B-dub Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 The WBC is really a contrived and pointless event, IMO, and a lame attempt to manufacture the kind of passion and interest that the World Cup does. Most hard-core baseball fans (in the US at least) could really care less about it and would rather their team's players focus on the real business of preparing for the season and not getting injured. International baseball is not and will never be a big deal, mainly because the game is not really played in very many countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-dub Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 And as for the whole baseball vs. cricket debate, I ... could really care less what the rest of the world thinks about baseball. I can totally understand why people from the UK and elsewhere find baseball boring; I would, too, if I hadn't grown up following it. And if I grew up in the UK, I'd prefer cricket over baseball. Simple as that. If it makes people from the UK feel better about themselves to think that cricketers are better athletes, more skilled, or "manlier", fine. I won't try to change their minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yakulto Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 The WBC is really a contrived and pointless event, IMO, and a lame attempt to manufacture the kind of passion and interest that the World Cup does. Most hard-core baseball fans (in the US at least) could really care less about it and would rather their team's players focus on the real business of preparing for the season and not getting injured. International baseball is not and will never be a big deal, mainly because the game is not really played in very many countries. I couldn't disagree more. While as you say, baseball is not played in many countries, neither is cricket and they have a world cup. It may not have a tradition of international play but there's no reason why it can't develop one. Plus look at the array of nationalities playing in the MLB and Japan these days. Sure, Europeans aren't really represented but it's a fairly wide selection. And it may or not be correct that US fans couldn't care less, but I can assure you that it is quite a big deal for some of the smaller nations. It's simply a good thing for the health of the sport globally. And while US fans may like to concentrate on the "real business" of the MLB season, until there is some kind of truly global "world series" between club teams, this is a chance for those lesser baseball nations to have a shot at the big boys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Most hard-core baseball fans (in the US at least) could really care less about it I'd make a wild stab in the dark and say it's because Americans don't like it when they aren't the best? Of the 5 major sports that really have an International game (football, baseball, basketball, hockey) the US are only the best in 1. I have alot of friends in the US who're very big on sports. All I ever hear about when we debate great sports teams are the US "Dream Teams" in basketball.. yet they never seem to mention the US national baseball, hockey or football teams, funny that. P.S. Just a pet hate, but why do Americans say COULD care less.. surely it's COULDN'T care less? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrogers Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Shouldn't it be Baseball v Rounders? Cricket is ace, Baseball isn't IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straggler Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Baseball is ace! It may have virtually no action given the length of the game, but the on occasion the breathless explosion of speed, skill, athletasism and no shortage of talent can be exhilerating. It is the tension that the slow speed of the game can build up that helps those short flashes of brilliance be all the more exciting. It is a triumph of mind, body and tactics to win a game of baseball especially in the latter stages of the world series where the difference between winning and loosing can be a matter of fractions and so much of the game is played in the head. Pitcher vs hitter is not just one man against the other, it is an entire training staff honing all their accumulated knowledge into one man, who has to assimilate everything they have learned, operate under the most terrific pressure and deliver with immense precision in a fraction of a second. The only things that sadden me about the game are the player strikes and the wide spread use of drugs. Seeing the achievments of truly great players in the past being surpassed by less than worthy players now thanks to artificial means just feels like cheating. At the heart of it though baseball is a great game. I am a Brit by the way and the first game of baseball I saw was the definition of tedium. Give the game a chance, learn a little of what makes a good player and why in a game of individual battles the best team is not always that with the best players and you may just get it. edited once for spelling (I am dyslexic, so excuse me for the ones I miss) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted March 6, 2009 VT Supporter Share Posted March 6, 2009 Most hard-core baseball fans (in the US at least) could really care less