Why Paul Lambert should get the sack

[Morpheus]

Nice charts and all that but I go on what's in front of me on the football field. I've seen enough of this insipid shit from team lambert and I want them gone. He will take us down.

.......and bring in another manager, who will struggle with exactly the same problems, who will want to bring in his own players and 18 months down the line you will want him gone too.......and over and over

We don't necessarily need that major overhaul, just a manager who can extract the very best from a set of professional footballers, who has exceptional man management skills aswell as good coaches and is able to set teams up with a game plan , proper tactics and play players in their strongest position. I'd argue the very basics of a top flight manager. Of course lambert is totally unproven at this level and it certainly shows.

Thanks for narrowing it down, so....were looking for a proven top flight manager, with exceptional man-management skills who will be prepared to work with the current squad and budget and presumably someone who is willing to take the same risk with their career and reputation that Lambert has taken and in return we promise to be patient for 12 months........any thoughts on who that might be?

No, thought not

I note you keep asking this question of posters even though the owner of our club with all his contacts in football still can't get it right.

Maybe that's where you've got your graphs from?

Edited December 30, 2013 by Morpheus

[Morpheus]

I believe Lambert was right to freeze out the overpaid, underperformers (I also believe that this was part of the agreement with Lerner when he took the job)I believe that the £40m figure that is constantly trotted out is a red herring - in the same period we have lost players that cost double that to recruit

 

Just want to reply to the two points in bold as we've debated everything else.

 

I am also in no doubt that removing under-performing players on high wages was in the remit but any manager would want to do that anyway irrespective of the budget. Where we differ is that he did not have to use the guillotine on the first team in the way that he did. I have seen no quote or anything substantiated to suggest differently. What I have seen however is a quote from the chief executive stating that Lambert had a budget and it was up to him how he spent it. That's right he got rid of some and kept some - he discarded/did not renew Heskey, Holman, Collins, Cuellar, Makoun, Warnock and Hutton. He kept Given, Ireland, Dunne, Bent, Bannan, Zog, Gabby, Andi, Delph, Clark, Baker. He would have kept Petrov too if that had been an option which sadly it was not. Given, Ireland, Dunne, Bent and Bannan have since been discarded as they didn't perform and/or didn't have the right attitude and/or we already had a better option. There is not one player discarded (with the obvious exception of Petrov) who I wish was still here

 

Concerning your second point I think Risso has quoted stats showing an expenditure of 40m plus. Unsurprisingly you've misunderstood, again. We've paid out around £40m in fees whislt losing players that cost us around £80m in fees - a net outgoing of talent of £40m

Simple question even for you to understand.

How much has Lambert spent since he's been our manager?

 

I've made it a little larger in case you missed it

Since you've now confirmed the amount spent and you've previously stated that Lambert got rid of the players already at the club because they didn't impress which out of the 16 players that Lambert has signed do you think have improved our team?

Benteke and who else?

[Electric Avenue]

Nice charts and all that but I go on what's in front of me on the football field. I've seen enough of this insipid shit from team lambert and I want them gone. He will take us down.

 

.......and bring in another manager, who will struggle with exactly the same problems, who will want to bring in his own players and 18 months down the line you will want him gone too.......and over and over

We don't necessarily need that major overhaul, just a manager who can extract the very best from a set of professional footballers, who has exceptional man management skills aswell as good coaches and is able to set teams up with a game plan , proper tactics and play players in their strongest position. I'd argue the very basics of a top flight manager. Of course lambert is totally unproven at this level and it certainly shows.

 

Thanks for narrowing it down, so....were looking for a proven top flight manager, with exceptional man-management skills who will be prepared to work with the current squad and budget and presumably someone who is willing to take the same risk with their career and reputation that Lambert has taken and in return we promise to be patient for 12 months........any thoughts on who that might be?

 

No, thought not

Plenty, but we'll kick off with Steve Bruce.

If we are appointing managers on a budget , this guy fits the bill and has always done well with limited funds whist playing decentish football with a mix of experience and raw talent.

[Morpheus]

Lambert's the man for the job.

Based on what?

[HeyAnty]

Nice charts and all that but I go on what's in front of me on the football field. I've seen enough of this insipid shit from team lambert and I want them gone. He will take us down.

.......and bring in another manager, who will struggle with exactly the same problems, who will want to bring in his own players and 18 months down the line you will want him gone too.......and over and over

We don't necessarily need that major overhaul, just a manager who can extract the very best from a set of professional footballers, who has exceptional man management skills aswell as good coaches and is able to set teams up with a game plan , proper tactics and play players in their strongest position. I'd argue the very basics of a top flight manager. Of course lambert is totally unproven at this level and it certainly shows.

