Bolitics The New Condem Government

[drat01]

Clegg is awful at PMQ. Being totally ripped apart and trying his hardest to give support for Tory led views. He really has totally sold out what was the LibDem party.

[TrentVilla]

Must be hard when you have no real conviction in the words your using or the policies you are defending. Oh well his bed, he will have to lie in it.

His performance in the live TV debates was good but then neither Brown or Cameron could really afford to risk really attacking him so he got a bit of an easy ride, he isn't going to get that the next couple of years.

[LJRM050389]

Don't think Straw caem across well either to be fair, but I think the point he was trying to get across about the Sheff Steal is one worth further investigation

[drat01]

Don't think Straw caem across well either to be fair, but I think the point he was trying to get across about the Sheff Steal is one worth further investigation

HallamFM are reporting today that Forgemasters are cutting back because of the promised funds being cancelled

[drat01]

Oh dear - its really starting to fall apart now. We have Cameron / Hague and a few others giving out totally mixed messages on Afghanistan - so much so members of the Tory party are questioning it and so are the Army.

Then we have Cameron's deputy Clegg making a total and utter balls up of PMQ and the Gvmt having to make a statement that he was not representing them in his views on Iraq.

Total and utter shambles

[Richard]

An ever so slight exaggeration of a situation I would say, I wonder why I mean its not as if you have demonstrated anti Conservative leanings in the past is it so your stance must be true

[TrentVilla]

Total shambles? No probably not that bad but certainly disjointed and not making themselves look very good at the moment.

[brommy]

Then we have Cameron's deputy Clegg making a total and utter balls up of PMQ and the Gvmt having to make a statement that he was not representing them in his views on Iraq.

I thought Clegg was in the government? Now I am confused! :?

[drat01]

Mixed messages re Afghanistan questioned by Tory and Army

Clegg screws up PMQ's and Gvmt deny he was representing them

add to that

watchdog to investigate possible wrong doings by Cameron friend and Tory MP Goldsmith during Election

Confusion over Graduate Tax that was proposed by Cable an now rejected by the Tory part of teh Gvmt

Its not one of the better days but becoming the norm

EDIT: I think the Standard sums it up excellently link

Worst day yet for coalition?

In PR terms*, probably.

Cam and Clegg always warned there would be "bumps in the road" for the new politics, but it's worth recapping on today's wee string of triumphs:

* Clegg hardens up Afghan pull-out, to say: "Let me be absolutely clear that we will see our troops withdrawn from Afghanistan from a combat role by 2015." Military sources say it's a mistake to be so categoric.

* Clegg says that the Iraq war was "illegal". Senior Tories disagree, No. 10 says DPM was speaking in a personal capacity.

* No. 10 says we'll have to wait for Chilcot to hear a verdict on the legality of the war. Er, but as any student of Chilcot will tell you (and I am one, for my sins), the inquiry has specifically said it will not provide such a 'Yes/No' verdict.

* Cameron decides to help out in the gaffe-stakes by declaring: "We were the junior partner in 1940 when we were fighting the Nazis." Churchill spins in grave.

* Michael Howard attacks Ken Clarke's "foolish" claims that prison numbers are less important to crime levels than economic booms

* Tories brief that Cable's graduate tax is not going to happen in the way he thinks

* Lansley U-turn on death tax upsets backbench Tories

There's a long way to go and Labour would do best not to think this all means the Government is falling apart at the seams.

Yet it's not been the coalition's finest hour (sorry, Winston, couldn't resist). Or 24 hours.

*FOOTNOTE: Under Blair, Alastair Campbell used to take the mickey out of the number of stories that began "In Blair's worst week yet..."

Still, just imagine how things would play if a new Lib-Lab Government was making the above blunders. In particular, imagine the outcry if G Brown had got the Blitz wrong.

Unlike Brown, however, this fledgling coalition may still get the benefit of the doubt.

UPDATE: The Iraq Inquiry has just confirmed their report would not include a final judgment on whether or not the 2003 invasion was legal.

A spokesman said: "The inquiry is charged with finding all relevant facts and identifying lessons to be learned from the military action in Iraq. This includes matters relating to international law.

"The inquiry will address the process by which legal advice was sought and provided and will consider the international law arguments and the way they were presented.

"The invitation to international lawyers to comment on the legal issues arising from the grounds on which the British Government relied for the legal basis for military action will assist us in that task. But the inquiry is not a court of law, and no-one is on trial."

Good job those summer hols are coming eh?

[TrentVilla]

Then we have Cameron's deputy Clegg making a total and utter balls up of PMQ and the Gvmt having to make a statement that he was not representing them in his views on Iraq.

