Bolitics The New Condem Government

[drat01]

So doing a bit of reading today it looks as though the Tory members already looking past Cameron as leader - have they given up the next election already ?

[peterms]

It seems no coincidence that the Royal family, while maintaining a Green public image, always have the need to go shoot something, as a demonstration of their royal status, in a watered down symbolic act of their divine-right.

 

The fact that even the latest generation still feel the need to do it, seems to indicate that it is some kind of ancient rite, to do with Kingliness.

In which spirit, perhaps we should revive other aspects of old rites to do with kings.

 

...In this sacred grove there grew a certain tree round which at any time

of the day, and probably far into the night, a grim figure might be seen to prowl. In his hand he carried a drawn

sword, and he kept peering warily about him as if at every instant he expected to be set upon by an enemy.

He was a priest and a murderer; and the man for whom he looked was sooner or later to murder him and hold

the priesthood in his stead. Such was the rule of the sanctuary. A candidate for the priesthood could only

succeed to office by slaying the priest, and having slain him, he retained office till he was himself slain by a

stronger or a craftier.

The post which he held by this precarious tenure carried with it the title of king; but surely no crowned

head ever lay uneasier, or was visited by more evil dreams, than his. For year in, year out, in summer and

winter, in fair weather and in foul, he had to keep his lonely watch, and whenever he snatched a troubled

slumber it was at the peril of his life...

[chrisp65]

Anything that pisses off the elite, who benefit so bloody much from the state as things stand, is a worthy cause in my book.

 

a little agitation keeps things from just being accepted as normal

[villaajax]

From the Sunday Times

 

 David Cameron has started a search for MPs who will help him reintroduce fox-hunting “by the back door”.

 

He and the environment secretary, Owen Paterson, want to use a parliamentary device known as a statutory instrument to amend the Hunting Act, and have provisionally booked parliamentary time on March 26 to debate the idea. They are now canvassing support among MPs of all parties.

 

The aim would be to lift the ban on hunting with any more than two dogs in England and Wales, which means using packs of up to 40 hounds would again become legal, although dogs would still not be allowed to kill foxes — death would have to be through shooting.

 

They have their priorities haven't they? When thousands were without power over Christmas thanks to the storm, the Tories were all meeting up for the Boxing Day hunt.

 

Including none other than Energy Minister Greg Barker.

 

[drat01]

There is no general public desire for the re-introduction of Fox Hunting (which is IMO a quite barbaric activity anyway), and the fact that the Tory party are making this a "flagship" activity at the moment shows a complete and utter lack of understanding of the majority of the public. Just because a few of the core votes for them, i.e. the "country set" still cling on to this as some sort of "sport" shows that they do not act for the majority rather they act for a key few supporters.

 

It's the same in their general policy making, we see it with some of the biggest donors to the party being rewarded with contract for health care, which is just an erosion of the NHS and a move to a private health care, a long term Tory aim.

 

No wonder Gove, Boris and Gideon are showing they want to be the next leader because Cameron is now clearly a liability. Never mind he can spend his retirement visiting his cums Coulson and Brooks in jail

[thetrees]

There is no general public desire for the re-introduction of Fox Hunting (which is IMO a quite barbaric activity anyway), and the fact that the Tory party are making this a "flagship" activity at the moment shows a complete and utter lack of understanding of the majority of the public. Just because a few of the core votes for them, i.e. the "country set" still cling on to this as some sort of "sport" shows that they do not act for the majority rather they act for a key few supporters.

It's the same in their general policy making, we see it with some of the biggest donors to the party being rewarded with contract for health care, which is just an erosion of the NHS and a move to a private health care, a long term Tory aim.

No wonder Gove, Boris and Gideon are showing they want to be the next leader because Cameron is now clearly a liability. Never mind he can spend his retirement visiting his cums Coulson and Brooks in jail

I am sorry guys but left thinkers jumping on this one is, quite frankly, laughable.

When Labour regained power after years away, their number one priority, above anything else that you would expect a normal government to prioritise, was to exact their class war "revenge" by banning fox hunting. For this they spent years and millions in the process.

Now, several years into a so-called Tory government, those with influence on such things are lobbying to bring it back, hardly surprising.

Whether fox hunting is banned or legalised, I don't care, as it has no bearing upon my life. There are certainly other injustices, some of which directly affect me, that this government could do with sorting out first.

But for left thinkers to use any debate about fox hunting as a stick to beat any government with reeks of hypocrisy.

