peterms Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 If I build a house without planning consent, and then refuse to demolish it if required to do so, I also would expect the Council to do it for me. This seems to echo one of the main themes we hear from people commenting, that the law should apply to travellers just as to everyone else. That seems a little naive. Planning law works in favour of the rich, the powerful, those who are well-connected, even before Cameron's planned weakening of the current regulations to favour developers and chain stores. It even seems to work better for the main opponent of this site, a man recently arrested for attempted arson and carrying a shotgun, than for the travellers. Before the travellers bought Dale Farm, the site was a scrapyard. They built a neat little residential area and applied for planning permission. This permission – as is the case with 90% of applications from travellers - was denied. This denial contrasts with Basildon Council’s decision to sell off greenbelt at Vange School and at other areas including an enormous Homebase development on greenbelt land, and other developments on highly valuable land at Kent View and Northlands. A decision on a 500-strong housing development at Gloschester Park again on greenspace due to be taken on the 20th has been delayed, presumably to avoid direct comparison. Amazingly the property right next door to Dale Farm, owned by a self-styled “anti-traveller activist” successfully applied to have an illegal building extended, despite an unenforced eviction notice on other illegal dwelling places on the site. From here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiggyrichard Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 But since when did "Travellers" become a separate ethnic group? 2000 - I think that was when the judgement was made that Irish travellers were one according to the Race Relations Act. This is where I draw the line. They ain't. It's a lifestyle choice, not a race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaajax Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I think if the Police were allowed to bust heads like they used to then we wouldn't be in this situation in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiggyrichard Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I think if the Police were allowed to bust heads like they used to then we wouldn't be in this situation in the first place. Run...run as fast as you can and dont look back...they're coming for you...the PC brigade... If you behave like an animal...expect to be treated like on. Throwing bucket loads of piss over the police...heathens! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu_The_Villan Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I think its an outrage whats happening to these 'travellers' being evicted from Dale Farm. Surely its a breach of these 'travellers' human rights... I mean, actually making them 'travel' somewhere?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Freeloading theiving bastards who do not pay towards the local services for where they live. I say the same for the rest of the immigrants that come over to the UK with the intention of getting what they can for **** all. They are all the same abusing a system that allows it. Are you against all freeloading and thieving, or just that committed by immigrants? Are you against immigrants who don't freeload and thieve, or don't you agree such a category of people exists? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 This is where I draw the line. They ain't. It's a lifestyle choice, not a race. I don't believe they claimed to be a race. The court accepted that they were a distinct ehtnic group for the purposes of the RRA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 20, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted October 20, 2011 This is where I draw the line. They ain't. It's a lifestyle choice, not a race. I don't believe they claimed to be a race. The court accepted that they were a distinct ehtnic group for the purposes of the RRA.Ethnic group, race, meh. You may as well say Guardian readers, birdwatchers or train spotters are ethnic groups. Just because I don't glory in the treatment of them doesn't mean I support their "cause". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiggyrichard Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Freeloading theiving bastards who do not pay towards the local services for where they live. I say the same for the rest of the immigrants that come over to the UK with the intention of getting what they can for **** all. They are all the same abusing a system that allows it. Are you against all freeloading and thieving, or just that committed by immigrants? Are you against immigrants who don't freeload and thieve, or don't you agree such a category of people exists? I think its clear in his post that he has a problem with people who abuse the system to their own benefit without any intention of paying taxes, seeking work etc. generally people who abuse the system put in place by this country and have no intention to contributing to the country and economy in which they reside. If someone wants to come here and graft and work hard to earn a living for their family, fine, fair play and good luck to them. Its the scrounging **** i cant abide and these people fall right into that catagory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 This is where I draw the line. They ain't. It's a lifestyle choice, not a race. I don't believe they claimed to be a race. The court accepted that they were a distinct ehtnic group for the purposes of the RRA.Ethnic group, race, meh. You may as well say Guardian readers, birdwatchers or train spotters are ethnic groups. Those are communities of interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 20, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted October 20, 2011 This is where I draw the line. They ain't. It's a lifestyle choice, not a race. I don't believe they claimed to be a race. The court accepted that they were a distinct ehtnic group for the purposes of the RRA.Ethnic group, race, meh. You may as well say Guardian readers, birdwatchers or train spotters are ethnic groups. Those are communities of interest.Fine. Still subject to the laws of the land, same as everybody else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Ethnic