joey55 Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 I'm slighlty confused by the repsonses here. Has the criteria by which you judge defenders changed from when our defence was being called shit and your was much better because you were conceding less? I know us Spurs fans are delusional, but surely you can see I have a point here. In November last year in this very thread our defence was called shit and Dawson himself was singled out. Yet he's been the mainstay in a defence that has since conceded less goals and a result was voted our player of the year, went to the WC and been capped by England. I've got to say, alot of you Villa fans remind me of GlastonSpur in you posting style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 I've got to say, alot of you Villa fans remind me of GlastonSpur in you posting style. OMG, the shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Clean sheets for Villa: 2 Clean sheets for Spurs: 1 Dawson is so over hyped by Spurs fans. The two games he's played for England he's made dreadful errors both games. Just because Gomes saved his bacon for most of last season doesn't make him a top defender! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey55 Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Clean sheets for Villa: 2 Clean sheets for Spurs: 1 Dawson is so over hyped by Spurs fans. The two games he's played for England he's made dreadful errors both games. Just because Gomes saved his bacon for most of last season doesn't make him a top defender! But Gomes only made 124 saves compared to Friedals 186. Though to be fair Carlo played some games and made 35 saves, but still that shows Friedal is having to make more saves. So this argument doesn't make sense. I'm fairly sure if Glaston made a similar argument, you lot would be all over him for it. It seems to me that the same bias you all accusse Glaston of, is pretty evident amonsgt the Villa fans. I actually think your defence and Dunne are good, but given that many here think ours is shit, then perhaps I'm wrong. It would be strange that since you personally attacked Dawson last season our defence has conceded less than yours, for you to sill have a high opinion of your defence. Unless of course one comes up with some Glastonesque excuses such as our midfiled protects it better, or our GK saved us or your defence picked up toom many knocks. But you guys are nothing like Glaston are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted September 5, 2010 VT Supporter Share Posted September 5, 2010 Comparing Dunne to Dawson is like comparing Ronaldo with Zamora. Yeh Dawson is alright, he has his good games. But ultimately, Dunne is a clear class above. I'll say it again, Spurs best defence, even with Woodgate out, doesn't include Dawson. In fact without King as well I'd still play Gallas and bassong ahead of Dawson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
granville Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Comparing Dunne to Dawson is like comparing Ronaldo with Zamora. Yeh Dawson is alright, he has his good games. But ultimately, Dunne is a clear class above. I'll say it again, Spurs best defence, even with Woodgate out, doesn't include Dawson. In fact without King as well I'd still play Gallas and bassong ahead of Dawson. This. Spurs have good defenders and defensive mids but Dawson is nothing more than a passionate trier. Edit: Unless of course one comes up with some Glastonesque excuses such as our midfiled protects it better, or our GK saved us or your defence picked up toom many knocks. But you guys are nothing like Glaston are you? You don't think your midfield protects your back four better? :? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Dawson is the best defender ever! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey55 Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Dawson is the best defender ever! He's decent, not the best ever. You possibly just massively over rate him as before he started a Prem games for us last season you said: "Spurs won't finish above us because they have a shite defence. Its all well and good attacking nicely but if you're defenders are constantly knackered then results will inevitably go one way. No you may go ahead and name Arsenal of a brilliant attacking team with a dodgy defence, but the fact is they have brilliant attacking players whereas no one beneath the 'Top 4' aside from Man City have that quality in the final third. The only team that has broken the Top 4 in recent years was Everton, and they didn't do it by playing lovely football did they? Defence is the key, ours is better than last year so we have a better chance. Spurs defence is, frankly, balls. Shown when you come up against a decent team and you get pulled apart. They'll do well enough, but they won't finish in the Top 4, or infact above us." Because a week after this statement Dawson became a regular starter and from then on our defensive record was superior to yours and we did indeed finish above you, you probably put too much emphasis on Dawsons influence. I think you just under rated our defence in the first place and by doing so possibly think it would have taken the best defender ever to improve it to an extent we can conceded few enough goals to allow us to finish above you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Yes, bringing up predictions from the start of last season is always a good way to make a point. He's decent but over-rated something fierce by