Edited March 16, 2014 by thetrees

[drat01]

Sorry mate but with all respect that is complete and utter tosh

 

The reality is Fox Hunting is not a major political topic, the fact that the Tory party are now doing exactly what you accused the Labour party of doing previously shows a complete and utter hypocrisy. There is no desire, or need for its re-introduction so why are some of the core Tory supporters making it a big issue. Is it not more a case that they are trying to appease the few core voters in some rural areas (possibly avoiding de-selection etc). I would have a large wager that if a public vote was made on this then most would be happy for its continued banning

 

Fox Hunting is pretty much a privileged past time, despite what may Tory supporters would have you believe. If you want to partake in this most barbaric pastime (its not a sport despite what they may say) then you certainly need a large amount of financial collateral behind you. 

 

As said this is more evidence of a lot of the Tory party trying now to defend their own position because their leader is basically gone. Ashcroft tweeted again about the Labour lead in the opinion polls and whatever happens now in the future Cameron has failed to deliver on the many millions of (tax avoided) money he has put in to the party.

 

Edit: But I have no desire to argue with you young sir :-), so we will leave it with me being right and you being ......... :-))

Edited March 16, 2014 by drat01

[blandy]

I'm not sure hunting bans or un-bans are really a "class" thing entirely.

 

Firstly, obviously, there's the cruelty to animals side of things. Many, if not most of the folk against hunting with dogs are opposed to the notion of ripping apart wild animals. Why is it "OK" to do that to foxes. It's not OK to do it to Cats is it? I mean if a hord of hunters came down your street, hunting cats (or dogs) and then they were torn apart by hunting dogs, would that be acceptable?

 

Then there's the tradition argument. "we've been doing this in the country for hundereds of years, who are you city folk to tell us we can't?" - a sort of rural/urban polarisation of views. Obviously, tradition is not a justification in itself. Slavery was traditional. So was Bear baiting, denying women the vote and so on.

 

Then there's the finance and jobs part - people's livelihoods are involved, too.

 

There is some class aspect to it, as well, but there are Labour MPs in favour of hunting, and tories against it.

It seems odd that the majority of people are against it, the majority of MPs are against it, but now there's a tory plan to subvert the existing laws. Why? is it to do with trying to shore up, or win back voters who are lost to the tories - the sort who live in the country, are old style conservatives and don't much like shiny face and his chums, and who are quite likely to maybe vote for UKIP? I think it might be.

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

There are certainly other injustices, some of which directly affect me, that this government could do with sorting out first.

 

Right-wing thinking in a nutshell.

[Kingfisher]

The independent professional consensus is that fox hunting is inhumane and an ineffective population control method.

So that leaves tradition and jobs. Majority public will trumps tradition, especially in light of the above. Economically drag hunts can replace traditional hunting.

So where is the problem? I don't see where the problem is, unless you simply enjoy the kill.

[peterms]

...to exact their class war "revenge" by banning fox hunting...

Just on this point, banning foxhunting is a minor inconvenience.  If you think that's what revenge for the long years of class war would look like, retaliation for all the injustices, deprivation and sheer savagery of right-wing governments, think again.

[colhint]

If it's not a class thing, why isn't coarse fishing banned. You don't eat the fish you catch, You just put a hook in it's mouth, weigh it and then throw it back. It serves no purpose other than the catch or kill.

[villaajax]

If it's not a class thing, why isn't coarse fishing banned. You don't eat the fish you catch, You just put a hook in it's mouth, weigh it and then throw it back. It serves no purpose other than the catch or kill.

 

Write to your MP and hopefully they will put it forward in the form of a bill.

[colhint]

No I'm not bothered about either, I just can't see the difference in pain/death/ suffering between the two. Except that one is done by the rich and the other more commonly by the rest of us 

[villaajax]

I guess the difference is that you're not ripping the fish to bits before throwing it back into the water.

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

Fish don't have any feelings.

 

Anyway, we should ban a lot of things regarding our treatment of animals, but we won't because the public has no ... er... appetite to do so. Fox Hunting was an easy target. Yes, class had something to do with it (and what if it did?), but in the end the right decision was made.

[Xann]

I guess the difference is that you're not ripping the fish to bits before throwing it back into the water.

 

Fish have personalities too.

 

Thick ones get caught again and again, smart ones don't.

 

Though they usually get the chance to learn from their mistakes.

 

On the foxhunting thing. There seems to be more in urban areas.

 

Perhaps the countryfolk could swap their ponies for segways and their hounds for Staffies and patrol the streets of towns and cities on bin night?

 

Bloodlust sated, street not covered in fried chicken bones and nappies - Win Win.

[colhint]

I guess the difference is that you're not ripping the fish to bits before throwing it back into the water.

 

So you can torture it but not kill it then it'd be ok.  

[thetrees]

There are certainly other injustices, some of which directly affect me, that this government could do with sorting out first.

 

Right-wing thinking in a nutshell.

Hardly, but nice try.

The 'holier than thou' brigade has an addition!

[villaajax]

It was a nice try, in a Rugby sense because he has scored one there.

 

It is typical right wing thinking - "Oh no, that might affect me!" me, me me.