about it I'd make a wild stab in the dark and say it's because Americans don't like it when they aren't the best? Of the 5 major sports that really have an International game (football, baseball, basketball, hockey) the US are only the best in 1. I have alot of friends in the US who're very big on sports. All I ever hear about when we debate great sports teams are the US "Dream Teams" in basketball.. yet they never seem to mention the US national baseball, hockey or football teams, funny that. P.S. Just a pet hate, but why do Americans say COULD care less.. surely it's COULDN'T care less? It's probably more simply that the idea of team sport is something that really took root in the British/Irish psyche for whatever reason. American exceptionalism in this regard is probably more the function of earlier separation from the Empire. Baseball is derived from cricket (a look at the Massachusetts and New York codes for the game in the early 19th century makes this undeniable). Gridiron derives at least somewhat from the various football games (themselves derived from the football games that are the ancestors of association football and rugby) that were brought over to the American continent (and then while being formalized, liberally borrowed from rugby and football). Ice hockey's origins probably are something like a bunch of guys saying "let's try to play football on that frozen pond!"; basketball of course is another sport that's on the basic football template. The same is true in a number of other respects: rather than being the newer language, American English is actually the more conservative English. It's somewhat closer to English as spoken in the 18th century than modern English is. You could also make the same point in regards to political culture (part of the reason for the decline of Liberalism in the UK is that much of its base over the years ended up emigrating, especially to the USA). For the record, as near as I can tell, the USA is not #1 in any team sport (AFAIK, IFAF doesn't publish an international ranking)... we're #2 in basketball (to Argentina), either #2 or #3 in baseball (to Cuba and perhaps Japan), #6 in ice hockey, and down around #20 in both football and rugby union. The rugby ranking is surprising, until you consider how short the list of countries that play rugby to any decent standard is. In terms of global importance, I'd probably rank the team sports thusly Football Cricket/Basketball (close battle there... cricket runs up a huge score in South Asia, but basketball is second to football in most of the rest of Eurasia (China, Russia, mainland Europe)) Ice hockey Baseball/Rugby union everything else (gridiron, aussie rules, rugby league, field hockey, lacrosse,...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted March 6, 2009 VT Supporter Share Posted March 6, 2009 Korea dispose of Chinese Taipei (aka Taiwan) 9-0. Elimination game later tonight/today between China and Taiwan and tomorrow a winner's bracket showdown between Japan and Korea. Sunday sees the Mexico City pool start, featuring Mexico, Cuba, South Africa, and Australia. The Toronto pool with Canada, Italy, USA, and Venezuela starts tomorrow with Canada/USA, as does the San Juan pool with the Dominican Republic, the Dutch, Panama, and Puerto Rico. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Most hard-core baseball fans (in the US at least) could really care less about it I'd make a wild stab in the dark and say it's because Americans don't like it when they aren't the best? Of the 5 major sports that really have an International game (football, baseball, basketball, hockey) the US are only the best in 1. I have alot of friends in the US who're very big on sports. All I ever hear about when we debate great sports teams are the US "Dream Teams" in basketball.. yet they never seem to mention the US national baseball, hockey or football teams, funny that. P.S. Just a pet hate, but why do Americans say COULD care less.. surely it's COULDN'T care less? By saying we COULD care less, we are not putting a limit on the degree of our disinterest. :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yakulto Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Korea dispose of Chinese Taipei (aka Taiwan) 9-0. Elimination game later tonight/today between China and Taiwan and tomorrow a winner's bracket showdown between Japan and Korea. Off to Tokyo Dome in an hour or so to watch the elimination game, before the real ball starts - Japan vs Korea. Mouthwatering game. Though Korea always seems to have Japan's number I'm hoping Japan can pull it together. As an aside, official team Japan caps are selling for ￥10,000, that's over 70 quid! Plus an official Japan shirt will set you back a cool ￥28,000 - 200 pounds! And folks are buying them by the truckcload! I bought me a Venzuala cap as it's pretty much claret coloured with a "V" on it! "Only" set me back ￥3000, 20 quid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jondaken Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 FAT MEN SHOULD NOT PLAY SPORTS /THREAD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted March 7, 2009 VT Supporter Share Posted March 7, 2009 Korea dispose of Chinese Taipei (aka Taiwan) 9-0. Elimination game later tonight/today between China and Taiwan