the cockneys and was shown up internationally. Btw if it wasnt for a 7-0 drubbing by Chelski then our defensive record would've been better. Freak result aside, your point is flawed. Anyway last season is last season, Dawson is naff internationally and decent in the league. Nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoccerHQ Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Dawson was brilliant last season, I remember the Arsenal and Chelsea home games which they won when he was immense although he was alongside King on both occasions. Looked shaky alongside Bassong in the qualifier. That's the trouble for Spurs now with him injured as they'll now have to choose whether King plays in the champions league game on the wednesday or the league game on the saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maradona10 Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 I think what helped Dawson, was having a tackler in the middle of the park with bite who cuts out play even before it gets to the defence, its no coincidence that having Palacios guarding them helps, the same though can be said for Terry. My evidence is look at how shit Terry and Dawson play for England because they don't have any protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisVillan Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 GlastonSpur, I'll ask again. When 'onest 'arry was screaming from the rooftops about what scum Spurs fans are, were you defending him blindly against all accusations of being a dodgy old wockney canker on the basis that he might be innocent? Or is that a development since, say, October 2008? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimplySpurfect Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Clean sheets for Villa: 2 Clean sheets for Spurs: 1 Goals conceded by Villa: 6 Goals conceded by Spurs: 2 Are you really trying to prove such a big point based on three games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey55 Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 I think what helped Dawson, was having a tackler in the middle of the park with bite who cuts out play even before it gets to the defence, its no coincidence that having Palacios guarding them helps, the same though can be said for Terry. My evidence is look at how shit Terry and Dawson play for England because they don't have any protection. Our defensive record was better when Palacios didn't play. Dawson was immense against City, Chelsea and Arsenal and Palacios didn't play in any of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beasley14 Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 On this arguement id like to see the stats that invlove King, as he is by far the best of your available cb`s, if he can be classed as that now. Woodgate is your best overall but he's never anywhere near top fitness. Dawson is just ok, but he is very brave. He's a lot like Collins. Dunne when fully fit is a class above imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beasley14 Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Jagielka is also better than Dawson, as he showed by looking a lot more comfrtable when playing for England in the last two games. Dawson has made two huge cock ups already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carew_villa Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 Cahill is better than Dawson IMO. Also I think a big reason for Dawson winning Spurs player of the year last year is because he was so shit before, then turned good, so it seemed like he's all of a sudden turned into a world class player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted September 5, 2010 Share Posted September 5, 2010 One of the ways you can really judge defences is over a complete season. I seem to recall Villa having more clean sheets and conceding less goals than Spurs last season. Dawson looked out of his depth against Hungary and it was his fault they scored. In the most recent match his poor pass could have been fatal again and he injured himself trying to get the ball back. Ok, Spurs punched above their weight for one season but I think a lot of people are far from convined that Dawson has the pace and intelligence to be anything more than an above average premiership defender. We've already seen that he is not an international footballer, more like a liability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carew_villa Posted September 6, 2010 Share Posted September 6, 2010 I get annoyed at how the press big up Dawson so much yet you just know that if he played for a non-London club, he wouldn't be getting the coverage or the plaudits he gets. Jagielka is a much better player yet he is barely mentioned when compared to Dawson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted September 6, 2010 Share Posted September 6, 2010 London bias, isnt it? Most of the countries media are based in London. A large part of that media is staffed by people who are either from London or who have lived there since their late teens/early twenties. It stands to reason that a lot of them will support London based teams. Just look at the exposure West Ham get despite them being shite for almost their entire history. QPR are another club with a huge profile given their on field achievements too, I'm sure it's nothing to do with the fact that their ground is a five minute walk from the BBC though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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