Steve Bruce

[DCJonah]

20 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

It is promotion form. By the very definition of form. 

That doesn't mean it is good enough to get us promoted. 

Like I said, if Bolton won 5 of their next 6 they'd be producing title winning form. That doesn't mean they'd win the title. 

I'd disagree with the use of then as well. 

The original post said "While we are achievingpromotionform and results I fail to see how there can be much of an argument against him"

Again, the context it's used in I'd disagree with. Those expressing an argument against him are doing so because they don't believe he will get us promoted. Using the phrase 'Promotion form' to say people shouldn't have this argument is nonsense when this 'Promotion form' isn't the sort of form that will currently get us promoted. 

 

 

[Stevo985]

13 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

I'd disagree with the use of then as well. 

The original post said "While we are achievingpromotionform and results I fail to see how there can be much of an argument against him"

Again, the context it's used in I'd disagree with. Those expressing an argument against him are doing so because they don't believe he will get us promoted. Using the phrase 'Promotion form' to say people shouldn't have this argument is nonsense when this 'Promotion form' isn't the sort of form that will currently get us promoted. 

 

 

 whatever dude. Just seems so petty to be arguing against the use of "form" when it's been used that way forever. It's like you're trying extra hard to be negative.

Edited September 29, 2017 by Stevo985

[Lerner's Driver]

4 hours ago, terrytini said:

Get with the program DC ! It's 'Bruce In ' week !

Oh, how I long for a bit of balance in this thread. Please be 'Bruce out' week again soon. It's been just tooooo long long in this hysterical state of calm. A Bolton draw would do it, c'maaan you Villa Boys!

[DCJonah]

1 minute ago, Stevo985 said:

 whatever dude. Just seems so petty to be arguing against the use of "form" when it's been used that way forever. It's like you're trying extra hard to be negative.

I'm actually feeling pretty positive at the moment. Can't wait to go to VP tomorrow. 

If it wasn't used as a part of an argument to basically tell people they shouldn't have concerns then I probably wouldn't have focused so much on the term. But as it was I think it's only fair to point out the flaw in the argument. 

[TRO]

36 minutes ago, VILLAMARV said:

I really couldn't care less what is said in the media on the whole, so whether the targets that were set or not set were realistic given the state of the club and who said what and when is all a bit of a moot point for me.

What I think I know, without any inside knowledge, is last year we were in freefall. This year we could challenge near the top of the league.

Last year I genuinely felt recovering from the manner of our relegation and years of supposed neglect that going back up was beyond us. Many didn't, but expecting to ship out 20+ players and have everything click is a tall ask anyway let alone for a guy inheriting the squad from RDM in October that he did - not that all RDM's purchases were a 'miss', Jedinak, Chester, Adomah and Kodjia all 'hits' for me. But McCormack, Gollini, Tshibola and Elphick in particular were a colossal waste of time, effort and money. A team of Hutton, Westwood, Bacuna, Agbonlahor etc isn't going to carry £20m+ worth of purchases not working out in key positions all over the pitch.

Being hard to beat with a front 5 people will not be looking forward to coming up against helps our cause immensely. Lets hope it continues. Hogan, Onomah, Lansbury, with Jedinak, Grealish, Green to come back at some point is infinitely better than a bench of Gabby, Gardner, Bacuna et al and with the youngsters coming through it looks like there's a bit of depth all of a sudden and some competition. something we've lacked for years. Although If I have concerns it's about cover for left back and centre back. Chester and Taylor in particular are both vital imo along with the obvious Kodjia.

The amount of money it cost to put them there, the history of the club, our expectations, they are all irrelevant when 11 blokes take to the field for 90 mins. We are in better shape than last year. Whether it is going to be enough remains to be seen. I'm quietly optimistic, whether that can turn into being quietly confident is something I think I'm going to find out over the next 6 games. We will see.

Bruce, for me, basically has to turn doing ok into doing well and we'll be fine and he'll keep his job.

Thats just about bang on where I am.....good post VM IMO

Edited September 29, 2017 by TRO

[terrytini]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

sarcasm taking over I see Terry.....well not one of your better posts Terry......that one certainly plays to the gallery.

bit of positivity ( is all) put forward and the wobble starts.

I find a lot of what you post to be overly sanctimonious but never, ever say so.

Why not stick to making your own points rather than criticising mine ?

