Aston Villa Women

[Xela]

Seems to be a bit of a weak mentality there at the moment, which is a shame. 

[foreveryoung]

36 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

We'll pick up points soon enough.

It's still a big stretch to see this side being consistent enough to finish ahead any of the Manchester clubs or Chelsea or Arsenal so I'd be more than happy being best of the rest again and then look next summer.

Happened 3 or 4 times now losing 2 goals in last 5 minutes, not good enough tactically for me.

[useless]

There are a lot of really ignorant comments, firstly we don't normally play defensively against the top four, hence the results and goals against them last season, so that idea is completely false, today was unique circumstances, we just lost our first two games, so were obviously just trying to do what we could to end that sequence, and also we were without two of not only our best players, but two of the best players in the whole of the league last season, Dali and Hanson, and others have had illnesses, probably why certain players were left on the bench and didn't come on until late on, in other words to a large extent we would have been forced into the team and shape we played.

Also I think people losing sight of how good the top four are in general, if you said to me at the start of the season we would lose the Arsenal and Man Utd games 2-1, I wouldn't have been that bothered, as those teams capable of inflicting much worse damage, and will to many over the course of the season, both will be challenging for the title, we will be nowhere near to that, that we're running them close in games is a sign of how far we've come, the bigger disappontment is the Liverpool result and performance.

As for Carla Ward losing her job there's no chance whatsoever of that, you can worry more about one of the top four coming in for her if they make a change than her losing her job, if we did sack her, we would be the laughing stock of women's football, if Sarina was to leave England she would be one of the favorites for that job.

[useless]

Also maybe people will appreciate Dali more now, I never got the sense it was fully appreciated just how good she was last season, she ran many games, and was just as good and influential as Daly, Daly wouldn't have been anywhere near as good as she was without Dali, nor Hanson for that matter.

[foreveryoung]

5 minutes ago, useless said:

There are a lot of really ignorant comments, firstly we don't normally play defensively against the top four, hence the results and goals against them last season, so that idea is completely false, today was unique circumstances, we just lost our first two games, so were obviously just trying to do what we could to end that sequence, and also we were without two of not only our best players, but two of the best players in the whole of the league last season, Dali and Hanson, and others have had illnesses, probably why certain players were left on the bench and didn't come on until late on, in other words to a large extent we would have been forced into the team and shape we played.

Also I think people losing sight of how good the top four are in general, if you said to me at the start of the season we would lose the Arsenal and Man Utd games 2-1, I wouldn't have been that bothered, as those teams capable of inflicting much worse damage, and will to many over the course of the season, both will be challenging for the title, we will be nowhere near to that, that we're running them close in games is a sign of how far we've come, the bigger disappontment is the Liverpool result and performance.

As for Carla Ward losing her job there's no chance whatsoever of that, you can worry more about one of the top four coming in for her if they make a change than her losing her job, if we did sack her, we would be the laughing stock of women's football, if Sarina was to leave England she would be one of the favorites for that job.

I don't agree, Carla's tactics have lost us many games by thinking she can shut up shop for 70 minutes. The issue was not that those teams are better, I've no doubt they are, the issue was losing 2 goals in extra time by the manager not being tactically aware, not the first time either. 

As for her being the next England manager, probably be one of the favorites like Southgate, then yes I agree.

[useless]

In better result news our U21s beat Burton Albion's first team 6-0 today in the Birmingham Challenge Cup, I think Burton are a tier four side, shows the difference in quality between the different leagues in women's football, especially as our U21 team in reality is more of an U18 team.

[Villanbee]

34 minutes ago, useless said:

There are a lot of really ignorant comments, firstly we don't normally play defensively against the top four, hence the results and goals against them last season, so that idea is completely false, today was unique circumstances, we just lost our first two games, so were obviously just trying to do what we could to end that sequence, and also we were without two of not only our best players, but two of the best players in the whole of the league last season, Dali and Hanson, and others have had illnesses, probably why certain players were left on the bench and didn't come on until late on, in other words to a large extent we would have been forced into the team and shape we played.

Also I think people losing sight of how good the top four are in general, if you said to me at the start of the season we would lose the Arsenal and Man Utd games 2-1, I wouldn't have been that bothered, as those teams capable of inflicting much worse damage, and will to many over the course of the season, both will be challenging for the title, we will be nowhere near to that, that we're running them close in games is a sign of how far we've come, the bigger disappontment is the Liverpool result and performance.

