penguin

You must feel for him when he joins up with Belgium. Hazard going on about all the great teammates he has at Chelsea, same for Mingolet, Fellani, Kompany....and then they all ask him what it's like to play with Grant Holt and El-Ahmadi. I doubt Fellani has been shouting from the rooftops recently to be honest. Don't really get where your going, they all play for top four clubs, Fellani aside for the moment, so of course the calibre of player around them is going to be better. Hazard and Kompany are also two of the best players in the world in the position they play, whilst Benteke has been quite poor this season.

Yawn. Would you rather he did it on Barry Bannan? You could send him your favourite Gif. I'm sure gabby is among many people's favourite players, I know he is for me.

We should rename this thread Kozak vs Benteke or alternatively Big John vs The World

Seems to be getting a very easy ride here from certain posters. Not everything can be blamed on the play-style, has been let down numerous times from poor touches, decisions and finishing which is down to him alone. Any one season wonder claims are in no way entirely unjustified in my opinion.

Of course stats don't tell the whole story but doesn't look like there's much of a case for not deserving to lose, I know who I would have guessed won.

Not really. It's a well written piece, relevant to the discussion and no one is forcing you to click on it and read it.

Couldn't someone just as easily make a list of 'famous' players who haven't had a loan outside the premiership? It proves nothing. They could, but what would it prove? That not all Premier League players needed to have experience in the lower leagues? No-one is debating that point. The point being debated is, is it, or can it be, beneficial to send players to lower leagues instead of dropping them into the first team? Yeah hence why I said it would prove nothing.... There are cases for both arguments, as I said. And your wrong it is definitely being debated whether it's needed not just beneficial.

Couldn't someone just as easily make a list of 'famous' players who haven't had a loan outside the premiership? It proves nothing.

Ahhh! So it must have been, stop the progression from last season. sign some more shite and emulate a bit of McLeish style football at home. Im sure even Lerner expected a little bit more this season. To me its not worth an end of season bonus???? I do agree with you but the season hasn't ended yet. Hopefully we'l have a finish like we did last year, think that's what's disappointed most people is they expected us to push on from this rather then regress to how we played at the start. Seems to me Lambert has sacrificed almost all fluidity in attack in order to sure up the defence which has resulted in some truly dire football and then wasn't given the funds to rectify this.

Strike one Jack....

I'm with con, what's he playing at? Should get that Messi lad I hear he's prolific in the air. GREALISH OUT

Because we rarely play like we did against Liverpool.And he changed it vs Everton and got it totally wrong!!!! He is forever doing this!!He got it right. Totally stymied a far superior everton side for 50 minutes. The issue was that he didn't react and change it sooner. People associated defensive tactics with bad tactics. It's not the same thing. Kept quiet an striker-less Everton side missing key players, by playing 5 at the back and hoofing it. Hardly a tactical master class was it. Yes, keeping a champions league chasing sidee quiet away from home is a tough thing to do. Why? Villa were missing some key players as well, in fact probably just as many if not more than Everton. But ignore that and just focus on the players everton had injured. If it was so easy to do with five at the back like you claim, why don't more do that? Do what? Lose, have 1 shot on target and have 29% possession, jesus wept, hardly anything to be proud of is it.

Because we rarely play like we did against Liverpool.And he changed it vs Everton and got it totally wrong!!!! He is forever doing this!! He got it right. Totally stymied a far superior everton side for 50 minutes. The issue was that he didn't react and change it sooner. People associated defensive tactics with bad tactics. It's not the same thing. Kept quiet an striker-less Everton side missing key players, by playing 5 at the back and hoofing it. Hardly a tactical master class was it.

I thought the same, would hate to have the name changed. Don't think we'd get anywhere near enough to be worth selling our identity for either.

I really don't get the point of the finacial fairplay rules now, surely the damage has already been done, isn't it simply just ensuring the segregation of the 'normal' clubs from the clubs that got the mega rich owners in before it was passed? A discussion for another thread I suppose.

