Straggler

Arguments for the bill like "something needs to be done about the NHS. This Bill is something therefore it needs to be done" just don't hold water. This bill has been weighed and found wanting by the huge majority of professional bodies, there has been a recognition from within the Tory party that they not make thier intentions for the NHS known before the last election as it would have made them unelectable. If there had been a campaign based around a top down reform of the NHS with a massive move towards privatisation then we would be in no position to complain. As it is we were told a direct lie and there is no mandate for this change at all. Those that voted Cons, I suppose may be ok with this, most of the Liberal voters that I know are absolutely fuming that their party is supporting this Bill. Liberal used to be an option for me at the ballot box, it sure as hell is not any more and if they let this NHS Bill through I hope (and reasonably suspect) it will be the death of the party. This is possibly the most undemocratic thing i have seen in this country in my lifetime (and I'm old enough to remember the poll tax). It makes me sick to see what is being done to the NHS, I just hope I have enough cash in the bank of I won't be able to affor to be treated. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16954223

@ Voinjama. I agree it is amazing that not only are Real going to win, but that they are pretty much out of site at this stage of the season against such a strong team. Messi just got his 5th goal! Champions League history tonight.

Messi is just unbelievable, but that whole Barca team is spectacular. It is football from a different planet and a joy to watch. I went see them play Valencia a couple of weeks ago. Coming back to watch the Villa play after seeing Barca demolish Valencia 5-1 (Messi got 4 that night too) is like spending a night with all the Victoria's Secret models then coming home to find out that the Mrs is in fact a big fat hairy bloke who intends to have his way with you every night of the rest of your life. This season I genuinely though football was just a shit sport, now I realise that I simply haven't been watching football, just some enthusiastic amateurs in Villa shirts.

I see the BBC are giving us 37% possession today. Against any team that is poor, against Blackburn that is criminal.

I disagree a eunuch is really useful in a whorehouse as they will not be distracted by the goings on so can do useful stuff like keep things nice and tidy and perhaps the book-keeping. I'm going to so with as useful as a waterproof teabag

One of the long running conversations we have on the way to a game (well once or twice a season) is the all time best and all time worst Villa 11. One of our toughest positions to fill was right back in the worst 11 as we didn't really feel that there was a right back that had really been awful in the same way a Kinsella say had been in midfield. Hutton has put an end to our problems in that regard as he is properly pony.

I see no reason for Keane to lie, he has no reason and nothing to gain from doing so. So I take the above from RK as basically true (ish) which leaves me wondering where the problem actually is ? # Actually Keane has hundreds of thousands of reasons to not tell the whole truth. He has already stated that he sees in the future many players taking the same path he Becks, Donovan and Henry have done. This short term loan will be very profitable for Keane and he would like to do more of it. One thing that could really dent these ambitions would be to leave Villa and then give a warts and all analysis of his time there. What other manager would ask him to do the same if he can be shown to be a disruptive influence when he leaves. Giving a nice positive message that follows the party line at Villa is much more condusive to his future employment prospects and ambitions. He actually has less of a reason to be negative about his time there as it can only really reflect badly on him to the rest of the football world (apart from Villa fans). Now he looks like a good solid pro, who came in did a job for the team and was positive in the media. nice addition to the CV I'm sure there are more teams looking at him wondering if he can do the same for them now.....

Well my dad an I have finally made the decision to not renew our season tickets. The decision was made on the way to the game, so was not influenced by the City game, but it did reinforce the belief that we will not be missing anything. AMC has killed it for us, we just don't have fun at Villa Park anymore. We may come back in a few years, but have already booked in other stuff to do on the now free weekends. I will have been coming to the Villa for 28 years by the end of the season so I am probably due a change anyway.

Cut And Run Eaten Alive! Carry on Up the Jungle Toy Story Let the Right One In

Welcome to the jungle The Mighty Peking Man

I will be dumping Ba now before his price drops when everyone else does the same thing. I will buy him back as soon as he gets knocked out or wins the African Cup. You probably won't loose much to do it really.

45 points right now with 7 players still left to play this week. looking good. Was already the 242nd best Villa fan in the world before the week started and in the top 20k in the whole competition.

There is a good player in there somewhere, but it has been lost this season. I would look at Gabby last season, who really seemed to have lost it as a player and was going backwards. This season with fitness on his side he has come back looking marvelous. There is more to Delph showing poor form than him being a rubbish player. I have seen with my own eyes him doing way better than he has done this season. I just hope he can get it back.

Protests are not pointless, they at least have a chance (even a slim onoe) of achieving something. The only thing that is pointless is apathy, which is guaranteed to achieve nothng.