I thought Clegg was in the government? Now I am confused! :?

That obviously depends what he says.

[Richard]

Then we have Cameron's deputy Clegg making a total and utter balls up of PMQ and the Gvmt having to make a statement that he was not representing them in his views on Iraq.

I thought Clegg was in the government? Now I am confused! :?

That obviously depends what he says.

I thought people wanted a degree of independance and people in government not just towing a central line, now I'm confused.

[TrentVilla]

Then we have Cameron's deputy Clegg making a total and utter balls up of PMQ and the Gvmt having to make a statement that he was not representing them in his views on Iraq.

I thought Clegg was in the government? Now I am confused! :?

That obviously depends what he says.

I thought people wanted a degree of independance and people in government not just towing a central line, now I'm confused.

What a very political response.

Who are 'these people' who you refer to who have said that is what they want. Was it Cameron's 40 year old black mate who came to this country and joined the navy at the age of 10?

That answer sounds like it came straight from Cameron.

[avfc89]

Then we have Cameron's deputy Clegg making a total and utter balls up of PMQ and the Gvmt having to make a statement that he was not representing them in his views on Iraq.

I thought Clegg was in the government? Now I am confused! :?

That obviously depends what he says.

I thought people wanted a degree of independance and people in government not just towing a central line, now I'm confused.

What independence? He's taking joint action with the Tories on the major issues, he certainly isn't standing by his pre-election talk and standing up for his own constituents in Sheffield.

[TrentVilla]

What independence? He's taking joint action with the Tories on the major issues, he certainly isn't standing by his pre-election talk and standing up for his own constituents in Sheffield.

From what I can tell he isn't standing up for any of his pre-election 'beliefs' yet when he gets something wrong and goes off message suddenly he isn't representing the government he is expressing his personal opinion because its what the 'people' want.

Laughable.

[Richard]

Well sorry to disappoint but I am not David Cameron.Sorry if the answer offended you Trent but I have seen loads of times on here people (of all political hues so this is not just a Conservative defence even though it is obviously posted in reference to the current government) being criticised for just maintaining a party line , adhering to the whip. In addition looking forward to the Lib dems being more independent in this coaltion. In fact criticising the Lib Dems for sticking to Tory line too much.

Now when it appears they speak with an independent voice that is criticised too. Strange that

[TrentVilla]

Offended me? Are you kidding it doesn't offend me Richard it makes me laugh to be honest.

Where was his personal expression of opinion when the government put up VAT despite his pre election position????? Didn't happen did it.

So when he **** up don't try and tell me he has suddenly found his voice and is expressing personal opinion it won't wash.

[Richard]

What independence? He's taking joint action with the Tories on the major issues, he certainly isn't standing by his pre-election talk and standing up for his own constituents in Sheffield.

From what I can tell he isn't standing up for any of his pre-election 'beliefs' yet when he gets something wrong and goes off message suddenly he isn't representing the government he is expressing his personal opinion because its what the 'people' want.

Laughable.

Thanks.

Sorry again Trent but I have expressed my opinion on this it is not a government line that Clegg is being independent, that is it is not one I have seen. So your Laughable must refer to my post.

Thanks again

[Richard]

Evening Standard ? Sorry now I am confused is that part of the Tory media now or not?

[Richard]

Offended me? Are you kidding it doesn't offend me Richard it makes me laugh to be honest.

Where was his personal expression of opinion when the government put up VAT despite his pre election position????? Didn't happen did it.

So when he **** up don't try and tell me he has suddenly found his voice and is expressing personal opinion it won't wash.

and I didn't expect it too, with you and didn't make the post to try and change someone's political allegiance (which to be far seems to be the aim for some on here) I am of the opinion that once someone has such a strong political line then you cannot change that, it is pointlessto try.

I was merely responding to the criticism in this thread that Clegg is supposed to be a part of government. Yes that is right but does that mean that everyone in government should think the same way ? That is not something many on this site have argued for, in fact quite the opposite.

[TrentVilla]

What independence? He's taking joint action with the Tories on the major issues, he certainly isn't standing by his pre-election talk and standing up for his own constituents in Sheffield.

From what I can tell he isn't standing up for any of his pre-election 'beliefs' yet when he gets something wrong and goes off message suddenly he isn't representing the government he is expressing his personal opinion because its what the 'people' want.

Laughable.

Thanks.

Sorry again Trent but I have expressed my opinion on this it is not a government line that Clegg is being independent, that is it is not one I have seen. So your Laughable must refer to my post.

Thanks again

I think you need to read my post again. I didn't post laughable in response to anything you said, laughable was a reference to the performance of Clegg and his pals today its been pretty poor.