Whatever view you have please dont assume things like this. It could be - in my case certainly is - that some pro Lambert fans no longer wissh to have the same debate over and over again with largely the same 2 or 3 people (and they may feel the same way !!) I am not going to kee pposting just to prove I still favour PL as Manager, and I have mates who feel the same. The Interent is ALWAYS likely to draw those with something to complain about (not saying they aren't justified or anything) than those who aren't complaining. It does get wearisome having largely the same argument. Those who think we need to give hiim time are obviously never going to agree withthose who think his time is up. So I remain a supporter of keepimng the Manager, and will do right through the season, no matter what happens in the games, for the reasons I - and others - have said over and over - but I wont keep posting it !!! Nobody - as far as I know - is happy at the rate we are progressing - but the difference is some think it better to stay with a guy they still have some faith or belief in rather than the upheaveal and Square One approach. As to why some think he is ok and some dont, well it seems to me a common trait of those who want rid is they think, or 'know' he could have bought better, and/or had better tactics - in other words they know stuff that the likes of me are prepared to say we dont know. The country is full of fans who think player X is a waste of time, but he still gets picked by the Manager, at national level we have had Darren Anderton, Heskey etc, where every fan in a pub will agree they are u/s but every Manager picks them, so I am dont think it really holds water that some dont like players XYZ - I can pull up loads of quotes from posters on here to the effect that Petrov was a waste of space in game after game for an example closer to home. I see after almost every game - as recently as West Ham, Cardiff away, Everton away.....the list goes on.....people saying 'we should have won that' or 'we should beat them at home' etc - if you put even just a couple of these together we would almost be level with Man United - now those who do not want rid of PL are also maybe those who dont think it IS reasonable to expect us to be at that level yet. Is the coaching awful ? Well the Hammers fans were saying that about Allerdyce a few weeks ago, now he has won 3 in 3......Newcastle fans thought they were heading for Top 6 a few weeks ago, now ...? Arsenal were world beaters, as were Man City - now listen to their fans. So those who are ok with things maybe think that defensive errors, tactical mistakes, and strikers who miss chances, are all part of the game. I am as baffled as anyone as to why PL abandons what appears to be a more energetic, pacy, passing style, on a regular basis, for a variety of other styles - but I simply dont go for the idea that he is clueless etc - it just seems such a silly presumption. You may be right that the reason the Team struggle to pass and move is the constant changing formation - but if you know that, maybe he knows that, and does it anyway, maybe not because he is mad, but has a reason ? Another Manager and set of coaches would do other baffling things..(.remember MON always taking Shorey off after 60 minutes ) So, one can be a supporter of PL without always replying to the constant criticism, and whilst still being fed up when we play poorly, and still being puzzled over certain choices, or still being unconvinced by some players. Because we may think we DO agree with the cull, that we dont necessarily know who better we could have got or not got, that we may not be the tactical geniuses we like to think we are, and that amidst the sometimes dross - just like lots of other sides play dross - there are enough signs that he may be just what we need. What other presumption is there though? We play really well, look threatening, create chances then the next game we'll play 5 at the back and hoof balls up to holt all day long and generally just look like a championship team playing against one of the big boys. We just doing it to lull teams into a false sense of security so we can rocket up the table at the end of the season? The presumption he has no clue what to do with the team seems to have its evidence and is far from silly in my opinion.

So do you reckon the job will be 'finished' at the end of next season and, if so, what will 'finished' look like? I expect us to be consistently in the top 10 and pushing towards the top 8 next season. We all expected that this season, and last season as well. Will you be peddling this excuse this time next year as well? You expected top 10 last season? Streuth. I think you've forgotten you're actually an Aston Villa fan not a Stoke or a Fulham or Small Heath one. Looks like Lerner/Faulkner's trick of lowering fans expectations has worked. Take 3 steps backwards then 1 step forward then call it progress. Self-entitled claptrap. I know how dare he have some pride and expectation, the scandal.

If Vlaar decides to leave in the summer, we are in trouble. Delph could be replaced. Could he? It's the other way around in my opinion.

No composure, no confidence and no idea. Some of the worst football I've ever seen us play.

Who said 10-12th isnt good enough? Think the majority of discontent is coming from our piss poor performances, diabolical home form and the fact we've won only 2 in the last 13 games.

We really needed to strengthen in jan, poor first 11 as a whole and no real options/game changers on the bench, be lucky if we don't end up paying for it with relegation imo.

None of them are anywhere near as effective as Gabby. Holt actually worked in the first half. Lambert's line-up for that game was spot on, it was not adapting to the changes Martinez made where he fell short. Just because we were winning in that first half does not mean his tactics were spot on. We were under pressure or at least in our own half nearly the entire game and Martinez just upped the ante by making even more positive changes. Had he kept continuity from the previous two games we may even have scored more than one goal which btw was our only shot on target that entire game. That is not exactly a tactic that will win you games. Holt did almost nothing in that game so I dont know why you think he 'worked' Equally, we could've been completely overrun and behind if we had used the same tactics. Everton play a completely different way to Liverpool. It's a game of calculated risk and lambert just seems to want to defend the nil nil and try and sneak a goal, just not a viable long term strategy in my opinion. Everton were struggling with absences and had no real recognised striker would have liked us to be a lot more positive.

I'd much rather Lambert gave Helenius a chance to be honest. Holt is a known quantity and predictable for defenders and I just can't see him winning points for us, although I would love to eat my words.

Really nervous about this one, I do think we'l win though. Fancy delph to score.

I'd say he does rate them, he just can't afford them. your not going to get Santi Cazorla (or anything other technically gifted player) for £4m on £10K a week. Michu to Swansea - £2 Million Arteta to Everton- £2 Million Kagawa to Dortmund - €350,000 Just to name a few. All came into the respective sides making an immediate impact, think it's becoming too easy to blame everything on a lack of funds, there obviously are players out there that lambert can afford. I don't think naming 3 examples over the past 9 years is really evidence to be honest. I don't necessarily disagree with your point, just saying those are exceptions really. Yes I chose three exceptional examples and there are many more, point wouldn't have been as effective using players such as Andy Reid, Wes Hoolahan etc. So if they were purchased for such cheap amounts and were such great players it isn't too great a leap to assume there would be technically gifted players worldwide (I would have taken Benayoun at the start of the season on a free for sure) that could improve us for a price lambert could afford. Anyway back to Albrighton, looked great against West Ham and put in some great crosses. Gives Lambert a bit of a headache I think as to how to fit him into the team, be interesting to see if he starts against Cardiff.