As for Carla Ward losing her job there's no chance whatsoever of that, you can worry more about one of the top four coming in for her if they make a change than her losing her job, if we did sack her, we would be the laughing stock of women's football, if Sarina was to leave England she would be one of the favorites for that job.

I think calling people out as ignorant is disrespectful. The tactics in the second half today, whether by accident or design, were awful. To continue to shut up shop, coming under that amount of pressure, was always going to end in tears. It wasn't as if there weren't enough warnings earlier in the half. We were lucky to be still at 1:0 at 90 minutes. If, with the players we now have, we are incapable of retaining the ball higher up the pitch, something is very wrong.

We beat Arsenal 2:0 at their place a few months ago without Dali. We did have Hanson, but were without Patten, Nobbs and the wealth of options that were on the bench today. So why the negative approach in the second half when it was clear that we were riding our luck?

On paper, losing 2-1 against Man U and Arsenal doesn't look too bad. But, in reality, losing both games in injury time (as we also did last season against Man Utd) is poor.

We need to stop seeing ourselves as plucky underdogs. It's akin to the Gerrard 'Chelsea should be coming to Villa park and wiping the floor with us' mentality.  Last season, we beat 3 of the top 4 at some stage (albeit Man U was a cup game) so absolutely we should be going into these games with high expectations. That's year on year progression. We have a team stacked with international level players now.

 

[useless]

A lot of the comments have been ignorant and I was going to say worse than that, many only seem to bother post anything at all when something bad happens such as conceding late goals

Every team shuts up shop against the top four, and more so away to Arsenal, even other top four sides including Chelsea would have shut up shop away to Arsenal if in the lead, I think people need to be realistic on that.

Just because we beat Arsenal 2-0 away last season a few months ago doesn't mean we're no less comfortably second favorites now, when we beat them at the end of last season they had nothing to play for, before today they had had a difficult start themselves, so were always going to be particularly fired up.

Man United and Arsenal are capable of scoring goals in quick succession against any team at any time, and both will in fact do the same to other teams like they do every season, plus we were down to ten players against Man Utd.

We got a few results against top four last season but we're still underdogs when we play them, just like the mens team might get a few results over a season against top four but will still be second favorites when they play top four teams again, and it's even more so for the women's team, that's just the way it is, doesn't mean we can't get the odd result over the course of the season, but when we do that will still be considered a surprise result, last season we had our best season ever, but Arsenal finished ten points ahead of us and had a poor season by their standards, Man United finished nineteen points ahead of us.

If we can beat Spurs, which won't be easy as they've had a good start, but if we can then I wouldn't put it past us to sneak a result against Chelsea, as pressure will be off and we will have a few players back, and it's not as if we haven't come close in our two games against top four this season, people talking as if we've been thrashed by them, worth remembering that we played Arsenal and Man Utd just before the winter break and they put four and five past us, so it's not as if we were brilliant all the time against top four last season and this season we've suddenly turned to rubbish, last season it was mixed, and it will probably be so again this season.

[smg]

Was at a few games last year and two so far this year one thing that is very clear is the positive vibe amongst the supporters. It is very refreshing to watch games and not hear constant moaning when players / managers are deemed to have made mistakes. It is a shame that this cannot be transferred to villatalk where  now after 3 close defeats to top level teams the same negative comments are being rolled out that you find in the men’s  match day threads. The players today were definitely up against it but ran themselves to a standstill trying to defend the goal they scored against the run of play.. Lots of disappointment at the end but no moaning in the stands.

[foreveryoung]

5 minutes ago, useless said:

A lot of the comments have been ignorant and I was going to say worse than that, many only seem to bother post anything at all when something bad happens such as conceding late goals

Every team shuts up shop against the top four, and more so away to Arsenal, even other top four sides including Chelsea would have shut up shop away to Arsenal if in the lead, I think people need to be realistic on that.

Just because we beat Arsenal 2-0 away last season a few months ago doesn't mean we're no less comfortably second favorites now, when we beat them at the end of last season they had nothing to play for, before today they had had a difficult start themselves, so were always going to be particularly fired up.

Man United and Arsenal are capable of scoring goals in quick succession against any team at any time, and both will in fact do the same to other teams like they do every season, plus we were down to ten players against Man Utd.

