Can Someone please explain

[Stevo985]

...he's had way above bank % rates on his loans). Basically don't be fooled, Lerner has not put a single cent into this club. It's all about investment and return.

That's complete and utter bollocks. Totally wrong in every fact.

That's usually the rule of thumb I apply to all of CI's posts.

[ermie123]

That money either got spent, or invested into the club to cover the huge debts we're running up.

 

This baffling idea some people seem to have that Lerner sits there and goes "Ooooooh 20 million for James MIlner. That'll pay for my next Yacht" and pockets the cash is ludicrous.

 

Fine if you think he should be investing more. It's a legitimate argument and one I'd agree with about now. But to think he's actually taking money from the sales of players and filling his boots is nonsense.

Hes going to need a yacht because his current ship is sinking.

That just about some us up!!!!!

[CI]

 

...he's had way above bank % rates on his loans). Basically don't be fooled, Lerner has not put a single cent into this club. It's all about investment and return.

That's complete and utter bollocks. Totally wrong in every fact.

Prove that it's wrong.

List out all interest and "management charges" since he arrived.

[switters]

Ok,first off, I dont understand PLs tactics.I watched Man Shitty

today and Mancini put Lescott on to defend their lead in the 75th

minute.PL put Dawkins on when we were under real pressure to keep a

point ? Lescott is a defender put on to help them defend their

lead,Dawkins replaced a forward ( Zog ) 

Dawkins was on to provide an out-ball. Getting the ball high up the pitch is best form of defence, also at that time we could still have got another goal on the break & adding attacking threat out wide means their full backs can't push forward as much. There's pros & cons to bringing on an extra defender late on - it can add height & another body, but it can also confuse your positioning & make you sit back more, which invites pressure. We only had Lichaj as defender on the bench and I'm not sure him coming on would've prevented us conceding. Sylla might've made more sense in centre midfield.

 

 

2nd - Arsenal have been in the top 4 of the Premier League for 10 seasons

streight,so Lambert must have known it would not be a walk in the

park.So why were Marshall,Dawkins and Bowery even in the squad ? let

alone on the field ?

 

Marshall - Given was injured. Marshall's fine as 3rd choice keeper. Chances of him coming on were minimal.

Dawkins - pacy winger, useful sub option to have. Albrighton injured & Carruthers I guess isn't ready, so not like there's many other wide players we have for the bench.

Bowery - Bent's injured, what other strikers do we have? And he didn't play anyway.

 

 

3rd - I dont understand PL,s team selections.I always thought you

would put out the best team avaiable ? Surely Dawkins and Bowery can,t

be better than Bent,Ireland,Bannan,Allbrighton. ? And as for Marshall,

surely if Guzan got injured in the warm-up or on the pitch Given would

be better than Marshall ? 

Given, Bent, Albrighton are all injured. I'd have one of Ireland or Bannan on bench but Dawkins and Bowery are both different types of player. If we switched them 2 we'd have no forward and no outright winger, only DMs - El Ahmadi/Sylla or AMs - Ireland/Bannan/Holman. Bench needs to be balanced, and I think you are judging way too much on name value. Dawkins did fine when he came on in previous game and Bowery has also been okay in small cameos. They are not world-beaters but equally their presence on the bench is not going to cost us a match. and there really aren't many options.

 

 

While I am on the subject I might as well ask for explinations on the money situation that I dont understand either.

Ok, so MON got us to 6th for 3 seasons in a row, and apparently we

overspent.I can understand that BUt we were in europe, we had long cup

runs so we must have made more money than we are now ? I fail to see how

losing games and fighting relegation can be worth more money ?

 

You're just making wild guesses. Europe does not make much money at all, unless you are in Champions League which we never were. Cup runs also pretty small change in comparison to Premier League & Champions League. If we've cut our wagebill by say £20-30m a year, that is probably a bigger saving than we'd make from finish 10 places higher in the league and playing in Europa Cup. The simple fact is wagebill was way too high for the money we are making and that was not going to change without Champions League qualification.

 

What about players ? we have to move the high erners on.Ok I can understand that as well BUT.

West Ham can afford Collins,Sunderland can afford Cuella, does that

mean that we cant even keep up with West Ham for spending ? Fulham

bought Berbatov and West Ham have Carrol on loan.....we have Dawkins.I

am sure we cant even look at players like Berbatov and Carrol.

 

Comparing Dawkins to players like Berbatov and Carroll is absurd. We have high paid players too - the comparison is Bent. It's fairly clear we can't afford to bring in more high earners till the likes of Bent & Ireland are off the wagebill.

 

 

Finally, Since MON left we have gone from 6th to 18th, so since then

we have been going downhill rapidly.We need to put the breaks

on,now.Lambert has had a whole season and we have only got worse.

FFS, someone explain to me WTF is going on over there

 

It's not going well. Everyone knows the team as it is isn't good enough, but Lambert has not had a whole season yet and there's not a lot we can do before the end of the season except support the team we have.

[Stevo985]

 

...he's had way above bank % rates on his loans). Basically don't be fooled, Lerner has not put a single cent into this club. It's all about investment and return.

That's complete and utter bollocks. Totally wrong in every fact.

Prove that it's wrong.

List out all interest and "management charges" since he arrived.

Prove that it's right.

[briny_ear]

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, or something like that...

[blandy]

...he's had way above bank % rates on his loans). Basically don't be fooled, Lerner has not put a single cent into this club. It's all about investment and return.