group, race, meh. You may as well say Guardian readers, birdwatchers or train spotters are ethnic groups. If birdwatchers, train spotters or Grauniad readers wished to argue their case then they are at liberty to do so. I'd suggest that the courts wouldn't see them as such a group for the purposes of that act but I'd be happy to have a listen to how they set out their argument. Just because I don't glory in the treatment of them doesn't mean I support their "cause". Who cares whether you or I or anyone else in this thread supports their 'cause'? I doubt that any of the appalling comments in this thread are because of a lack of support for a 'cause' but rather a glee in finding another group of people (whether distinct ethnic group or not) to dehumanize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 20, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted October 20, 2011 Ethnic group, race, meh. You may as well say Guardian readers, birdwatchers or train spotters are ethnic groups. If birdwatchers, train spotters or Grauniad readers wished to argue their case then they are at liberty to do so. I'd suggest that the courts wouldn't see them as such a group for the purposes of that act but I'd be happy to have a listen to how they set out their argument. Just because I don't glory in the treatment of them doesn't mean I support their "cause". Who cares whether you or I or anyone else in this thread supports their 'cause'? I doubt that any of the appalling comments in this thread are because of a lack of support for a 'cause' but rather a glee in finding another group of people (whether distinct ethnic group or not) to dehumanize.:nod: Oh, indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Freeloading theiving bastards who do not pay towards the local services for where they live. I say the same for the rest of the immigrants that come over to the UK with the intention of getting what they can for **** all. They are all the same abusing a system that allows it. Are you against all freeloading and thieving, or just that committed by immigrants? Are you against immigrants who don't freeload and thieve, or don't you agree such a category of people exists? I think its clear in his post that he has a problem with people who abuse the system to their own benefit without any intention of paying taxes, seeking work etc. generally people who abuse the system put in place by this country and have no intention to contributing to the country and economy in which they reside. If someone wants to come here and graft and work hard to earn a living for their family, fine, fair play and good luck to them. Its the scrounging **** i cant abide and these people fall right into that catagory. There's a lot of people who abuse various systems for their own benefit. Quite a lot of them are to be found in parliament, the most exclusive clubs, the finest restaurants. Others are a little more down-to-earth, like the cash-in-hand tradesman. It's the emphasis on "immigrants" as abusers of the system that I was asking about, and whether the poster believes immigrants to be especially noteworthy in this regard, or whether abuse is worse when carried out by an "immigrant" than eg an emigrant non-dom, or someone Essex born and bred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b6bloke Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 Freeloading theiving bastards who do not pay towards the local services for where they live. I say the same for the rest of the immigrants that come over to the UK with the intention of getting what they can for **** all. They are all the same abusing a system that allows it. Are you against all freeloading and thieving, or just that committed by immigrants? Are you against immigrants who don't freeload and thieve, or don't you agree such a category of people exists? I am against all freeloaders including British ones, I am against a system which allows it to be abused no matter what creed from Mr Smith playing golf when caliming disablity benefit, Mr Murphey and Sahed who want to live in our country free as they have to pay in theirs or get nothing . I am against the Pole who does not have to get a green counterfoil on his driving licence so can never get points on it, I am against 15 year old jane smith who gets pregnant and gets a house, benefits, interest free loans and can afford more than Miss Smith who works and has to struggle just to pay childcare. I dont want to put them in camps, I dont want to ship them off on trains though the Eurostar would be helpful for some of that group, I want fair! I enjoy seeing a brit getting caught fiddling as much as anybody else but this thread is about an immigration problem and just because they are white are still classed as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 20, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted October 20, 2011 Let's all go back to the 1950s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b6bloke Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 Let's all go back to the 1950s. Mike be realistic!!! No Iphones!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 20, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted October 20, 2011 Let's all go back to the 1950s. Mike be realistic!!! No Iphones!!!! Well I WAS being sarcastic, but now you come to mention it, the idea does have some merits... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b6bloke Posted October 21, 2011 Author Share Posted October 21, 2011 You mean life without Angry birds! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 I doubt that any of the appalling comments in this thread are because of a lack of support for a 'cause' but rather a glee in finding another group of people (whether distinct ethnic group or not) to dehumanize. Spot on Snowy. Some of the comments in here are quite sickening TBH. Some seem to revel in the suffering of others, and justify that glee because "they aren't like us/they aren't one of us". I've seen very little compassion/understanding/empathy. OK, you may not agree with how they live and/or what they stand for, but that is different to getting kicks from seeing them suffer. Seems some may not have evolved beyond capturing wasps in jars, or pulling wings off flies .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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