CannockVillan

This is it exactly. Great start, no doubt, but let's not get carried away because a couple of losses playing the exact same way people are lauding right now will turn into Lambert out abuse because we aren't making enough chances. I'd like us to be measured here. We can see the improvement and we all want it to continue. Just like this start doesn't mean we're awesome, losing a few on the trot won't make us awful. We are what we are and that's one of the better teams in the group of "the rest", capable of a finish anywhere between 15th and 9th. Just like we were before a ball was kicked this season Feck sake! Lighten up please. We know we aren't going to finish where we are. So enjoy the party while you can. BKK- I think its more to do with the fact that if we had lost all four everyone would be on Lambert's back at once, no one would be shouting FFS lads we all know we aren't really that bad and this crap run won't go on forever so stop being so bleak and negative. Had someone come on and said that last season they'd have been (and probably were) lambasted. There's room for all views here including cautious one's. i doubt anyone was prophetic enough to foresee this start and indeed it's a start to enjoy, but to enjoy with cautious optimism. It's still only 10 points towards safety in my view. The good thing is we have beaten (or at least not lost to) those teams who we expect to have around us come the end of the season. Taken a great 3 points at Anfield (even if the performance was a bit "backs to the walls"). The major positive point for me is in 4 games we have never really looked like we were panicking in defence. Particularly against Stoke, I thought they were never going to score if they played for another 90 minutes. I would still like to see us on the front foot a lot more though and retain possession so we don't invite the onslaught as much as we do. Newcastle just got shown their ar5e by Southampton but we still conceded lots of possession and territory in the second half to them. Still a lot of room for improvement. Even without Benteke we should be able to hang onto the ball better than we do. Anyway sorry but that was all off topic (just realised) so..... Anyone seen Randy Lerner or his chequebook recently?

If he had already accepted then I suspect it would already have been a permanent deal that was wiating to be rubber stamped (we'd been in talks with him long enough). My view (for what it's worth) is that we haven't agreed things with Cleverley as he is keeping his options open, hence it was a loan deal with us agreeing a transfer fee wit Man U now if we managed to make it permanent in Jan. Cleverley would be nuts to agree terms with anyone in January unless they are negotiating on the basis he is a free agent (whic his what he will be 4 or 5 months later). If that's the case we should negotiate on that basis with him and tie him in after his contract. of course we then run the risk of being gazumped but if you were Cleverely would you negotiate your next 4 years' worth of wages on the basis of a club paying a 7-8m fee or would you think, hang on i'll wait 4 months and negotiate with no fee required, higher wages and a nice (not so) little signing on fee. Everyone's a winner but ManU. The only way it doesn't work for Cleverley is if he is shocking for the next 6 months and no one wants him. You show me a footballer who believes in himself that little and i'll show you a footballer now working on a building site. They all rate themselves to do well, it's in their DNA. Add to that the fact that if he doesn't want to agree a move anywhere in january i doubt Man U will want him back (just to pay his last 4-5 months wages - unless its pure spite) so he'd likely be here for the season which means he plays a full season and isn't out of the spotlight for potential suitors. Even if he was recalled he only has 4 months to the end of the season. Hardly gonna get many splinters or Cleverley - Win/Win Villa - potential Win/Win ManU - Lose

i'd be surprised if he started too. He looked busy and eager for the ball against an average Norway team but this is Switzerland, an entirely different prospect. if it were me i'd put Sterling and Wilshere/Ox behind Rooney and play a 3 man midfield relying on the full back to get forward to provide the width. Central 3 out of Henderson (if fit) / Delph / Milner / Wilshere /Ox depending on who gets the nod for the advanced role. Hart Stones Jones Cahill Baines Milner Henderson Ox/Delph Sterling Wilshere Rooney Let's go out and try an cause some problems for them. That's all we ask.

I think the question is whether we have agreed terms with Cleverley and i would imagine the answer to that is no. We'd already agreed a fee with Utd. Kinda makes the option not worth the paper...etc That said we have him until atleast january and if no one comes in for him in Jan then Utd won't trigger the recall clause. If someone does and we don't agree terms with Cleverley he may then be off in January otherwise he'll wait out his contract and see what's on the table then. It makes no sense for him to agree terms with us now. On a free trasnfer someone will pick him up and pay him well.

Think there will be an option that if he wants to join us that we pay a fee of 7million in Jan. Hence why United did the deal. No doubt that's the case but that is between us and ManU. it wil be down to what Cleverley wants by that time, not us and ManU

I would imagine a loan for 6 months would benefit Cleverly because: 1. we get a decent player for a large part of the season; 2. Cleverly still has all options in place come january(particularly if he plays really well); The biggest loser is ManU (albeit they are mitigating that as best they can) as they probably now won't get anything other than a small loan fee and him off their books for the rest of the season. I say the rest of the season because come January Cleverly can sign a pre-contract with any club and it might therefore be useful for him to be able to be loaned out to that club for the final few months of the season or sign for them for a relatively small/ nominal fee. I'd be surprised if there was an option to buy as I doubt we could afford the wages Celverly would want on a free! He could even bench warm for 4 months to May quite easily if he had to go back ot Man U having had a decent stint at us. People wont forget him. Desparation also strikes in January where people pay silly money. Seems to suit all parties to a degree but i suspect that it suggests he may not be looking at us as a long term prospect. Perhaps ManU are delaing with us and not Everton on a loan deal because Everton caused the problems in the first place and they took umbridge with that whereas we dealt with them openly and honestly as we always seem to do regarding transfers.

glad your happy we spent 7 million. We will struggle again. We needed a few more to push on. Ah well. It is what it is. We are where we are KSV. All things considered its been pretty good business given the restraints Lambert has been under.