That's complete and utter bollocks. Totally wrong in every fact.

 

 

 

...he's had way above bank % rates on his loans). Basically don't be fooled, Lerner has not put a single cent into this club. It's all about investment and return.

That's complete and utter bollocks. Totally wrong in every fact.

Prove that it's wrong.

List out all interest and "management charges" since he arrived.

 

WIthout the accounts in front of me, but from memory:

 

...he's had way above bank % rates on his loans - No, like I said, bollocks - The rate (as of last set of accounts), of interest on the loans is 2% above LIBOR - London Inter Bank Rate (the rate banks lend to each other [not customers]. This is way less than a bank loan would have been to the club. - It's in the accounts.

Lerner has not put a single cent into this club. - As of the last set of accounts, he'd put approximately £133 million in, not in loans, but in equity - cash in return for shares in a company which he already owns 100% of. It's not hard to see this type of thing reported in the press who report on it The US billionaire has injected £115.6m in equity and another £89.6m has come in through shareholder loans.

 

Again, from memory, There's twice been management charges of £7 million, but waived once - so the total in is approx 126 million from him personally.

 

Interest charges at the rate detailed above, are not to Randy Lerner, but to the Trust, [which he does not control or administer] and are at lower rates than an loan from a bank.

 

​There's plenty to criticise for - the waste of money spent, lack of football expertise o nthe board, a seeming reluctance to take good advice from people with the club at heart and so on, but the things you claimed are simply untrue.

[CI]

So, I've looked into this and indeed I may owe Lerner an apology. On the face of it, it looked as though he was charging approx 4.6% interest. However, factor in the additional £133m rights issue he effectively pumped in, this brings the figure down to a modest 2.3%

Couldn't find anything on management charges, this may be something to do with the family trust.

[praisedmambo]

I am not a soccer analyst and some of the stuff going down at AVFC is very puzzling to me.Perhaps someone can explain it to me ?!

Ok,first off, I dont understand PLs tactics.I watched Man Shitty today and Mancini put Lescott on to defend their lead in the 75th minute.PL put Dawkins on when we were under real pressure to keep a point ? Lescott is a defender put on to help them defend their lead,Dawkins replaced a forward ( Zog ) 

2nd - Arsenal have been in the top 4 of the Premier League for 10 seasons streight,so Lambert must have known it would not be a walk in the park.So why were Marshall,Dawkins and Bowery even in the squad ? let alone on the field ?

3rd - I dont understand PL,s team selections.I always thought you would put out the best team avaiable ? Surely Dawkins and Bowery can,t be better than Bent,Ireland,Bannan,Allbrighton. ? And as for Marshall, surely if Guzan got injured in the warm-up or on the pitch Given would be better than Marshall ? 

While I am on the subject I might as well ask for explinations on the money situation that I dont understand either.

Ok, so MON got us to 6th for 3 seasons in a row, and apparently we overspent.I can understand that BUt we were in europe, we had long cup runs so we must have made more money than we are now ? I fail to see how losing games and fighting relegation can be worth more money ?

What about players ? we have to move the high erners on.Ok I can understand that as well BUT.

West Ham can afford Collins,Sunderland can afford Cuella, does that mean that we cant even keep up with West Ham for spending ? Fulham bought Berbatov and West Ham have Carrol on loan.....we have Dawkins.I am sure we cant even look at players like Berbatov and Carrol.

Finally, Since MON left we have gone from 6th to 18th, so since then we have been going downhill rapidly.We need to put the breaks on,now.Lambert has had a whole season and we have only got worse.

FFS, someone explain to me WTF is going on over there

You are right 100%, you are definitely not a soccer analyst 

[blandy]

So, I've looked into this and indeed I may owe Lerner an apology. On the face of it, it looked as though he was charging approx 4.6% interest. However, factor in the additional £133m rights issue he effectively pumped in, this brings the figure down to a modest 2.3%

Couldn't find anything on management charges, this may be something to do with the family trust.

The rights issue is totally unrelated to the interest rate.

 

LIBOR is currently 0.48125 %. Add on 2% to that and the loan interest rate is currently 2.48125 %

 

That is nothing at all to do with the money he has personally put in. The interest from the loans doesn't even go back to him, it goes to the Lerner Trust, (which has him and his siblings as beneficiaries). The Trustees have a legal duty to look after the assets of the trust.

While him and the other beneficiaries will be able to have a say on the direction the trust takes, the decision is not down to them.

 

That is a concern, though a small one, but if you owe someone money, and they are not interested (in a non-financial way) then they could take decisions based only on money, and not (in our case) the well being of the club. But that's another topic entirely.

 

I doubt RL reads this board, and I doubt he'd want an apology. But as a general thing, writing or asserting something that's utterly untrue, and without foundation or evidence of any sort to support it (rather than just slightly misinformed) is not a good idea at all.

[Woodytom]

This thread is gettin way too technical for me!!

[CI]

2008/09 - Management Charges of £7.7m

[briny_ear]

I think this thread has lost its direction if it ever had one.

[TRO]

...he's had way above bank % rates on his loans). Basically don't be fooled, Lerner has not put a single cent into this club. It's all about investment and return.

That's complete and utter bollocks. Totally wrong in every fact.

concurred with blandy

[TRO]

Randy imo has appointed managers who have done little for him....his fault I guess for poor recruitment or control. as for making cash available, a diamond in comparison with the last incumbent.