Smoking ban.

[mockingbird_franklin]

After a little thought on this matter I've made a decision today, that I think I'm going to take up smoking after a lifetime of being a non smoker, but only on work days and when its nice out, i quite fancy a nice 10 minute break in the sun every hour, so i've had a quick about turn on my opinion on this matter, hurrah for the smoking ban.

[El Zen]

Michelsen,

why do smokers deserve less freedom than you, i didnt say smokers should have more freedom, just the same as everbody else. this is not a dictatorship, although it feels like it

But if a pub is full of cigarette smoke, the smokers have effectively taken away my freedom of choice to enter that place, again not to mention asthmatics and other allergies.

Smokers on the other hand, don't choke up and have trouble breathing if the air inside the pub is smoke-free. And if they absolutely have to smoke, they have the option (or freedom of choice if you will, to go outside for three minutes.

[El Zen]

It's making them walk outside to do it that I don't agree with - even if I enjoy smokefree pubs. I'd enjoy car free roads too if I wanted to walk on roads, doesn't mean I should be allowed to get it.

It's the concept of putting the smokers' liberties above the liberties of those who suffer from passive smoking I don't get.

Noone will suffer physically if they aren't allowed to smoke inside a pub or restaurant, but many people (if not all of us) will suffer physically if a person decides to light up at the table next to you.

Non-smokers, asthmatics and others should not be restricted from going to the pub or restaurant because of other people's bad habits.

[Risso]

Smokers forcing people to breather their smoke - harmful to others around them

Forcing smokers to go outside for a ciggy - harmful to nobody.

Where's the argument? Nobody's telling people they've got to give up, they're just not allowed to impinge on the health of others around them.

[El Zen]

You could always start on snuff instead, the Scandinavians are crazy on that.

Well, if all smokers quit smoking and started doing snuff instead, the general health would increase dramatically so that isn't really a bad idea.

It is absolutely insane that snuff is banned all across Europe, when cigarettes are not.

[villafan306]

Smokers forcing people to breather their smoke - harmful to others around them

Forcing smokers to go outside for a ciggy - harmful to nobody.

Where's the argument? Nobody's telling people they've got to give up, they're just not allowed to impinge on the health of others around them.

As someone prone to astma-like breathing troubles in smokey environments I must concurr.

[nrogers]

As a none smoker, the thing that pisses me off about other none smokers (I used to use ciggies), is that they moan about people inside and say go outside, when the sun comes out and the smokers are outside, the none smokers whinge about them being outside.

[dundeevilla]

I'm in Scotland, I'm a smoker and I've accepted the ban, no other choice really.

I understand the point of view of people who don't like smoke in pubs. I would have thought the adult way to sort this out would be to have smoking and no smoking rooms in pubs, which are totally seperate with modern ventilation systems. And smoking and non smoking pubs. ie: Give people a choice.

After all we live in a democracy, buying and smoking cigarettes is not illegal, and as adults we have a choice to smoke or not. So give people a choice of smoking or non smoking pubs and bars. This is what they do in some places in Spain.

But apparently in the UK it's better to 'ban' everything these days than give people an adult choice. I'm worried about the way our society is going.

PS: What people have said about pubs stinking since the ban is true. Disinifectant and vomit. It's like drinking in a hospital ward in some places.

[Risso]

But apparently in the UK it's better to 'ban' everything these days than give people an adult choice. I'm worried about the way our society is going.

The UK is hardly the first country to try it out, so I really think that argument is weak. As is the point about adult choice. In a smokey bar, there is no choice.

[stato]

I said fairly early on in this thread that I really struggle to accept any arguments against the ban. Having read the whole thread from then until now, I haven't changed that opinion.

Regardless of whether passive smoking has been proved to damage a person's health or not, the bottom line is this. Smokers have a choice whether to smoke or not, this ban doesn't take that choice away. What it does is even up the field for non smokers because before the ban, we don't have a choice whether or not someone is blowing smoke in our vicinity just because we want to visit the same pub as a smoker.

Most people I know that smoke are at least considerate about it and move away from the area when smoking. It's the ignorant bastards that really piss me off!

[dundeevilla]

But apparently in the UK it's better to 'ban' everything these days than give people an adult choice. I'm worried about the way our society is going.