and tomorrow a winner's bracket showdown between Japan and Korea. Off to Tokyo Dome in an hour or so to watch the elimination game, before the real ball starts - Japan vs Korea. Mouthwatering game. Though Korea always seems to have Japan's number I'm hoping Japan can pull it together. As an aside, official team Japan caps are selling for ￥10,000, that's over 70 quid! Plus an official Japan shirt will set you back a cool ￥28,000 - 200 pounds! And folks are buying them by the truckcload! I bought me a Venzuala cap as it's pretty much claret coloured with a "V" on it! "Only" set me back ￥3000, 20 quid. It's more of a maroon, methinks Some shades of maroon can verge on claret (e.g. rich maroon which has has hue 333deg with 65% shade, while this site's claret is 354deg, 64%), but this one isn't that much... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Football Cricket/Basketball (close battle there... cricket runs up a huge score in South Asia, but basketball is second to football in most of the rest of Eurasia (China, Russia, mainland Europe)) Ice hockey Baseball/Rugby union everything else (gridiron, aussie rules, rugby league, field hockey, lacrosse,...) I'd probably agree with that, though I'd probably say basketball is ahead of cricket personally. Though that's probably my dislike for cricket showing through! By saying we COULD care less, we are not putting a limit on the degree of our disinterest. I'm positive you've just made that up, but fair enough anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-dub Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 I'd make a wild stab in the dark and say it's because Americans don't like it when they aren't the best? Of the 5 major sports that really have an International game (football, baseball, basketball, hockey) the US are only the best in 1. I have alot of friends in the US who're very big on sports. All I ever hear about when we debate great sports teams are the US "Dream Teams" in basketball.. yet they never seem to mention the US national baseball, hockey or football teams, funny that. P.S. Just a pet hate, but why do Americans say COULD care less.. surely it's COULDN'T care less? Prior to the first WBC a few years ago, I don't believe there was ever a US national baseball team consisting of professionals. (If I'm wrong on that I'm sure Levi will correct me ) Yes, it's been an Olympic sport, but any US baseball team sent to the Olympics consisted of college players and/or minor leaguers. (The same was true of basketball prior to 1992.) The point is that international team sports are just not as big a deal here. No kid playing baseball in the US grows up dreaming of playing for the USA and beating Panama in the WBC; nor do young basketball players really care that much about playing for the USA as opposed to the NBA. Comparing international baseball or basketball to international football, the World Cup, etc., is like comparing the Johnstone's Paint Trophy to the Champions League Final. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Fair enough, I just reckon it's a bit sad, that's all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted March 7, 2009 VT Supporter Share Posted March 7, 2009 Dave Roberts gets cut by the Giants. Would like to see him sign on with the Red Sox so he can retire as one. Thanks to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEvepm86rDM, he'll never have to buy a drink in New England (well, north or east of Hahtfuhd) again. It's the year before, but http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-24xjPSBjQ... I'm fairly sure I'm in one of the first few shots of that video; I vaguely remember jumping over the bonfire (and singing "if you think the Yankees suck, show your tits"... and I may have gotten my tackle out when the girls started chanting "If you love the Sox, show your cocks"... thankfully that didn't make the video). The guy who jumped off the dining hall (from about 20 feet onto concrete) messed up his legs pretty bad, IIRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted March 8, 2009 VT Supporter Share Posted March 8, 2009 Europe may have a very good showing... Netherlands shock the Dominican Republic Netherlands manager Rod Delmonico credited his whole team for the 3-2 upset it pulled against the Dominican Republic on Saturday in Game 1 of Pool D play in the World Baseball Classic. "I am really proud of my guys today," Delmonico said. "We were ready to play. We came and were aggressive offensively, and our pitching staff did a phenomenal job, especially out of the bullpen. We were aggressive in the zone." Netherlands starter Sidney Ponson was not spectacular, but he held the Dominicans down long enough for the Dutch. He scattered five hits and three walks over four-plus innings, yet he was responsible for only two earned runs. One of the runs came on a home run by Dominican third baseman Miguel Tejada in the fourth inning. The other was attributed to him after he left the game with Miguel Olivo on second base and Willy Taveras on first. Olivo scored on a sacrifice fly by Hanley Ramirez off reliever Alexander Smit, who faced only three batters. "It wasn't easy because those guys know me," said Ponson, who is looking for a Major League job. "I know them. It was a game of cat and mouse