Hardly disappointing. We did our business early. DD is always a bit of a lottery. At least we stopped ourslelf from being stiffed by cleverly's agent.

Same as every team, tv money. Plus they are in europe. We unfortunatley are in a situation where we have an owner unwilling to properly invest in the team. They're not in Europe tho. Not any more. [emoji25] Someone got in before me!

I don't get this view he only has 7 years left to earn money and hats it. At 32 or 33 I think he's got a fair few years of earning left in him, just not as a footballer (like the rest of us). He can get another job. He's hardly going to be on the breadline unless he pisses his football wages and image rights earnings up the wall.

He's taking the piss.... Falcao We'd end up with Tino Asprilla.

There's a shock Well if it's breaking news we'd all better start having an opinion on it

They continue to get good attendances becasue there isn't another bloody football clube for miles around other than Sunderland. its a 2 team region whcih spans all the bloody way up to Scotland and a fiar few miles west no doubt. Get them competing with the like of Wolves, Blues, Baggies, Stoke and see how they get on. they have a northeast monopoly which will enver be broken. Hardly the same.

I don't get this view of only laoning people we can have an option to buy on. Why can't or shouldn't we loan someone who will help us for 12 months even if they do then go back to their parent club. Loan deals are generally one of three types. 1. a young player whose club want to let him get some experience before they decide what to do; or 2. an established player whose club can't sell them on for any reason (wages age etc.). 3. Surplus to requirements because of other purchases made by the parent club (i.e a lot of the Spurs squad). We have had a lot of the second type here that we couldn't shift over the last few years but the point is if they can improve us, even just for 12 months, then so what if they end up going back. Beggars can't be choosers and let's face it we can't even afford what a beggar can at the moment it would seem.

In fairness to him that was a ball he had to wait for to come down by which time siem de jong nipped it off his toes. Happens.

I seriously doubt it. More like we could only get a loan deal for him.

It's a bit early for too much positivity. As many have said we had a decent start last season. Even in some of the games we eventually lost early doors we were unlucky. That said, I felt that last weekend Stoke were never going to score, even when bringing on the big man and trying to long ball it into the back of the net. Not felt like that for quite some time. It will be interesting how we play at home against a decent Newcastle side. We still need to create more clear cut chances for our strikers though.

Coupling is great. The Welsh guy - hilarious. Season's 1-3 the best.

Well if he doesn't go and isn't signed up to a new contract with us by November then i think it's fair to say he's off next summer without a doubt. He'll be talking to anyone and everyone come January and if he has a good season here then he'll easily get a move to a much bigger club. Can't blame him or the club for not selling given the fee we paid for him it's not like its a massive loss in those terms (although you do have to wonder why there was no move earlier to tie him up to a longer term deal as it was crystal clear he is the lynchpin in our defense) . Anything less than a huge bid of £10m wouldn't make it worth our while given the problems we could have defensively if he went and the lack of time to find a replacement. Perhaps we are worried about his injury record and with him getting older that will only likely get worse. Atleast if we refuse to sell then it gives us plenty of time to find and bed in a suitable replacement next summer.

I wonder whether now the financial guy has come in, done his work, put the club on a more solid financial footing, that its now time to look at someone who is generally a bit more savvy in terms of footballing matters. Having said that i don't know what Fox's specific duties were at Arsenal so I'm not really convincing myself there though but just a thought. As other have done, I do wonder why someone who was in a fairly high profile position at Arsenal would come to a club in turmoil and in the throes of a potential sale making his move potentially short term! is there somethign we don't know in terms of a sale? Even if we were being taken off the market in terms of actively seeking a buyer, I assume RL would still leave himself open to offers that come in and so even that would potentially leave Fox exposed if a buyer did come calling any time soon. Could it be money talking, the prestige of the CEO position (for however long) or are things happening in the background that we just don't know about yet?

I kind of hoped that people would stop believing these rumors on their own without me having to dismiss them every time As far as I'm aware we aren't sold but this is a transfer speculation thread so lets get back to Deeney the nose shall we. Trent, I though that was a very weird post from you. Not your usual self. Without wanting to start any speculation it was almost a "not telling the whole story" type of post followed by a "let's not talk about it" post. Is there something you are not telling us perhaps?

It was Tim Vickery talking about him on Talksport. He's the guy who lives in South America (brazil) who was on the BBC during the world cup. Said he'd be a good buy. Also said he wont cross the half way line but would quietly go about his job. Fine by me

Any idea what the issue is with the proposed contract Daz?

Swansea want rid and he knows it. Unless he has interest elsewhere it may still happen unless he's happy to wait for a bosman.

If he stays he stays if he goes he goes (but it has to be worth it financially for us or there's no point we may as well keep him). Either way Villa live on and will replace him.