Mantis Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 10 minutes ago, mjmooney said: Cuts both ways, though. All those others are 'final scores'. Emery is still in his 'honeymoon period' at Villa, and hasn't yet had the inevitable (?) bad run. He can only be judged properly when he leaves. But is he in his honeymoon period though? I'd argue that ended back in February when we lost 3 on the bounce. Of course we can only properly judge him when his tenure is over but he's been in the job a year now and that's normally enough time to work out how good/poor a manager is. And the fact is I think he's just really good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 2 hours ago, Mantis said: But is he in his honeymoon period though? I'd argue that ended back in February when we lost 3 on the bounce. Of course we can only properly judge him when his tenure is over but he's been in the job a year now and that's normally enough time to work out how good/poor a manager is. And the fact is I think he's just really good. True. But almost every manager’s stint at any given club ends with a run of bad form (unless they retire or get poached, which tends to be rare). That run of bad form is baked into everyone else’s numbers already. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted October 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2023 Honeymoon period of a year?! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 32 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said: True. But almost every manager’s stint at any given club ends with a run of bad form (unless they retire or get poached, which tends to be rare). That run of bad form is baked into everyone else’s numbers already. Let's be honest here, at this stage it's far more likely than his time with us ends as a result of him getting poached than him getting sacked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steero113 Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 54 minutes ago, romavillan said: Honeymoon period of a year?! I got into an argument on Twitter with a Tesco bags fan after he claimed we were still in our manager bounce 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2023 1 hour ago, romavillan said: Honeymoon period of a year?! You misunderstand. His first year happens to have been incredibly successful - we know that - but we're not comparing like with like - a great first year against the other guys' entire Villa careers. It would be equally meaningless if he'd had a mediocre year. Work out the average when he leaves, and the stats will mean something. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 (edited) As I said before, any honeymoon period was over by February, although even then that was a longer honeymoon period than most recent managers we've had. Emery - 3 months-ish? Gerrard - lasted about a month Smith - couple of months Bruce - couple of months Di Matteo - didn't have one Garde - 1 game Sherwood - 2-3 months Lambert - a month at most, if he had one at all McLeish - couple of months Houllier - a few weeks? 7 minutes ago, mjmooney said: You misunderstand. His first year happens to have been incredibly successful - we know that - but we're not comparing like with like - a great first year against the other guys' entire Villa careers. It would be equally meaningless if he'd had a mediocre year. Work out the average when he leaves, and the stats will mean something. A year in the top flight is enough time for the highest win percentage in Villa history to be extremely impressive, though. Edited October 28, 2023 by Mantis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 26 minutes ago, Mantis said: As I said before, any honeymoon period was over by February, although even then that was a longer honeymoon period than most recent managers we've had. Emery - 3 months-ish? Gerrard - lasted about a month Smith - couple of months Bruce - couple of months Di Matteo - didn't have one Garde - 1 game Sherwood - 2-3 months Lambert - a month at most, if he had one at all McLeish - couple of months Houllier - a few weeks? I don’t think anyone is saying he’s in his honeymoon period. We’re just saying you’re not comparing like for like. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 8 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said: I don’t think anyone is saying he’s in his honeymoon period. We’re just saying you’re not comparing like for like. I mean tbf mjmooney did say on the last page that he was in his honeymoon period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Mantis said: I mean tbf mjmooney did say on the last page that he was in his honeymoon period. I’ll see myself out. Edited October 28, 2023 by Panto_Villan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982am Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 Only average to poor managers have potential honeymoon periods. The best managers are too busy winning to be on holiday. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catanzaro Posted October 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2023 What I love about Emery is his sustainable approach.. I watched Newcastle tonight and it was so fast paced right from the off and no plan b.. I am now convinced our team will be stronger than theirs going in to April and May.. those Newcastle players will be f*cked.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWARLEY2 Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 5 minutes ago, catanzaro said: What I love about Emery is his sustainable approach.. I watched Newcastle tonight and it was so fast paced right from the off and no plan b.. I am now convinced our team will be stronger than theirs going in to April and May.. those Newcastle players will be f*cked.. Absolutely. You can see how he treats the cup games. Its slow and controlled to save energy. Chess midweek. Football at the weekens 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, avfc1982am said: Only average to poor managers have potential honeymoon periods. The best managers are too busy winning to be on holiday. Oh FFS, I'll reword it if you like. We are comparing one (so far) very impressive season against full Villa tenures. It shows that Emery is bloody brilliant so far. It doesn't yet mean that he's statistically 'better' (or worse) than Saunders, Little, Taylor, etc. Edited October 28, 2023 by mjmooney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBlack Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 37 minutes ago, mjmooney said: Oh FFS, I'll reword it if you like. We are comparing one (so far) very impressive season against full Villa tenures. It shows that Emery is bloody brilliant so far. It doesn't yet mean that he's statistically 'better' (or worse) than Saunders, Little, Taylor, etc. I doubt any manager has a higher win percentage in his first year if you want to compare like with like. Gregory might be close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2023 18 minutes ago, MrBlack said: I doubt any manager has a higher win percentage in his first year if you want to compare like with like. Gregory might be close. Well, if those stats for the other managers for their first year only, we'd had a fair comparison (and yes, I'm sure Unai would come out top). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982am Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 1 hour ago, mjmooney said: Oh FFS, I'll reword it if you like. We are comparing one (so far) very impressive season against full Villa tenures. It shows that Emery is bloody brilliant so far. It doesn't yet mean that he's statistically 'better' (or worse) than Saunders, Little, Taylor, etc. WTF you on about? I didn't quote you did I? It was a general pov not personally directed. I haven't said Emery's better than Little or Taylor either( although I think he is). I would never say better than Saunders on the basis Saunders won the lot. He is however a winner so hence my point that I don't believe he's in a honeymoon period. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted October 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2023 3 hours ago, mjmooney said: You misunderstand. His first year happens to have been incredibly successful - we know that - but we're not comparing like with like - a great first year against the other guys' entire Villa careers. It would be equally meaningless if he'd had a mediocre year. Work out the average when he leaves, and the stats will mean something. What it means is that for a whole year he has an incredible win percentage. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted October 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2023 2 minutes ago, romavillan said: What it means is that for a whole year he has an incredible win percentage. Absolutely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted October 28, 2023 Share Posted October 28, 2023 I think Emery is pretty clearly the best manager we've ever had in terms of ability, but obviously not (yet) the best in terms of achievements. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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