Now it's nearly over, what next?

[DCJonah]

8 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Well again, you have your opinions, but I'm referring to a discussion the board will have, not what the board think versus what you think. 

I get that. And the board would be wrong to put forward that discussion.

[Jareth]

1 minute ago, Junxs said:

New manager will have no money so we will see the likes of Bree, RHP and O'Hare becoming regulars. No doubt there will be 5 loan signings of either over the hill or youth players who are not ready coming in and we'll finish mid table in a transitional year. 

I think we can retain experience in the squad but bring through some genuine if raw talents. Agreed we will need at least one transitional season, but I can see the fans giving a bright little team some time and patience. I don't sign up to the (am I allowed to say) hysterics, that we will become Forest, we have a very ambitious owner, rules on FFP in flux, and the sort of club and facilities to attract the best youth talent from the leagues below. I know I am just saying all this to prepare for the doom of losing play-offs, but I don't think I'm being wildly optimistic in this assessment. 

[Jareth]

2 minutes ago, Eastie said:

This for me is a key thing - big wages - there are a lot of older players here that in my view are here for the money as villa pay bigger wages - they lack the hunger or desire to succeed and are happy to pick up the easy cash .

Good point mate, I think that adds up for me as to why we've seen some performances we have. They've risen to the occassion much of the time, but not enough to see us over the line. 

[Jareth]

Looking forward to the West Brom games, they'll be like Sunderland. 

[DCJonah]

5 minutes ago, Jareth said:

I hope so. He's done more or less what he was supposed to do, if he fails then with the finances changing he would be the wrong man for the job, unable to rely on his little black book as that requires large wages. 

What? 

If you are set a target, one that has big consequences on the future of the club, the you either meet it or don't. There is no more or less, that is nonsense. 

[Eastie]

4 minutes ago, Jareth said:

I think we can retain experience in the squad but bring through some genuine if raw talents. Agreed we will need at least one transitional season, but I can see the fans giving a bright little team some time and patience. I don't sign up to the (am I allowed to say) hysterics, that we will become Forest, we have a very ambitious owner, rules on FFP in flux, and the sort of club and facilities to attract the best youth talent from the leagues below. I know I am just saying all this to prepare for the doom of losing play-offs, but I don't think I'm being wildly optimistic in this assessment. 

I’d fancy with the right manager we may have an outside shot at the play offs next season - others have proved it can be done with little spending power .

we have the loan market to explore - I’d expect terry ,Grealish and the current loan players to be gone - with Hutton and gabby released that may balance the books for another season .

some good young players  I guess comIng  through too .

Edited April 8, 2018 by Eastie

[Jareth]

Just now, DCJonah said:

What? 

If you are set a target, one that has big consequences on the future of the club, the you either meet it or don't. There is no more or less, that is nonsense. 

Well yep, you're not wrong, Tony says get us promotion, he hasn't. But Bruce will say, I haven't sat on my hands all season, look I got you play-offs. The conversation is moot, it won't actualy take place, Bruce knows he's off in that scenario. 

[Jareth]

3 minutes ago, Eastie said:

I’d fancy with the right manager we may have an outside shot at the play offs next season - others have proved it can be done with little spending power .

we have the loan market to explore - I’d expect terry ,Grealish and the current loan players to be gone - with Hutton and gabby released that may balance the books for another season .

some good young players co I guess through too .

Two words, Gareth. Barry. Mind you he'd cost wages we can't do, so scratch that. 

Edited April 8, 2018 by Jareth

[Eastie]

Just now, Jareth said:

Well yep, you're not wrong, Tony says get us promotion, he hasn't. But Bruce will say, I haven't sat on my hands all season, look I got you play-offs. The conversation is moot, it won't actualy take place, Bruce knows he's off in that scenario. 

I think Bruce knows he’s probably off even if promoted 

[DCJonah]

What we will need next year is more of a focus on coaching and tactics, not just relying on having the best players. 

If we hired a young coach (think coach is important) i'd be quite excited to see something built, using our young players and making smart signings. I could accept a few more years if we were building something like that. 

 

[Dr_Pangloss]

17 minutes ago, Jareth said:

I respectfully disagree, Kodjia, in the right system will be deadly with the likes of Grealish and COH. 

Depends, I seriously doubt we'd get back what we have paid for him.

[Eastie]

Just now, DCJonah said:

What we will need next year is more of a focus on coaching and tactics, not just relying on having the best players. 

If we hired a young coach (think coach is important) i'd be quite excited to see something built, using our young players and making smart signings. I could accept a few more years if we were building something like that. 

 

Probably could take 3 years to come to fruition but would xia be prepared to wait or decide to cut his losses and get out .

[Eastie]

Just now, Dr_Pangloss said:

Depends, I seriously doubt we'd get back what we have paid for him.

Agreed , especially after 2 bad injuries .

[Jareth]

2 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

Depends, I seriously doubt we'd get back what we have paid for him.

