VillanousOne

If Okore is fit i guess he would start alongside Vlaar. But no idea who will play in midfield alongside Delph and Westwood - maybe Tonev or Bacuna? Arsenal were poor on both occasions against us last season but it only takes a bit of composure and individual flair to rip us apart like soft bread. we might get a 1:1 draw if Arsenal have an off day.

I don't agree with this - I did at the time think it was madness when he threw Bent out of the first team squad and would only harm his value. But I think the reality with these players is they know they are not wanted as do their agents and hence as do other clubs. Agents and clubs likely knew long before anyone was bombed out that Bent/Ireland/Bannan etc. could be got on the cheap. It also puts the onus on the player - if you want to play football go and talk to other clubs, negotiate wages, make it happen yourself. If you just want to earn money for doing nothing here's the bomb squad - enjoy. Its' clear what the bomb squad want to do. But that's the problem isn't it - they won't get the wages they are on now - and they still think they are good enough to justify those wages somewhere else - or are prepared to do nothing and just take the money - believing they have been treated poorly. Bent is probably the only one you could say that is probably worth most of the wages he is on as when he plays he scores much of the time. How do we expect people to want these players if we are happy to let the world know how little we value them. Segregating them and making them train alone just says to the world 'Here is a bunch of expensive arseholes we don't rate, are disruptive to the rest of the team and we will do anything to get rid of' Bent is an asset, he may not be better than what we have in the formation we play - but if we'd kept him as a sub or occasional plan B then we wouldn't be struggling to shift him. But Lambert decided that getting absolutely nothing or nowhere with/from Jordan Bowery was the better option.

Players used to take a wage cut to get a move to be able to play football again and restore their credibility, it seems none of our lot will do that not even sodding Bannan! If we don't get rid of these players then we may aswell use them, all publically bombing them out does is ensure their dwindling value drops even further.

Seriously, we can't even give the guy away. Spurs can command a fee for Parker who is 32 and past it, and Dempsey who os 30 and past it and yet we can't even send Bent on loan to a team who will cover his wages!!! FFS!

We don't actually know for certain he doesn't give a shit, it's a toxic mix of the fact how his attitude has been portrayed, the fact he clearly winds managers up by not playing to his potential and who he replaced at Villa. We don't even know what wages he is on. He is clearly one babybel short of a packed lunch, but still not sure if he deserves the derision we give him. I love Lambert, but the total bomb out approach of players he doesn't fancy, has just affectively ruined any chance we have of moving any of them on. We can't even get rid of Bent for less than a quarter of what we paid for him.

All the hatred is based mostly on assumption and because it's become fashionable. Player on high wages that Lambert doesn't rate = HATE HATE HATE HATE Unfullfilled expectation = HATE HATE HATE same with Bent. Not saying I rate or want to keep either, if Lambert doesn't want them then they need to go but it is scary how people spit bile at these players. MON/Houllier, Lerner gave them the stupid wages in the first place, both players have had their values decreased and their playing time reduced to nothing. Yes it must be good to do **** all and earn that much but it's not their doing is it.

you're entitled to that opinion but i don't accept the type of comedy defending every week that makes us the laughing stock of the premiership is ok as long as we score a few nice goals. Attacking football and a reasonably competent level of defending doesn't have to be mutually exclusive. Every team will make mistakes, defensive howlers and clangers, but there is no reason to expect those to be every week. Also not sure about this 'Lambert way' i don't think Norwich were as shit at us at defending.

I'm not saying this is the case, but if we haven't improved defensively after last season (and I get that we did get better last season) then there is no excuses. I really don't want another season were we have the attacking potential of a top 8 side, but the defence of a pub team. If we can't get a defensive coach to sort out positioning and set piece defending then we will continue with the 'we have to score four goals to win a game' bullsh*t. and i realise that this is just pre-season, and it will take time for Okore and Luna to settle, and any improvements will take time....... but.............

Westwood's corners were a bit better. Once we ditched Bannan - we started to look a threat from set pieces. I think Tonev, Helenius and Bacuna can beef up that side of things, maybe even Luna, Gardener if he plays. Does anyone know who took set pieces during the friendlies aside from the Gardener free kick. Young's were far from consistent, in fact although he was awesome at times, I think we have a romanticised memory of how good he was.