We got a few results against top four last season but we're still underdogs when we play them, just like the mens team might get a few results over a season against top four but will still be second favorites when they play top four teams again, and it's even more so for the women's team, that's just the way it is, doesn't mean we can't get the odd result over the course of the season, but when we do that will still be considered a surprise result, last season we had our best season ever, but Arsenal finished ten points ahead of us and had a poor season by their standards, Man United finished nineteen points ahead of us.

If we can beat Spurs, which won't be easy as they've had a good start, but if we can then I wouldn't put it past us to sneak a result against Chelsea, as pressure will be off and we will have a few players back, and it's not as if we haven't come close in our two games against top four this season, people talking as if we've been thrashed by them, worth remembering that we played Arsenal and Man Utd just before the winter break and they put four and five past us, so it's not as if we were brilliant all the time against top four last season and this season we've suddenly turned to rubbish, last season it was mixed, and it will probably be so again this season.

That's your opinion, just because others don't agree with you, doesn't mean we are ignorant.

If it's not tactical from the manager, like someone has said, it's the mentality, which shockingly enough also has to be installed from manager. 

[useless]

In three of our league games against Liverpool, Man Utd, and Arsenal last season we conceded twelve goals, point being we had our best ever season last season and were still susceptible to bad results even then, worse ones than we've had so far this season and against the same teams, and as I said the other day I remember there being a panic when we lost two games in a row to Everton and West Ham early last season.

I think we will be fine and am still expecting us to challenge for fifth place, outside the top four there are no standout teams, the other non top four teams near the top of the table are only there because they've played Bristol City, once fixtures even themselve out a little we will climb up the table, after Chelsea when the fixtures become kinder I can see us going on a run of good form

 

[Villanbee]

I don't think challenging for fifth is good enough. This season there needs to be a challenge for top four and certainly a closing of that ten point gap.

Some of that may happen naturally as the other teams have strengthened and are bound to take points off them (as Liverpool did to Arsenal and Leicester did to Man Utd). But we certainly can't have other teams below us jumping us. That's not the progression we are looking for or, I suspect, the project the new players have signed up for. But, looking at results so far, not just from Villa but from other teams, I think it's a distinct possibility.

This idea that the top four are untouchable needs to be put to bed. That approach, together with top-level coaching, has seen the likes of Villa and Brighton challenge the status quo in the Premier League and the same mentality needs to be applied to the Villa women's team who, in terms of squad depth, are miles more advanced than this time last year.

As you say, it's early days, but 0 points from 3 games, conceding so many late goals is disappointing no matter how it's dressed up.

For what it's worth, today I think we got the first half spot on, but were devoid of ideas in the second. Something needed to change as Arsenal should have been level well before 90 minutes. You can only push your luck for so long.

[MattVillaPortsmouth]

1 hour ago, smg said:

Was at a few games last year and two so far this year one thing that is very clear is the positive vibe amongst the supporters. It is very refreshing to watch games and not hear constant moaning when players / managers are deemed to have made mistakes. It is a shame that this cannot be transferred to villatalk where  now after 3 close defeats to top level teams the same negative comments are being rolled out that you find in the men’s  match day threads. The players today were definitely up against it but ran themselves to a standstill trying to defend the goal they scored against the run of play.. Lots of disappointment at the end but no moaning in the stands.

There’s no denying they were trying, and it was nice to a number of them spent a lot of time with supporters at the end, Lucy Parker, Salmon and I think it was Leon in particular.

Back to the game, the feeling at the ground was it was inevitable once they had one they would get two. Yes the players had heart, put themselves on the line but unfortunately skill/technique just wasn’t there, we were very very poor with the ball when we had it - yes arsenal are a top 4 team, but they are/were today far from being the arsenal of old and themselves have been poor so far.   We gave the ball away cheaply, Rachel Daly cut a very isolated figure, often gestering to teams mate (not sure if was frustration or a little more).

The injury time, is now the norm - but most I thought was justified, Rach Daly amd Corsie were down for fair chunks of time, plus dVD and Mas, in addition to subs 10-12mins was (in the way it’s managed these days about right)

A lot of last season was momentum, we need to get that win in the next few games - the season is short enough in games as it is.

Plus from today was Olivia MacCoughlin getting some minutes.