The UK is hardly the first country to try it out, so I really think that argument is weak. As is the point about adult choice. In a smokey bar, there is no choice.

Exactly my point - if there were non-smoking pubs people would have a choice. Just cos other countries have it doesn't mean we need to follow suit. Typical politicians in action - no imagination, just 'BAN IT OR TAX IT'!

[ahamaad]

Just come back from a couple of days in Glasgow, and I have to say the smoke free atmosphere in pubs/bars is very refreshing. Able to breathe and enjoy your drink and go back to your hotel not smelling like an ash tray is very nice.

[paddy]

Don't think anyone has mentioned a positive for smokers, the social side of things. When I was travelling it was a great way to meet new people, in the smoking area outside. Most smokers I know loved that side of things. Not so pleasant in the cold in this country, but it was certainly an up-side there.

[Risso]

Exactly my point - if there were non-smoking pubs people would have a choice. Just cos other countries have it doesn't mean we need to follow suit. Typical politicians in action - no imagination, just 'BAN IT OR TAX IT'!

Pubs have had the choice to allow smoking or ban it since pubs have been in business basically. How many non smoking pubs are there?

[El Zen]

I would have thought the adult way to sort this out would be to have smoking and no smoking rooms in pubs, which are totally seperate with modern ventilation systems. And smoking and non smoking pubs. ie: Give people a choice.

But then you take away the non-smokers choice of working in places where smoking is allowed. Anywhere smoking is allowed indoors, a group of people is effectively excluded from that place - simple as that - therefore smokers will have to give up their right to excersise their bad habits and desire to kill themselves in public rooms.

[dundeevilla]

I would have thought the adult way to sort this out would be to have smoking and no smoking rooms in pubs, which are totally seperate with modern ventilation systems. And smoking and non smoking pubs. ie: Give people a choice.

But then you take away the non-smokers choice of working in places where smoking is allowed. Anywhere smoking is allowed indoors, a group of people is effectively excluded from that place - simple as that - therefore smokers will have to give up their right to excersise their bad habits and desire to kill themselves in public rooms.

If there was a choice of smoking or non smoking places no-one would be 'excluded ' from anywhere. That's like saying you're 'excluded' from Chinese restaurants if you don't like the food.

People should have a choice - smoking or non-smoking establishments. Seems like a sensible solution to me. Then smokers could carry on killing themselves happily while all the other people who dont like smoking can go to their nice clean-aired pubs. People could choose to work in a non-smoking pub rather than a smoking one if they so choose. Choice - it's what living in a proper democracy is all about.

In a democracy a compromise is better than banning something that is not illegal, IMO. That goes for anything, not just smoking in boozers.

[El Zen]

I would have thought the adult way to sort this out would be to have smoking and no smoking rooms in pubs, which are totally seperate with modern ventilation systems. And smoking and non smoking pubs. ie: Give people a choice.

But then you take away the non-smokers choice of working in places where smoking is allowed. Anywhere smoking is allowed indoors, a group of people is effectively excluded from that place - simple as that - therefore smokers will have to give up their right to excersise their bad habits and desire to kill themselves in public rooms.

If there was a choice of smoking or non smoking places no-one would be 'excluded ' from anywhere. That's like saying you're 'excluded' from Chinese restaurants if you don't like the food.

Yes you would. Anyone with asthma or other significant allergies would struggle to work in an establishment where smoking was allowed. And your anaology with not liking chinese food isn't a very good one, as noone's health would suffer from serving food they don't like the taste of.

People could choose to work in a non-smoking pub rather than a smoking one if they so choose

So do tell me - how many non-smoking pubs are there now, before the ban?

[dundeevilla]

If there was a law saying premises could be smoking or non smoking (as I suppose there is now in a way in England) then landlords would also have a choice. If there was a demand from their custom and staff to go non-smoking then I'm sure they would, rather than lose staff and customers. Give them the choice. The fact there isn't many non-smoking premises at the moment may suggest there isn't a huge demand from customers.

[El Zen]

The fact there isn't many non-smoking premises at the moment may suggest there isn't a huge demand from customers.

You would be surprised, I can tell you, and so would the landlords presumably.

[eston21]

the ban is great. spent the last night after the estonia-england game in a bar drinking and usually all my clothes smellt of smoke and were unwearable the next day. today i coudlve put them on and noone wouldve known that i had spent a good few hours in a bar.