today. To tell you the truth, I got lucky today a couple of times, because I threw the ball down the middle and these guys got a couple of ground balls. There were some key double plays. I would rather be lucky than good sometimes. Today, I was lucky." One of those double plays occurred in the fifth inning, when Rob Cordemans came in to relieve Smit after Smit allowed a Robinson Cano single, a Ramirez sacrifice fly, and an intentional walk David Ortiz to put runners on first and second. Cordemans induced Tejada to hit into the double play with the help of spectacular defense from third baseman Yurendell de Caster, who scooped up a hard ground ball from Tejada's bat, pivoted off third base to force out the runner coming from second, and threw across the diamond to catch Tejada and complete the inning-ending double play. Cordemans walked a tight rope in his 2 2/3 innings of relief, but he never let the Netherlands' lead fall. He retired Tejada again in the seventh to end the inning with two men on base, when Tejada hit a fly ball to center after Ramirez hit a single to right and Ortiz walked. Cordemans credited the Dominicans' unfamiliarity with him and his fellow relievers for the Netherlands' bullpen's success. "It helped big time, because we have never really faced them," Cordemans said. "I have never faced them. I don't throw 90 mph, so I have got to put something else in there -- changeups." Leon Boyd, the man Delmonico entrusted to close the game, agreed with Cordemans. "I guess we gave them something that looked a little different," said the right-handed submariner. "This is the first time that I ever closed. I am normally a starter." Boyd closed the game against the top of the Dominican order. He walked the first batter, Taveras, but retired Cano with a grounder to second. Netherlands catcher Kenley Jansen caught Taveras trying to steal third base for the second out. Boyd then walked Ramirez, but struck out Jose Bautista, thereby sealing the victory for the Netherlands. "This feels good," said Delmonico. "It is a great moment for us, because it was able to be played on TV in the Netherlands and Curacao, and so a lot of people back home were able to watch the game." Delmonico announced that Florida Marlins prospect Rick VandenHurk would start the next game for the Netherlands. That game will take place on Monday, at 6:30 p.m. ET, and will pit the Dutch against the winner of the Saturday evening game between Panama and Puerto Rico. "We are just starting the tournament. Our goal now is to get to Miami. It has been," said Delmonico, referring to the site of the second round of the Classic. "So we have to focus on enjoying this now. Whoever wins after tonight, we have to focus on them tomorrow in practice and get ready for Monday." Venezuela just homered in the 5th inning to make it 1-0 over Italy. A good showing by Italy and the Netherlands will definitely increase the chances of a third bid being granted to Europe (which would give Great Britain a very good chance of qualifying). Venezuela follows up the homer with a double... the wheels could be falling off the Alfa (as they are wont to do, Brian... ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviramsey Posted March 8, 2009 VT Supporter Share Posted March 8, 2009 And Venezuela have loaded the bases with 1 out, after scoring another run. Lenny DiNardo was a bum when he played for the Sox, and he's not better when he's playing for one of his parent's country. 2 runs come in on a single, with Miguel Cabrera and Magglio Ordonez the next two batter... DiNardo's pitching line: 3 batters faced, 2 hits, and a walk (obviously in less than a third of an inning) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usvilla Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 big shock result for netherlands ! nice to see the favs beaten Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yakulto Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Korea dispose of Chinese Taipei (aka Taiwan) 9-0. Elimination game later tonight/today between China and Taiwan and tomorrow a winner's bracket showdown between Japan and Korea. Off to Tokyo Dome in an hour or so to watch the elimination game, before the real ball starts - Japan vs Korea. Mouthwatering game. Though Korea always seems to have Japan's number I'm hoping Japan can pull it together. As an aside, official team Japan caps are selling for ￥10,000, that's over 70 quid! Plus an official Japan shirt will set you back a cool ￥28,000 - 200 pounds! And folks are buying them by the truckcload! I bought me a Venzuala cap as it's pretty much claret coloured with a "V" on it! "Only" set me back ￥3000, 20 quid. It's more of a maroon, methinks Some shades of maroon can verge on claret (e.g. rich maroon which has has hue 333deg with 65% shade, while this site's claret is 354deg, 64%), but this one isn't that much... It's close enough for me!! The cap in person looks a lot less bright than that picture. Or maybe I just have dodgy eyes! Went to Tokyo Dome to witness Japan destroy Korea 14-2, with the game being called after 7 innings due to the mercy rule. Stunning result, and one of the best atmospheres I've ever witnessed at a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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