U.S. Politics

[Keyblade]

29 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

The comments after the tweet too. 

I thought the left were precious and couldn't take criticism 

It's some next level of possibly self-aware irony that the right are on. I'll never forget how they rabidly reacted to Colin Kaepernick's protest during the national anthem. These are same people who constantly moan about PC and free speech.

The double standards are astounding. You can't call them racist even when they say racist shit and vote for racists, because they'll feel 'disenfranchised' and vote for Trump...you have to think of their feelings. But if they offend another group of people, they have to suck it up and stop being so PC.

I can't even be mad at them. They've (probably thanks to the alt-right) completely and ingeniously rigged political discourse in their favour and it's won them the presidency, the house and the senate. Played the game to perfection.

[StefanAVFC]

9 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

I'll never forget how they rabidly reacted to Colin Kaepernick's protest during the national anthem. These are same people who constantly moan about PC and free speech.

The double standards are astounding. You can't call them racist even when they say racist shit and vote for racists, because they'll feel 'disenfranchised' and vote for Trump...you have to think of their feelings. But if they offend another group of people, they have to suck it up and stop being so PC.

 

It's why I don't buy this 'the left caused Trump nonsense'.

It's an excuse. Look at this story.

Mayor resigns over Michelle Obama 'ape in heels' post

Quote

Ms Whaling had responded to a Facebook post by Pamela Ramsey Taylor, a local resident who runs a non-profit group in Clay County, which referred to the first lady as an "ape".

"It will be refreshing to have a classy, beautiful, dignified first lady in the White House. I'm tired of seeing a Ape in heels," Ms Taylor wrote.

Ms Whaling responded with "just made my day Pam".

Not being a bigot has nothing to do with Political Correctness.

Edited November 17, 2016 by StefanAVFC

[Keyblade]

8 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

It's why I don't buy this 'the left caused Trump nonsense'.

It's an excuse. Look at this story.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-37997700

Not being a bigot has nothing to do with Political Correctness.

Yep, I've seen that. It's crazy. I knew the average person would be emboldened to say and do racist shit by Trump's win, but I didn't think actual elected officials would be too and so soon. Politically correctness is just a term to silence criticism of bigotry, which in another grand irony is the same thing that people who hate PC accuse of people who call them racist . The projection is off the charts. It's not being politically correct to not be racist, it's just common ***** decency.

Also lol @ Melania Trump being a dignified and classy lady. I can't believe somebody would say that with a straight face. One of the most blatantly racist things I've seen, they're not even slick with it anymore  . The damn mayor! On Facebook!

Edited November 17, 2016 by Keyblade

[TheStagMan]

On 11/15/2016 at 16:28, StefanAVFC said:

Well, no. Going back you think Farron slimy little toad, yet Farage isn't for doing exactly the same thing. Then you said this:

Yet you're doing exactly the same thing. But towards Farron. really not sure how it isn't the same thing. That's a cheap cop out to be quite honest. 52-48 Leave - Farron: "We want another ref." TOAD. 52:48 Remain - Farage - "want want another ref." NOT THE SAME.

Wow. Cop out.

Ergo, hypocrite.

Maybe not at the left, but you're having quite the pop at Seat for his opinions here. 

The difference between being put on the spot on a question of what *might* happen versus actively campaigning on the basis of wanting to ignore the result.

Anyway - Whatever. You have your opinion, I have mine. You think I'm a hypocrite, that's your choice. Really doesn't bother me. Based on your posts, your view is only to be expected and I'm done with you..

Wasn't having a pop at Seat - was asking him to explain his opinion - I'm not going to comment further on the results of that.

[TheStagMan]

On 11/15/2016 at 18:39, Seat68 said:

Agreed  i spoke about Farage and ukip whereas he or indeed she definitely had a pop at me. 

That said I am fairly thick skinned.

You made your views abundantly clear. As for having a pop at you, I wasn't, I was asking you to explain your views. You did, and they were pretty disgraceful. 

 

[Keyblade]

Yikes.

[Davkaus]

2 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

Yikes.