Thanks for narrowing it down, so....were looking for a proven top flight manager, with exceptional man-management skills who will be prepared to work with the current squad and budget and presumably someone who is willing to take the same risk with their career and reputation that Lambert has taken and in return we promise to be patient for 12 months........any thoughts on who that might be?

No, thought not

Plenty, but we'll kick off with Steve Bruce.

If we are appointing managers on a budget , this guy fits the bill and has always done well with limited funds whist playing decentish football with a mix of experience and raw talent.

Steve Bruce, u serious?

[dont_do_it_doug.]

His opinion I assume.

Round and round we go...

(Was to Morpheus)

Edited December 31, 2013 by dont_do_it_doug.

[VillanousOne]

although welcome it does seem strange that only now Lambert is recognising the need for experienced players and acknowledging how bad our football is.

 

lets see where this epiphany takes him/us.........

[villan_007]

Just a better manager with a system, and a knowledge of how to get the best out of players.

 

 Lets take Barry Bannan, looked distinctly average at VP, goes to Palace, struggles under Golom, Pulis comes in, a long ball manager, and plays Bannan in a free role, and he looks a much better player for it.PL has come in, and most players have not stepped up from last season.Not one player is playing better than towards the end of last season.Why is that?

Lambert rated bannan, however he can't be trusted to not have a drink.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

although welcome it does seem strange that only now Lambert is recognising the need for experienced players and acknowledging how bad our football is.

lets see where this epiphany takes him/us.........

He's not blind though eh. He knows this is tripe and likely has done for quite some time.

Depending on what you believe the plan was always to add a little more experience as time goes on. I'm not sure if that's the case myself, because I was more than happy to keep bringing in the same kinds of players during the summer, it seemed to be working. Most of us were.

Either way if he/they have learned and are malleable enough to change it up a little then credit where it's due no?

Edited December 31, 2013 by dont_do_it_doug.

[VillaCas]

I believe Lambert was right to freeze out the overpaid, underperformers (I also believe that this was part of the agreement with Lerner when he took the job)I believe that the £40m figure that is constantly trotted out is a red herring - in the same period we have lost players that cost double that to recruit

 

Just want to reply to the two points in bold as we've debated everything else.

 

I am also in no doubt that removing under-performing players on high wages was in the remit but any manager would want to do that anyway irrespective of the budget. Where we differ is that he did not have to use the guillotine on the first team in the way that he did. I have seen no quote or anything substantiated to suggest differently. What I have seen however is a quote from the chief executive stating that Lambert had a budget and it was up to him how he spent it. That's right he got rid of some and kept some - he discarded/did not renew Heskey, Holman, Collins, Cuellar, Makoun, Warnock and Hutton. He kept Given, Ireland, Dunne, Bent, Bannan, Zog, Gabby, Andi, Delph, Clark, Baker. He would have kept Petrov too if that had been an option which sadly it was not. Given, Ireland, Dunne, Bent and Bannan have since been discarded as they didn't perform and/or didn't have the right attitude and/or we already had a better option. There is not one player discarded (with the obvious exception of Petrov) who I wish was still here

 

Concerning your second point I think Risso has quoted stats showing an expenditure of 40m plus. Unsurprisingly you've misunderstood, again. We've paid out around £40m in fees whislt losing players that cost us around £80m in fees - a net outgoing of talent of £40m

Simple question even for you to understand.

How much has Lambert spent since he's been our manager?

 

I've made it a little larger in case you missed it

Since you've now confirmed the amount spent and you've previously stated that Lambert got rid of the players already at the club because they didn't impress which out of the 16 players that Lambert has signed do you think have improved our team?

Benteke and who else?

Even though they collectively cost and earn a fraction of McLs team they delivered more points and a better finish......weird huh!

[VillaCas]

Nice charts and all that but I go on what's in front of me on the football field. I've seen enough of this insipid shit from team lambert and I want them gone. He will take us down.

 

.......and bring in another manager, who will struggle with exactly the same problems, who will want to bring in his own players and 18 months down the line you will want him gone too.......and over and over

We don't necessarily need that major overhaul, just a manager who can extract the very best from a set of professional footballers, who has exceptional man management skills aswell as good coaches and is able to set teams up with a game plan , proper tactics and play players in their strongest position. I'd argue the very basics of a top flight manager. Of course lambert is totally unproven at this level and it certainly shows.

 

Thanks for narrowing it down, so....were looking for a proven top flight manager, with exceptional man-management skills who will be prepared to work with the current squad and budget and presumably someone who is willing to take the same risk with their career and reputation that Lambert has taken and in return we promise to be patient for 12 months........any thoughts on who that might be?

