subsidy point is not a value judgement. If two firms are of similar characteristics and one pays living wage while the other pays nmw and the state makes up the difference (or thereabouts) in benefits, obviously one firm is having its wage bill artificially subsidised. On what possible basis could you argue otherwise? That the subsidy is concealed?

[peterms]

[drat01]

Just for clarity re his wages that seem to preoccupy the right wing maybe a read of this may sort of clear up some of the myth

http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/03/12/the-myth-of-bob-crows-145000-salary/

Yeah you right wing nutters at The Mirror, get it right!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/bob-crow-dead-best-quotes-3229344

not sure of your point there mart .

At the end of the day the headline figure often quoted is wrong but hey ho if it keeps right wingers happy to indulge in mock annoyance then so be it

[Kingfisher]

Hot on the heels of the bombshell that Britain just can't afford to raise people out of poverty, just can't afford a national health system, just can't afford...well anything really, bankers bonuses are up 44%!

Tories... cleaning up the mess.

[Kingfisher]

Why raise the NMW? It will stifle the pay day loan industry!

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/mar/12/uk-payday-loan-shop-banks-building-societies

Notice Glasgow is top? Why oh why do the Scottish want to break away??? Hmmm it's a mystery. It must be those smelly ginger nationalists, yeah it's probably that.

[colhint]

isn't that a bit racist

[Kingfisher]

Q: How about a minimum wage set at the living wage? ...So we can raise people out of poverty?

'No no no, impossible... we just can't possibly do that I'm sorry, bad for the economy, blah blah blah'.

Q: How about some new FCA rules from April which will allow payday lenders to demand more than double the loan back after less than 90 days?

'Why not! Great idea!'

[Kingfisher]

Private firms win 70% of NHS contracts... what could possibly go wrong?

In other news, G4S tagging contract repaying govt £109m for false claims on tags for dead and prisoners.

That's fraud isn't it? G4S tried to defraud us of over £100m? Will we be paying them to tag themselves now?

Tories, 'cleaning up the mess'.

[Risso]

Q: How about a minimum wage set at the living wage? ...So we can raise people out of poverty?

'No no no, impossible... we just can't possibly do that I'm sorry, bad for the economy, blah blah blah'.

Q: How about some new FCA rules from April which will allow payday lenders to demand more than double the loan back after less than 90 days?

'Why not! Great idea!'

Link for that last bit?

[MakemineVanilla]

It seems that the reason Bob Crow got, and continues to get, such a bad press from the Right, and provokes such a knee-jerk hostile response from Tories who take their opinions wholesale and unquestioned from the tabloids, is not because he was a notoriously disruptive Lefty, it is because he provides an unwanted example to workers, that there are definite advantages in joining a trade union. 

 

This can only be the case because a cursory examination of the performance of London rail and Underground, shows exactly what Boris meant when he praised Bob Crow, for helping to drive forward huge progress for London Underground.

 

What is unavoidably clear is that there has been a massive restructuring of London Underground since 2009/10 and savings of £585m, against a target of £439m, were achieved.

 

None of this could have been achieved without the full co-operation of Bob Crow and his union.

 

So presenting him as some kind of kamikaze Lefty, is just a lie, but a useful lie; it can't be denied. 

[Kingfisher]

Q: How about a minimum wage set at the living wage? ...So we can raise people out of poverty?

'No no no, impossible... we just can't possibly do that I'm sorry, bad for the economy, blah blah blah'.

Q: How about some new FCA rules from April which will allow payday lenders to demand more than double the loan back after less than 90 days?

'Why not! Great idea!'

Link for that last bit?

https://twitter.com/paullewismoney/status/444040955952635905

[Risso]

I can't see Twitter at work, but I was hoping for something a bit more concrete.  A link to the FCA regs for example.

[Kingfisher]

I can't see Twitter at work, but I was hoping for something a bit more concrete. A link to the FCA regs for example.

Google it if you have time, Paul Lewis didn't provide a link.

Tories : cleaning up the mess.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

Cleaning up the mess, one rotten nurse at a time.