 

You know, when someone posted on here this morning about "what use would a database of all Muslims be", my mind immediately jumped to the japanese internments, but I knew the kind of reaction it'd get.

I'm glad Trump's supporters have made the comparison for me. 

[TheStagMan]

As a person, i think Trump is not the right person to be president. I think his judgement is questionable and I think he has a number of views that need to be consigned to the history books. 

Specifically (and in no particular order):

1. Views on Climate Change

2. Views on women as playthings. However I do think that a lot more has been made of the locker room talk than should have been when that is weighed up against the number of women in senior positions in his companies, and the parity of salaries paid to them (although no doubt you will say that they are there as eye candy and decoration)

- Note: a number of people on here have said many many things about women that could be onsidered as just as bad.

3. Attitude towards education

4. Attitude towards healthcare

5. Stupid comments about building a wall. However wanting to control immigration and deport illegal immigrants is an acceptable policy in my opinion

6. Comments about Muslims

What I am not going to do is join in the bile and hatred that is being poured against him. The abject refusal to accept him as president of another country (who's population have elected him according to their laws) is just stupid. Like it or loath it, we need to work with him and his administration for the good of the UK and the wider world. When he starts to look like he will be doing some of the outrageous things he has said (like muslim registries) - rather than just the Media saying he will, then I will start to get worried/upset/angry about it.

What I have been trying to say is that the establishment, and the public, rather than bleat and rage about his election need to understand the reasons why people voted for him and work to address them, rather than dismiss them and call them rasicst, bigots and mysoginists. All that will do is further the divide. I'm sure that some of the people who voted for him are probably racist, but 50% (approx) of the voting public sure as hell aren't. 

 

[Keyblade]

Just now, Davkaus said:

 

You know, when someone posted on here this morning about "what use would a database of all Muslims be", my mind immediately jumped to the japanese internments, but I knew the kind of reaction it'd get.

I'm glad Trump's supporters have made the comparison for me. 

That was the first thing that came to mind when Trump first brought it up. People were brushing off the concerns as overreaction, and now they're actually citing it as a precedent. Good grief.

[Davkaus]

Locker room talk? He was bragging about being able to get away with sexually assaulting women because he's famous. **** off is it "locker room talk".

Edited November 17, 2016 by Davkaus

[StefanAVFC]

I'll try one last time.

1 hour ago, TheStagMan said:

1. Views on Climate Change - 

2. Views on women as playthings. However I do think that a lot more has been made of the locker room talk than should have been when that is weighed up against the number of women in senior positions in his companies, and the parity of salaries paid to them (although no doubt you will say that they are there as eye condy and decoration) - Just so wrong it's unreal. No justification.

- Note: a number of people on here have said many many things about women that could be onsidered as just as bad. - Totally kills the debate. Deflection at its finest.

3. Attitude towards education

4. Attitude towards healthcare

5. Stupid comments about building a wall. However wanting to control immigration and deport illegal immigrants is an acceptable policy in my opinion - The second part of your statement has nothing to do with your first.

6. Comments about Muslims - 'Comments about Muslims' hugely undersells what hateful bile he has stirred up.

We're obviously miles apart. For example, to you, his views on women are overstated because he hired women to high level positions. I'm sorry but that's complete bollocks. He bragged about using his status to sexually assault women. That isn't 'locker room talk'. It's again another example of people with 'old-fashioned views' upset at not being able to do what they used to do, because of 'political correctness'.

Also, you didn't mention what was probably his most deplorable act.

THAT was disgraceful. Not a strongly worded post on a Villa forum.

[TheStagMan]

5 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

Locker room talk? He was bragging about being able to get away with sexually assaulting women because he's famous. **** off is it "locker room talk".

*sigh* Get off your high horse - I used the phrase as that is how the episode has been described in the media. Perhaps I should have put it in quotes.

[StefanAVFC]

You're the one justifying it because he hired women into high profile positions.

[Keyblade]

5 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

*sigh* Get off your high horse - I used the phrase as that is how the episode has been described in the media. Perhaps I should have put it in quotes.