As far as I'm concerned that Post is actually very kind to Bruce AND suggests trying to look forward rather than back.

It DOES point out there is a massive rewrite of history going on in the views of some posters, which is my view. I don't see what's wrong with that.

I actually find it embarrassing how some folks are actually using this last minute ( he must've been very close to the sack) and - for all we know - temporary improvement as evidence he was the right guy all along. But I tend not to say so preferring instead to just voice MY view on him and leave others to theirs.

Ive attended over 40 games with Bruce in charge and come almost to the point of ceasing watching football. I didn't imagine those feelings.

Where I DO agree with you is that life is too short, if he has finally got it going then great.

We don't know that yet that he has but as I said in my Post I'm happy to see what happens.

[terrytini]

1 hour ago, bannedfromHandV said:

Got to love (or is it loathe) the nerve and arrogance of those who even now cannot bring themselves to consider that they may have been wrong, that some think we've only turned a corner because Bruce 'has listened to them' is an absolute joke.

Dead right.

Who are these people that say he has listened to them ? They deserve ridicule, but I can't find any ?

[terrytini]

1 hour ago, DCJonah said:

I'd disagree with the use of then as well. 

The original post said "While we are achievingpromotionform and results I fail to see how there can be much of an argument against him"

Again, the context it's used in I'd disagree with. Those expressing an argument against him are doing so because they don't believe he will get us promoted. Using the phrase 'Promotion form' to say people shouldn't have this argument is nonsense when this 'Promotion form' isn't the sort of form that will currently get us promoted. 

 

 

Yes.

I wonder what reception you'd have got for saying we were in "relegation form" a few weeks ago ?

Ill hazard a guess " hysteria", " doom monger", " not enough games to form an opinion", " let's see where we are after 46 games" ?

[Demitri_C]

It's interesting reading that arc toe from candleface when he said Bruce called him and he said he feared the sack if a bad result at Barnsley. Bloody hell didn't think any of would predict what would happen since then!

[peterms]

Dem, you gotta get a bigger screen or smaller thumbs, man.

[dn1982]

28 minutes ago, terrytini said:

I find a lot of what you post to be overly sanctimonious but never, ever say so.

Why not stick to making your own points rather than criticising mine ?

As far as I'm concerned that Post is actually very kind to Bruce AND suggests trying to look forward rather than back.

It DOES point out there is a massive rewrite of history going on in the views of some posters, which is my view. I don't see what's wrong with that.

I actually find it embarrassing how some folks are actually using this last minute ( he must've been very close to the sack) and - for all we know - temporary improvement as evidence he was the right guy all along. But I tend not to say so preferring instead to just voice MY view on him and leave others to theirs.

Ive attended over 40 games with Bruce in charge and come almost to the point of ceasing watching football. I didn't imagine those feelings.

Where I DO agree with you is that life is too short, if he has finally got it going then great.

We don't know that yet that he has but as I said in my Post I'm happy to see what happens.

At present we are still under acheiving. You can pick whatever amount of games to form whatever opinion you like but let's be honest and realistic. Burton was a very good performance but we should be winning the game if we want to go up. We still haven't beaten anyone who will be in contention at Easter. We've seen Bruce have runs of good results but they've been followed by awful ones hopefully we can build on Burton and sustain it. Even Bruces biggest fans must acknowledge he's been below par and I'm sure he's biigest haters will back him as long as he does what he was brought in to do. Let's smash Burton then in October Bruce can show we are the real deal. 

[terrytini]

Or Bolton ?

Burton might object if we play them again so soon.. 

[Grasshopper]

11 hours ago, villan_007 said:

How about his golf swing? 268yrds will that get us promoted?

Not a chance

Even with perfect weight transfer (and he has a fair few kebabs/lbs on him)

[Grasshopper]

20 hours ago, TRO said:

so you pick up on one point.....pedantic.

No @TRO

what he said was exactly right

[Stevo985]

1 hour ago, terrytini said:

Yes.

I wonder what reception you'd have got for saying we were in "relegation form" a few weeks ago ?

Ill hazard a guess " hysteria", " doom monger", " not enough games to form an opinion", " let's see where we are after 46 games" ?

Well we've not been in relegation form this season, so the reaction would have probably been "no we're not".

