BleedClaretAndBlue Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 5 hours ago, alreadyexists said: Did he really say that!? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 36 minutes ago, nick76 said: Well there maybe one or two of those people but the overwhelming majority who had concerns like me don’t hate for hates sake. In fact I don’t hate, I just think he’s failing and should be relieved of his duties like almost everybody who has concerns about him. Speaking about haters in those that hate for the sake of hating in the context of the original context sounds like loads of fans which it isn’t. Fans overwhelmingly who think he should go because he’s failing not because the hate for hates sake. We all want Villa to be successful, Gerrard is taking us further away from that, that’s why he should go. There is no agenda aside from the agenda of Villa being successful. So you want Villa to win tomorrow regardless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 I'm waiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 Still waiting. It's not a trick question . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 5 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: So you want Villa to win tomorrow regardless? I have honestly gone back and forth on this. If I was guaranteed that Gerrard would be relieved of his duties if he lost then yes I’ve sometimes wavered that for the benefit of the club I love I would sacrifice one game to save a season and beyond. Given I don’t believe that the owners judge on a game by game basis but a longer period then No I don’t want us to lose. I’m of the belief at the moment that wanting the best for Villa is for us to move on from Gerrard. Keeping Gerrard on, or supporting he gets more time is supporting Gerrard more than the club, it’s damaging our progress. I don’t hate him, I just think he’s failing and won’t turn it around to a level that acceptable consistently. My head says the quicker he is gone the more chance we can move on, so one step backwards to take two forward. So given I have no assurances if he loses he will be gone then No I don’t want us to lose. My heart will always say I don’t want to lose as I never want us to lose, my head is a business man and sometimes you take a hit to move forward but that isn’t the offer on the table by the owners. So the answer to your question is Yes I want us to win both head and heart. As the games started it would always revert to wanting to win whatever thoughts I would have before the game anyway, it just does as a fan. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: Still waiting. It's not a trick question . Wow! Chill, I responded when I saw the question. Edited October 15, 2022 by nick76 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 6 minutes ago, nick76 said: I have honestly gone back and forth on this. If I was guaranteed that Gerrard would be relieved of his duties if he lost then yes I’ve sometimes wavered that for the benefit of the club I love I would sacrifice one game to save a season and beyond. Given I don’t believe that the owners judge on a game by game basis but a longer period then No I don’t want us to lose. I’m of the belief at the moment that wanting the best for Villa is for us to move on from Gerrard. Keeping Gerrard on, or supporting he gets more time is supporting Gerrard more than the club, it’s damaging our progress. I don’t hate him, I just think he’s failing and won’t turn it around to a level that acceptable consistently. My head says the quicker he is gone the more chance we can move on, so one step backwards to take two forward. So given I have no assurances if he loses he will be gone then No I don’t want us to lose. My heart will always say I don’t want to lose as I never want us to lose, my head is a business man and sometimes you take a hit to move forward but that isn’t the offer on the table by the owners. So the answer to your question is Yes I want us to win both head and heart. As the games started it would always revert to wanting to win whatever thoughts I would have before the game anyway, it just does as a fan. But you don't know what the future holds. There's been many managers who have turned things around when it was least expected. That's why I asked the question. You want Villa to be successful and we can only do that by winning games. My heart is Villa through and through, I always want us to win. As for the manager, what will be, will be. But it wouldn't surprise me in the least should he somehow turn things around. I'm not fully confident that he will, but he has my full support whilst he continues at the helm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 12 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: But you don't know what the future holds. There's been many managers who have turned things around when it was least expected. That's why I asked the question. You want Villa to be successful and we can only do that by winning games. My heart is Villa through and through, I always want us to win. As for the manager, what will be, will be. But it wouldn't surprise me in the least should he somehow turn things around. I'm not fully confident that he will, but he has my full support whilst he continues at the helm. I agree, I don’t know what the future holds but I haven’t seen anything from him to give me any confidence that he can turn it around. In fact the signs suggest he doesn’t have “it” from the significant amount of data from his tenure and looking at it from many angles and stats. We can’t keep waiting in the hope things turn around when it keeps being the same week in week out. The old adage of doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. 12 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: You want Villa to be successful and we can only do that by winning games. I agree but Gerrard has proved that he can’t consistently win games, so it’s time to give somebody else a go. I want to win many games, I don’t want to win tomorrow and then lose the next six games. I want to win long term so if Gerrard isn’t showing that long term he can improve his winning percentages which he isn’t then winning one game now isn’t going to convince me. I never really look game by game but over periods of games and so do I think Gerrard tenure isn’t looking good for a future of being successful. 12 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: My heart is Villa through and through, I always want us to win. My heart is Villa through and through for well over forty years and I want us to win and be successful. You asked a very specific question which I answered because I want Villa to be successful, not just one game but over a duration and your question could have a conflict of short term goal versus medium/long term goal. We can’t tell the future but if I asked you a question….extreme maybe but choose a) or b) Which would you choose…. a) a 5-0 loss tomorrow, Gerrard gets fired on the back of it but the future meant we ended up 7th in the league at the end of the season under a new manager? b) Gerrard stayed, we won tomorrow 2-0 but finished the season under him playing as we are now “pragmatically” and ended up 14th at the end of the season? I’d chose a) and yes a new manager could fail just as badly as Gerrard, just the point is that Gerrard is failing, so would you chose a) or b) in this situation? would you sacrifice the Chelsea result for the long term gain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 I would just chose Villa to win. The rest is hypothetical and will take care of