 

No, thought not

Plenty, but we'll kick off with Steve Bruce.

If we are appointing managers on a budget , this guy fits the bill and has always done well with limited funds whist playing decentish football with a mix of experience and raw talent.

Steve Bruce? Let's gloss over the fact that he already failed at Wigan and Sunderland so hardly fits your criteria of proven top flight manager, he wouldn't quit Hull for Villa ( which says a lot about the job ) and fans would give him about three games to prove himself.

If Steve Bruce is your best choice to start off with, don't worry about coming up with any more names

[AstonMartin82]

This thread gets funnier by the day!!!

 

I hope no one on here wins the Euro Millions and buys Aston Villa otherwise we would be PROPER ****!!!

[drat01]

This thread gets funnier by the day!!!

 

I hope no one on here wins the Euro Millions and buys Aston Villa otherwise we would be PROPER ****!!!

Out of interest was that meant as some sort of insult? Was that actually contributing to what in general remains a fairly civilised conversation? or was it just a post to cause a problem?

 

Maybe post a reply to what people have said?

[Electric Avenue]

Steve Bruce did not fail at Wigan he had them and small Heath finishing top half of the PL. He's not my best choice as you alluded to anyway, just saying he's a higher calibre manager than Lambert.

[Morpheus]

I believe Lambert was right to freeze out the overpaid, underperformers (I also believe that this was part of the agreement with Lerner when he took the job)I believe that the £40m figure that is constantly trotted out is a red herring - in the same period we have lost players that cost double that to recruit

 

Just want to reply to the two points in bold as we've debated everything else.

 

I am also in no doubt that removing under-performing players on high wages was in the remit but any manager would want to do that anyway irrespective of the budget. Where we differ is that he did not have to use the guillotine on the first team in the way that he did. I have seen no quote or anything substantiated to suggest differently. What I have seen however is a quote from the chief executive stating that Lambert had a budget and it was up to him how he spent it. That's right he got rid of some and kept some - he discarded/did not renew Heskey, Holman, Collins, Cuellar, Makoun, Warnock and Hutton. He kept Given, Ireland, Dunne, Bent, Bannan, Zog, Gabby, Andi, Delph, Clark, Baker. He would have kept Petrov too if that had been an option which sadly it was not. Given, Ireland, Dunne, Bent and Bannan have since been discarded as they didn't perform and/or didn't have the right attitude and/or we already had a better option. There is not one player discarded (with the obvious exception of Petrov) who I wish was still here

 

Concerning your second point I think Risso has quoted stats showing an expenditure of 40m plus. Unsurprisingly you've misunderstood, again. We've paid out around £40m in fees whislt losing players that cost us around £80m in fees - a net outgoing of talent of £40m

Simple question even for you to understand.

How much has Lambert spent since he's been our manager?

 

I've made it a little larger in case you missed it

Since you've now confirmed the amount spent and you've previously stated that Lambert got rid of the players already at the club because they didn't impress which out of the 16 players that Lambert has signed do you think have improved our team?

Benteke and who else?

Even though they collectively cost and earn a fraction of McLs team they delivered more points and a better finish......weird huh!

Which still doesn't answer my question.

Which out of the 16 Lambert signings have improved the team? Benteke and who else? Oh and we secured our Premiership status with just one game to go while in the process of breaking all the wrong records.

[Morpheus]

So let me get this straight if I may.

You have now gone from quoting our improvement in points total at the same stage last season (and I can understand why) to now quoting statistics which apparently excuse our performances under Lambert because we pay low wages. In answering your point I asked you what wages were Gabby, Vlaar, Delph, Weimann, Benteke and Guzan on. You ignored the question.

I then asked you if there is a correlation in performance to wages why is Bent on more wages than Benteke ANSWERED and then quoted you QPR last season who had a high wage outlay yet were relegated. ANSWERED Reading your above post you have yet again failed to reply in context preferring to use sarcasm concerning both Bent and Redknapp. One would have hoped you would have stopped doing that after Berbatov and Adam PREVIOUSLY ANSWERED made you choke on your own opinion of them but obviously ignorance is bliss. LOL

Unless you have the financial clout of the top four, in our mini league there really is no correlation in wages to performance PROOF??? it just comes down to how well you are organised and coached and it is no surprise at all that your very own poster boy according to HH is finally seeing the error of his ways and looking to purchase more experienced players, em, who apparently are not going to be asking the earth in wages. Strange you can actually do that VillaCas isn't it.

Finally just before you go off on another one of your disappearing acts here is a much more relevant stat for you. We'll three actually.

Under your very own poster boy this season we have won two home games in ten with the lowest goals scored in all four divisions. We've won eleven games out of the last forty eight and we're just through an easier set of fixtures.