Now that we have some hindsight having gone down and possibly failed at getting back up by throwing money at it - one thing I've taken away from that is that those 3 clubs coming down, will do exactly what we did, if not pay more. Kodjia less attractive next season for the injury, but deffo with inflation I think we can get near what he cost us. 

Edit: well maybe half. Throw in Richards and he's free. 

Edited April 8, 2018 by Jareth

[Eastie]

6 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Now that we have some hindsight having gone down and possibly failed at getting back up by throwing money at it - one thing I've taken away from that is that those 3 clubs coming down, will do exactly what we did, if not pay more. Kodjia less attractive next season for the injury, but deffo with inflation I think we can get near what he cost us. 

Edit: well maybe half. Throw in Richards and he's free. 

Not sure they  will do - look at the mess Sunderland and hull are in - clubs coming down will face massive loss of income from budgets - if anything they will lose their better players - despite the parachute payments anyone coming down will be hit massively financially 

Edited April 8, 2018 by Eastie

[Demitri_C]

44 minutes ago, Eastie said:

Depends what you term big money - Chester certainly would probably fetch £5m but why sell him - Albert maybe £4m - only Grealish would attract over £10m in my opinion 

Not sure about those valuations mate. Adomah I think can fetch 10m after all the goals he has this year. I also think hourihane is now worth a significant amount if money.

Not saying id sell any of them just that I think we can get more. Chester has been great for years now worth more than t7m in my eyes.

[Eastie]

2 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Not sure about those valuations mate. Adomah I think can fetch 10m after all the goals he has this year. I also think hourihane is now worth a significant amount if money.

Not saying id sell any of them just that I think we can get more. Chester has been great for years now worth more than t7m in my eyes.

£10m for adomah at his age ? Not a chance

‘depends what you term significant money - for me only Grealish would fetch Over £10m.

Hourihane maybe £6m - there were reports he was being looked at in January by Brighton with £3m bandied about .

Edited April 8, 2018 by Eastie

[Demitri_C]

2 minutes ago, Eastie said:

£10m for adomah at his age ? Not a chance

‘depends what you term significant money - for me only Grealish would fetch Over £10m.

Hourihane maybe £6m - there were reports he was being looked at in January by Brighton with £3m bandied about .

We paid 12m for McCormack!!

Mate they were talking about cairney going for 15m in January no way hourihane is worth 3m!

[Johnnyp]

Id hope that dean smith holds tight on the baggies job and we then make our move for him in late may. I'll get slated for this but he will get guys like tshibola playing again because we wont be bypassing midfield under smith. Grealish will leave. Cant blame him. He is a super talent but naturally he wants to play for england and he aint doing that in the championship. 

[Rodders]

Bruce must go regardless of the outcome.

I am thinking of Champiosnhip for next year, as I can't for the life of me see how this side performs when it matters in the play offs, they have successively already demonstrated an utter failure to do so multiple times already.

We won't get Johnstone, as he will have prem offers, we won't get snodgrass as likewise, terry won't stay, hutton should be released ( wages ), samba, and gabby will be released. I suspect we may struggle to keep hold of Grealish.  We've still got to deal with McCormack and hope someone takes him. Tuanzabe goes back as he hasn't played much for us. Onomah can bugger off.

As for the likes of Hogan - if we get a manager who isn't a simpleton and can recognise the actual qualities of the players, it is probably worth retaining him to get the best out of him, otherwise we will suffer another loss.

At least one of Jedinak / Whelan will go, though keeping one is fine by me.

We also need to sell Taylor to anyone, what a disappointment. Also sell Elmo. Will need at least 2 centre backs as we will only have Chester, and the untested Suliman.

with minimal money available we will need 1 x goalie ( though if money is too tight I think Jed Steer is fine enough for the championship ) 2 x left backs 2 x centre halfs, 1 x right back ( and hope that Bree can step up ) ,  we then need to address the midfield and forward options, and form a unit that makes sense rather than just buying big names - which we won't be able to do mercifully.  We'll need an actual coherent plan as to how they all sync up. Hourihane Bjarnasson, Jedi / Whelan, Lansbury Adomah will stay I think.  Grealish - I have my doubts as mentioned, in which case we have serious issues in replacing his creativity. We need at least another winger.  Maybe we will get Grabban then, if he doesn't cost loads, may as well.

We will need another exploiting of the loan market to fill many of these places. Davis, Hepburn Murphy, Bree, Suliman Steer could help solve some of the questions, but they will need help, but **** it, experience didn't work so getting in a manager who isn't afraid to work with youngsters and can form a cohesive style is essential. We need someone who knows how to spot ability and use it properly.

Outside of further transfers I think our squad should, in summary still have:

Steer // Chester, Bree, Suliman // Hourihane, Bjarnasson, Jedi / Whelan, Lansbury, Adomah // Hepburn-Murphy, Davis, Hogan.

So, we need serious work on the defence. Maybe we keep Elmo afterall, we may not have a choice :/