If we approached him, then surely we want to sign him. But I imagine the German club don't and the transfer fee is a lot higher than we want to pay, although under the circumstances it is hard to expect any different. I doubt we want to go down the player power route if he does actually want to sign for Villa. I am sure we will look at other cheaper targets and then if we fail to get them and manage to shift some dead wood we might go back in and bid. the most positive thing we can take from all this is that we are looking at this type of player

A fully Prem blooded Tonev and a fit Nzogbia might give us the attacking options we need in midfield, plus Helenius can do that role. Also Gardener and Albrighton when fit can add attacking options to midfield - although both are long shots right now. Surely this must also be the break through season for Carruthers or else we would just be loaning or selling him, maybe Grealish will get a look in at some point. I get that the links to Belhanda and Kiyoakte indicate we want an AM but we don't know if those are true, most of the time we enquire about players and then agents and clubs use that understated interest to ramp up transfer fees etc. We might have a scout who discovers someone they like, but the club may have no interest in that player at that point in time. We're a big club allegedly so I imagine 'interest' can be registered at many different levels. Anyway i agree we need some more attacking threat in midfield but also agree that we are not set up to play like that. But I always thought we play three forwards because we DON'T have the attacking talent in midfield and not the other way round. So maybe Lambert would play differently if he felt we had the talent available. I also think Delph has goals in him.

Diary of Anne frank=diary of kiyouate Hiding from the nazi owners

So Dempsey going to mls for 6mi, and he's 30 and well past it, yet we can't get the same for Bent? **** really????

I doubt he'll walk into the team straight away - but once he gets his chance he won't ever be dislodged

he still has a lot to prove but he has shown plenty of promise between the **** ups. I still think he'd be better in midfield.

Our attack is capable of being top 6-8 quality with Benteke, Weimann, Gabby and Helenius all fit. Our midfield is probably mid table standard. So many unknowns.............. will Tonev play will he and Bacuna be any good, will Gardener or Albrighton emerge again, will KEA come good? Will Delph and Sylla get even better? Will Westwood be as consistent? Last season our defence was league two level for over half the season and maybe championship level when we finished. It definitely improved with Baker and Vlaar in the centre but we still conceded every game. Okore, Luna look like good signings but it may take a while before they actually start improving our goals conceded. I am more optimistic about our ability to score goals, but not convinced much will change defensively, so a 10th-14th finished at best if we don't start defending set pieces.

The issue is more down to Con's one man PR crusade to convince us all Bannan is a quality midfielder. I think Bannan has had a fair few chances and a few times been ok, maybe even good, but mostly been very average. When he did play his set piece taking was abysmal and contributed to the reason we never scored from corners. His passing and technical ability are decent and his passion and commitment never in question, so I don't think he deserves hatred or bile. He deserves respectful sterile indifference and not a thread of 387 pages. He may well go down a division and prove us all wrong by doing well and get a transfer back to the Premiership, but for now..................

The Telegraph are reporting that Newcastle told his agent that they will only pay 2mil and not match his wage demands. WTF???? 2mil really? A) are the telegraph spouting garbage? are Newcastle on crack? I honestly wish we'd keep bent and tell the Geordies and Cottagers to **** right off. Why suddenly do the press think we're a bargain basement full of players we will give away. Bent is a proven England goal scorer, he may not fit with Lamberts plans but there are still few proven goal scorers out there much better, wages or not.

Don't think so as it was on the players own account. But as for my post above, he was just used as an example because he is the last defender we've been linked with. Fair enough, hope it is true. It would make sense for Lambert to have sounded a few players/clubs/agents out - for when we do move some players on. I can see at least two more signings on the horizon, although I have no factual basis for this, just a feeling.

I thought the Capuano thing was Twitter bollocks?

I used to think that too. Remember Wigan at home last season? Ireland was a disgrace that day. I had tried to block that game from my memory. Dear god that was a low point in a few weeks of low points. Everyone was a disgrace at Wigan and at Bradford, Ireland has never been any worse than anyone else. Not saying I want him to stay just bored of him and Bent being the Pantomine villains.

him leaving will be worth it just to shut this thread down and for Con to finally be able to enjoy life.

Yup

Last season we scored 47 goals which was about the middle range of goals scored We scored 37 goals 2011-12 season, the lowest was Stoke with 36!!!!!!!!! We scored 48 the season before that So yes I agree we need more midfielders to score goals! It didn't help that we almost never scored from set pieces, which is probably why we can't defend them!

I agree but in a sense this is why Lambert plays with three strikers, I think we actually scored more goals in total last season than we have done in a long time (anyone got stats on that?) But it would be nice to have the kind of attacking flair in the middle of the park that we could actually change our playing system, I don't think we could play an AM behind three forwards though. As much as i have faith in Lambert, I still wish to good he would sign some more experienced defensive cover. I don't buy that after getting turned over for most of the season our defence is going to miraculously shape up, even with Luna and Okore in the mix.