That is fine by me I would want to aim a protest squarly at McLeish.

I had an idea for a protest last night. I'm not going to comment as to when would be a good time to do it, I just liked the idea. Having seen us give up before a ball is kicked I think we should all bring white flags to a game to wave in surrender to whoever the game is against. Should be pretty easy to do as you can wave anything from a hanky to a pillow case, it's generally pretty easy to find some white material to flail about. It would obviously be more effective against one of the "giants of the game" as Mcleish said of Liverpool, where abject surrender seems to have been the main thrust of the team talk.

Guzan - 6 Did pretty well really a few good saves Hutton - 4 Lost his man for one goal and offers the team little in any capacity. Dunne - 6 A few good interceptions and vital tackles, but we let 2 in from corners Collins - 5 Played the ball simply out of defence a few times, which was good, but we let 2 in from corners Warnock - 6 Looks like a proper full back (may just be in comparison to Hutton), although his passing was a bit wayward again. Albrighton - 5 Actually sod this, it is not the individual performances that are the issue it is how we don't play as a unit. What really summed this game up for me was: With 15 minutes to go we have a free kick on our left about half way between the penalty area and the half way line. We are 0-2 down at home and chasing (for want of a better word) the game. We have 2 players stood over the ball ready to take the free kick, they look up and see...... 3 Villa shirts in the box one of which is worn by Bannan (so technically 2 and a half players in the box). At our own offensive free kick we had 8 men including the keeper behing the ball. At 0-2 down at home. Against a Liverpool team that frankly was not that great. Liverpool had 8 men in the box including the keeper making these 3 Villa boys. So what do we do? We lump it hopefully into the box and an easy defensive header is won, the "danger" passes. It was not like we took it quickly, there was plenty of time to get players forward and pile on the pressure, we just didn't. I look for two people here to make a difference. The manager and the Captain. For me it is the manager that has developed the feeling of apathy in the players, we lack direction, motivation and seem to have no plan on or off the ball. That he was not on the touchline waving players forward should be stunning to me, but I have been effected by his apathy so I don't expect any better from him. Sadly Petrov was just stood watching this develop too. This has me in two minds as I gave him man of the match, as he did seem to try hard and the little quality that there was on the ball came in a large part from him. But a Captains performance it was not as at that moment he needed to take charge on the pitch and get his men forward. We need a leader, we need motivation. This team is not as bad as it is playing, almost every single player out there is playing beneath the standards that we know they can play. I think it was Richard who first said on here that we as a team are less than the sum of our parts. That is absolutely what I saw on Sunday. This never say win attitude arrived with Mcleish, please God that it goes with him and the sooner the better.

Totally with you on this one. I shall be there again against my better judgement, but it could be for the last time whilst Eck is in charge. If he has not learned his lesson yet I'm not sure he ever will.

Are you for real? The point stands. To say in DEC you wont renew due to 'the football' is idiotic. Well done you just called 51 and counting posters on here idiots.

I'm a no because of McLeish. Held the ticket for 25 years too. I have said it elsewhere, but I would not watch this team on TV. That old Lineker line of being better to watch on Ceefax can now apply to us. If we get rid of McLeish I will more than likely renew even if we are relegated by then. I just want us to play to win. I would also like to make it clear like many have before me, that this has nothing to do with where he came from and everything to do with where he is taking us.

As we have 7 people between Villarocker and myself that won't be renewing under McLeish maybe we could keep a running total on here? The odd journo has been noted on here and a public declaration with a total number of unrenewed season tickets may put on more pressure than a private email?

I'm all up for the non renewal of season tickets as a genuine expression of concern. I travel with three other season ticket holders and on the way up to the game we had all pretty much decided not to renew if McLeish is still in charge next season. I will admit when I saw the team sheet I had a little flicker of hope, but the performance was the same old same old and we left in the same opinion as we arrived. I don't think I would watch this team on the TV never mind pay for a season ticket. I've had a season ticket for some 25 years and we have all been going as a group for the whole time so this is not a decision taken lightly. We have decided that we would be better just going out for a meal and a drink and rely on each others company for the entertainment.

AMC out. I just don't want to watch us play like this. I would rather see us get relegated than play this brand of cowardly football.

I don't know what game you're watching but I've seen Collins get the ball quite a distance passed the half-way line on numerous occassions. lol

I'm doing this too. My wife hates it. It's not like I don't already give her enough reasons to say no. Going for the Lord Flashheart, achieving more the Orlando Bloom, but without the good looks.