But if we had been in relegation form, then the reception would have probably been "yes we are in relegation form but we probably won't get relegated because that's not how form works, but things definitely need to get better"

Again, I wonder what people read in this thread. Before the last few games this thread had been almost unanimously Bruce Out for weeks. Yet posters like you seem to be peddling this myth that you were getting mocked for wanting him out. It's really strange.

Edited September 29, 2017 by Stevo985

[Grasshopper]

20 hours ago, TRO said:

so why did they not sack Bruce

Ok

you ask the question

1- they sacked RDM because of the results

2- They got Bruce because of his 4promo record

3- This is conjecture but I can well imagine that during Nov/Dec talks were arranged for the transfer window strategy. (At this time Bruce was getting points on the board) That must have included

SJ<->Gollini

A fit Gaby for Kodjia Afcon - Striker in if possible too (Hogan came)

Ayew, Gestede & Westwood out if offers came in.

Lansbury, Hourihane......

etc.............

that means imho before Cardiff  the board were still "behind Bruce" and the subsequent bad run thereafter didnt de-rail their support. (It may have p*ss*d DrT off but who are we to know.)

4- the good run came and the board probably felt that they had no reason to sack him (in their opinion - possibly)

5- after the Burton game de-railed our playoff ambitions, who could they turn to other than Bruce?

6- Seasons End - this was the point where they could decide to stick or twist

Personally, I'd have got rid after Cardiff/lastest Brentford giving a new manager the possibility of

hitting the ground running -> playoffs

or

Building for the new season.

For whatever reason, they stuck. we'll never know but if there was a percentage scale

<-50/50-> = Stick with Bruce/no outstanding candidate available or interested

Then one can understand the stick rather than twist.

As things are now set its on the collective boards head, not yours or mine.

We'll see

Bruce is probably still on thin ice, a 0-0 or 0-1 v Bolton (mclose atmo deja vu ?) or a bad run in Oct and the hysteria will soon return.

 

[Demitri_C]

1 hour ago, peterms said:

Dem, you gotta get a bigger screen or smaller thumbs, man.

Or they need to put larger spaces between each letter!

[terrytini]

57 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Well we've not been in relegation form this season, so the reaction would have probably been "no we're not".

But if we had been in relegation form, then the reception would have probably been "yes we are in relegation form but we probably won't get relegated because that's not how form works, but things definitely need to get better"

Again, I wonder what people read in this thread. Before the last few games this thread had been almost unanimously Bruce Out for weeks. Yet posters like you seem to be peddling this myth that you were getting mocked for wanting him out. It's really strange.

Posters like me ?

Or me ?

For one of life's true pedants it's a bit vague !

And guess what, I know you love telling people what this or that thread is about, but, we know !!! I KNOW it's been very Bruce out - I can read !!

I'm also  happy with the point I made about what might be said had somebody suggested relegation form.

Anc don't worry pleeeeasee - I don't feel in the least mocked 

[TRO]

3 hours ago, terrytini said:

I find a lot of what you post to be overly sanctimonious but never, ever say so.

Why not stick to making your own points rather than criticising mine ?

As far as I'm concerned that Post is actually very kind to Bruce AND suggests trying to look forward rather than back.

It DOES point out there is a massive rewrite of history going on in the views of some posters, which is my view. I don't see what's wrong with that.

I actually find it embarrassing how some folks are actually using this last minute ( he must've been very close to the sack) and - for all we know - temporary improvement as evidence he was the right guy all along. But I tend not to say so preferring instead to just voice MY view on him and leave others to theirs.

Ive attended over 40 games with Bruce in charge and come almost to the point of ceasing watching football. I didn't imagine those feelings.

Where I DO agree with you is that life is too short, if he has finally got it going then great.

We don't know that yet that he has but as I said in my Post I'm happy to see what happens.

Haha you just have.

Terry ,people who live in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones.

generally in arguments you get back what you give....you claim to support Bruce at times but, rarely have given him the benefit of the  doubt....and any credit appears begruding to me.

 Anyway, sick of the past must get back to my sanctimonious view of the future

Edited September 29, 2017 by TRO

[TRO]

3 hours ago, terrytini said:

Yes.

I wonder what reception you'd have got for saying we were in "relegation form" a few weeks ago ?

Ill hazard a guess " hysteria", " doom monger", " not enough games to form an opinion", " let's see where we are after 46 games" ?

There.....you have answered your own question.

"prepared" an all.

Edited September 29, 2017 by TRO