I note since results are the most important stats of all you have yet to show a result stat table I have absolutely no idea what a result stat table is?? concerning Lambert. I wonder why that is?

 

This is not meant as an insult (truly) but you really don't understand the argument do you?

 

I really can't be bothered to go explain it to you, again

You've no idea what a result table is yet you can post graphs concerning wage to point ratio?

 

Ok i'll make it easy for you then.

 

There must be some kind of graph, table, that can show our results since Lambert became our manager. I mean that would show beyond a shadow of a doubt how successful or how poor Lambert's performance has been. Trying to pull obscure stats out of your arse to prove that Lambert has somehow actually  overachieved with us even though everything else would suggest that he has been a complete disaster just won't cut it with the majority here!

 

No, I've no idea what a "result stat table" is and by the sound of things neither do you

 

Let's follow your plan of appointing a new manager every 12 months or so. Pulis seems flavour of the month or maybe Hughes? or perhaps Pulis first and then Hughes 12 months later

I'll ask you again.

If you are able to produce an obscure graph showing wages to point ratio then show me any graph, pie chart or otherwise depicting Lambert's record of results with us.

I'd also be very interested in you showing me where on site I have advocated a plan 'of appointing a new manager every 12 months?'

Still waiting on an answer to this VillaCas?

[AstonMartin82]

 

This thread gets funnier by the day!!!

 

I hope no one on here wins the Euro Millions and buys Aston Villa otherwise we would be PROPER ****!!!

Out of interest was that meant as some sort of insult? Was that actually contributing to what in general remains a fairly civilised conversation? or was it just a post to cause a problem?

 

Maybe post a reply to what people have said?

 

 

Steve Bruce!!!! 

 

His name being mentioned simply epitomises the mentality of getting the manager in who has been good over the last couple of weeks. The guy has never done anything worthy of note, certainly less than Lambert did at Colchester and Norwich, and is a former Birmingham City manager. BUT because last weekend they convincingly beat Fulham he is top of someones list to replace Lambert.

 

Come on, you gotta find that funny!

[Morpheus]

Nice charts and all that but I go on what's in front of me on the football field. I've seen enough of this insipid shit from team lambert and I want them gone. He will take us down.

.......and bring in another manager, who will struggle with exactly the same problems, who will want to bring in his own players and 18 months down the line you will want him gone too.......and over and over

We don't necessarily need that major overhaul, just a manager who can extract the very best from a set of professional footballers, who has exceptional man management skills aswell as good coaches and is able to set teams up with a game plan , proper tactics and play players in their strongest position. I'd argue the very basics of a top flight manager. Of course lambert is totally unproven at this level and it certainly shows.

Thanks for narrowing it down, so....were looking for a proven top flight manager, with exceptional man-management skills who will be prepared to work with the current squad and budget and presumably someone who is willing to take the same risk with their career and reputation that Lambert has taken and in return we promise to be patient for 12 months........any thoughts on who that might be?

No, thought not

Plenty, but we'll kick off with Steve Bruce.

If we are appointing managers on a budget , this guy fits the bill and has always done well with limited funds whist playing decentish football with a mix of experience and raw talent.

Steve Bruce? Let's gloss over the fact that he already failed at Wigan and Sunderland so hardly fits your criteria of proven top flight manager, he wouldn't quit Hull for Villa ( which says a lot about the job ) and fans would give him about three games to prove himself.

If Steve Bruce is your best choice to start off with, don't worry about coming up with any more names

Ha,ha. You asked the poster for a name, he give you one and now your telling him not to give you anymore. Edited December 31, 2013 by Morpheus

[AstonMartin82]

Oh, this is actually a serious conversation? I thought people were just mucking about.

 

Bruce has spent zillions of £££ where ever he has been, including Hull. He is a cheque book manager, like MON, but unlike MON managed to get a squad of overpaid players relegated.

 

Lambert has no where near as much experience in the Premier League as Bruce, though he did an amazing job at both Colchester and Norwich without spending any money. He took on one of the hardest jobs in Premier League history at Villa where he has to drastically cut the wage bill and keep us in the league. He did that and deserves a little bit more patience... especially when the competition for his job is Steve **** Bruce!

[Isa]

 

Steve Bruce!!!! 

 

His name being mentioned simply epitomises the mentality of getting the manager in who has been good over the last couple of weeks. The guy has never done anything worthy of note, certainly less than Lambert did at Colchester and Norwich, and is a former Birmingham City manager. BUT because last weekend they convincingly beat Fulham he is top of someones list to replace Lambert.

 

Come on, you gotta find that funny!

What did Lambert do that was so great at Colchester out of interest?