itself. I've said it time and time again, it's the club I love, unconditionally, regardless of who the manager is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 (edited) 15 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: I would just chose Villa to win. The rest is hypothetical and will take care of itself. I've said it time and time again, it's the club I love, unconditionally, regardless of who the manager is. So you didn’t answer the question really. See, many of us believe that Gerrard should be gone for the long term benefit. It’s not being haters but looking for what’s best for the club. Yes it’s hypothetical but we can only judge him by the evidence of his tenure which is poor and he’s getting no better. If you honestly answered the question you rightly would choose what’s best for Villa which is a) in that scenario but you rightly say it’s hypothetical but most of us believe Gerrard leaving will likely mean we end up in a better place than keeping with Gerrard which is the point I’m making. You wouldn’t choose Villa to win and end up 14th would you! That’s not wanting the best for Villa. So you can see the conflict between short term and long term. So we all want to beat Chelsea in reality because we don’t have scenarios of what will happen, and we all want to be successful but many of us don’t believe that will happen under Gerrard. I love the club unconditionally, my family do, it’s who we are, it’s generational. Edited October 15, 2022 by nick76 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 2 minutes ago, nick76 said: So you didn’t answer the question really. See, many of us believe that Gerrard should be gone for the long term benefit. It’s not being haters but looking for what’s best for the club. Yes it’s hypothetical but we can only judge him by the evidence of his tenure which is poor and he’s getting no better. If you honestly answered the question you rightly would choose what’s best for Villa which is a) in that scenario but you rightly say it’s hypothetical but most of us believe Gerrard leaving will likely mean we end up in a better place than keeping with Gerrard which is the point I’m making. You wouldn’t choose Villa to win and end up 14th would you! That’s not wanting the best for Villa. So you can see the conflict between short term and long term. So we all want to beat Chelsea, and we all want to be successful but many of us don’t believe that will happen under Gerrard. I love the club unconditionally, my family do, it’s who we are, it’s generational. Don't tell me what I should choose. Like I said it's hypothetical, those choices are make believe. My point was, that all that matters "to me", is three points tomorrow. Like I said, what comes along the way is yet to be revealed. You want the manager gone, I would like to see him have some success as Villa manager. We will wait and see how that works out, but in the meantime, I'm all about us winning. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M_Afro Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 2-0 Villa. I think we will then beat Fulham too. I think the way both teams play will suit us. I am far from convinced by Gerrard but I think this week will be good to him. That will then buy him a bit more time. I still want him to turn things around because that is good for AVFC. UTV. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 3 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: Don't tell me what I should choose. Like I said it's hypothetical, those choices are make believe. It was to show you the point but you don’t want to engage on that so I will leave it. 4 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: My point was, that all that matters "to me", is three points tomorrow Fair enough, some like to look at the bigger picture as well as an individual game and some people don’t. I get that! 5 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: Like I said, what comes along the way is yet to be revealed. Plainly obvious but we need to make decisions on the information to hand otherwise like in life, sometimes letting this slide can leave you in a worse state. We need to make judgment as things go along based on the now and past….blindly hoping on the future based on fingers crossed rather that the history of evidence is not a solid way of doing things. 8 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: You want the manager gone, I would like to see him have some success as Villa manager. Yes I want him gone. I would’ve much preferred him to be a success but evidence to date suggests he won’t have success as a Villa manager and that’s all we can go on and not blind faith for the future. 10 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: We will wait and see how that works out, but in the meantime, I'm all about us winning. I agree because we have no influence on the owners hence why I said I want us to win against Chelsea tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 3 minutes ago, nick76 said: It was to show you the point but you don’t want to engage on that so I will leave it. Fair enough, some like to look at the bigger picture as well as an individual game and some people don’t. I get that! Plainly obvious but we need to make decisions on the information to hand otherwise like in life, sometimes letting this slide can leave you in a worse state. We need to make judgment as things go along based on the now and past….blindly hoping on the future based on fingers crossed rather that the history of evidence is not a solid way of doing things. Yes I want him gone. I would’ve much preferred him to be a success but evidence to date suggests he won’t have success as a Villa manager and that’s all we can go on and not blind faith for the future. I agree because we have no influence on the owners hence why I said I want us to win against Chelsea tomorrow. We'll both get off at this stop. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messi11 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 We all hoping for a 5-0 Chelsea win and Southampton to beat West Ham right? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 7 minutes ago, messi11 said: We all hoping for a 5-0 Chelsea win and Southampton to beat West Ham right? Depends on who you mean by "we". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messi11 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 1 minute ago, sheepyvillian said: Depends on who you mean by "we". Fans who are ready for a new manager to take helm Rather be Gerrardless going into the big 6 pointer games against Fulham and Brentford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 1 minute ago, messi11 said: Fans who are ready for a new manager to take helm Rather be Gerrardless going into the big 6 pointer games against Fulham and Brentford Bully for you. Nothing like undying loyalty. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomC Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 3 hours ago, messi11 said: Rather be Gerrardless going into the big 6 pointer games against Fulham and Brentford Maybe Fulham just had a good start and can still be dragged into a relegation battle, but Brentford has proven that they're a PL team. I don't see them getting dragged into it. That one isn't a six-pointer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedClaretAndBlue Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 5 hours ago, messi11 said: Fans who are ready for a new manager to take helm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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