Not really the media to be fair, it's only used by those who try to defend what he said (such as himself, during the debates). So it's understandable why somebody would think you were trying to excuse it.

[TheStagMan]

1 hour ago, StefanAVFC said:

 

Didn't label all Trump's views as a disgrace. Specifically focused on his views on various demographics. 

I had written out my response to your justification of his views multiple times. I'll try one last time.

We're obviously miles apart. For example, to you, his views on women are overstated because he hired women to high level positions. I'm sorry but that's complete bollocks.

Also, you didn't mention what was probably his most deplorable act.

THAT was disgraceful. Not a strongly worded post on a Villa forum.

WTF are you on about????? Most of that you are AGREEING with me!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Right - how simple can I make this for you. 

2. He has made comments, in private, to someone he was obviously trying to impress, over 10 years ago that were deplorable (but no worse than most blokes say to each other) and this has - rightly been publicised. But, those attacking him conveniently don't balance this against the way he actually acts towards the women who work for him.

FOR CLARITY - This does not mean that I think grabbing women by the p***y is acceptable. Is that clear enough for you??????

5. The comments about the wall were in relation to stopping illegal immigration. How on earth are the two not related?

6. I have criticised the comments he made about muslims. Not sure what else you want??? 

As for the picture, I am not sure what that was about - I have not seen it, nor the context, so am not in a position to comment on it. But you have said it was deplorable so it must be. Booo Donald!

 

 

 

 

[TheStagMan]

5 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

Not really the media to be fair, it's only used by those who try to defend what he said (such as himself, during the debates). So it's understandable why somebody would think you were trying to excuse it.

I wasn't. I was actually criticising it. 

[Keyblade]

56 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

As for the picture, I am not sure what that was about - I have not seen it, nor the context, so am not in a position to comment on it. But you have said it was deplorable so it must be. Booo Donald!

 

[StefanAVFC]

9 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

Right - how simple can I make this for you. 

2. He has made comments, in private, to someone he was obviously trying to impress, over 10 years ago that were deplorable (but no worse than most blokes say to each other) and this has - rightly been publicised. But, those attacking him conveniently don't balance this against the way he actually acts towards the women who work for him. 

 

BECAUSE IT DOESN'T BALANCE OUT. NOT IN THE SLIGHTEST. How can you possibly think him hiring women balances out his consistently vile comments!? Extreme example, but when you have a news story about a murderer. Do they mention all the charity work he did? All the nice things he did? No, because his vile act outweighs it. Before you inevitably call it a bad example or pick me up saying I called Trump a murderer, it's an extreme example.

Simple, Trump's acts and words towards/about women are not even remotely balanced by his actions in hiring women. It's not even close. Your justifcation also included ' a number of people on here have said many many things about women that could be considered as just as bad.' and 'no worse than what blokes say to one another'.

Come on 

9 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

5. The comments about the wall were in relation to stopping illegal immigration. How on earth are the two not related?

It's a total false equivalence. 'His comments about a wall are stupid, but he wants control of immigrants which is cool'

9 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

6. I have criticised the comments he made about muslims. Not sure what else you want??? 

Have you? Must have missed that. Must have been lost in all of the justification for his other vile comments.

9 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

As for the picture, I am not sure what that was about - I have not seen it, nor the context, so am not in a position to comment on it. But you have said it was deplorable so it must be. Booo Donald!

Absolutely pathetic. You've taken on this massively defensive stance. Nobody has said everything Trump has ever said is bad. You, and you alone, have started that and taken on this 'everyone is out to get me' attitude. You labelled other poster's views as disgraceful. No one else did that to you. Drop the moral indignation because it totally kills any debate. For your information, it was his public and shameful mocking of a disabled reporter. Not even mentioned in your list when it was probably the most shameless thing he did.

Edited November 17, 2016 by StefanAVFC

[Brumerican]

If that wall does ever get built , I hope Mexico covers the south facing side with solar panels. 

That'll learn em . 

[Brumerican]

How is it going down in the Carolinas Dom ?