Just because someone’s opinion is different doesn’t make it ignorant

 

Edited October 15, 2023 by MattVillaPortsmouth

[useless]

Can understand us being cautious against Man Utd and Arsenal, given level of oppostion, injuries, suspensions, and illnesses

But against Spurs would like to see us go back to as close as possible to how we lined up last season, typical team was

Hampton, Mayling, Patten, Turner, Pacheco, Staniforth, Nobbs, Dali, Hanson, Lehmann, and Daly

That's a back four, one holding midfielder, two attacking midfielders, and a front three, which was ultra attacking, especially when you consider that Pacheco and Mayling played almost like wingbacks, and Staniforth isn't exactly a traditional DM, but it yielded us a lot of good results, obviously we can't replicate it exactly because of Hanson and Dali being out, but we can play the same shape and have Blindkile replace Dali, and one of Leon or Salmon replace Hanson

 

 

 

 

[smg]

1 hour ago, Villanbee said:

Something needed to change as Arsenal should have been level well before 90 minutes. 

But they weren’t because of the resilience and determination of the team in front of them.

[smg]

1 hour ago, MattVillaPortsmouth said:

There’s no denying they were trying, and it was nice to a number of them spent a lot of time with supporters at the end, Lucy Parker, Salmon and I think it was Leon in particular.

Back to the game, the feeling at the ground was it was inevitable once they had one they would get two. Yes the players had heart, put themselves on the line but unfortunately skill/technique just wasn’t there, we were very very poor with the ball when we had it - yes arsenal are a top 4 team, but they are/were today far from being the arsenal of old and themselves have been poor so far.   We gave the ball away cheaply, Rachel Daly cut a very isolated figure, often gestering to teams mate (not sure if was frustration or a little more).

The injury time, is now the norm - but most I thought was justified, Rach Daly amd Corsie were down for fair chunks of time, plus dVD and Mas, in addition to subs 10-12mins was (in the way it’s managed these days about right)

A lot of last season was momentum, we need to get that win in the next few games - the season is short enough in games as it is.

Plus from today was Olivia MacCoughlin getting some minutes.

Just because someone’s opinion is different doesn’t make it ignorant

 

I agree with a lot of what you say and was at the ground. I’m not sure about Rachel, I think she could offer a bit more the arms have been waving since game one, yes she is isolated but midfield players under the cosh need a moving target that doesn’t happen often in my opinion.

By the way I have never mentioned ignorant that was another poster.

[useless]

It's heartbreaking to lose the points in that manner, but don't worry we will get going soon enough

[useless]

Official site promoted the fact we had this game but have provied no report after the fact, hopefully the do so as would be interesting to see who played, or at least who scored

[useless]

It was only a consolation goal but Freya Gregory scored again on loan at Reading yesterday, that's two goals and an assist in four games for her in the Championship now, she's too good for that division, but after her injuries the run of games will do her good, similar to McLoughlin last season.

I notice two of our other academy products also doing well in the Championship, three goals and an assist in seven appearances for Mary McAteer, and four goals and one assist in six appearances for Isobel Goodwin, both did well in a struggling Coventry United team last season as well, Goodwin was one of our most highly rated youngsters, in the same category as Gregory, Blindkilde, and McLoughlin, but then missed two years through injury, she's still only twenty now, I actually wouldn't be surprised if she ended up back with us one day, still close with the players, was with our squad last week on day out.

[useless]

Chelsea isn't a write-off, we've just come close against two of the best teams in the division, we only lost narrowly against them, against Man Utd - remember the team that finished nineteen points above us last season, and beat us by five goals just before Christmas - we played a chunk of the game with ten women, we also gave Chelsea a very good game in the FA Cup semi-final, I think even Emma Hayes admitted we were the better team in that game, just unusually for us we couldn't score, people talking as if it's like two season back when we were regularly getting thrashed by the 'big four', we took a few heavy beatings last season too, but also showed we can compete, beating Man CIty twice, and also Man Utd and Arsenal, as well as getting some decent draws.

It's one of those games where they're capable of winning comfortably, but also we're capable of getting a result, I think a lot will depend on how we get on against Spurs, if we can win that, will get us some confidence back, and then with Dali and Hanson back after the international break, that will give us an outside chance against Chelsea.

I think it's time to stop thinking in terms of the difficult first five games now, and to look forward to the next five, Spurs (h), Chelsea (h), Bristol City (a), West Ham (a), Everton (h), lets see if we can get a decent haul from those, confidence has taken a hit, so like I say getting it back with a decent result against Spurs is going to be key, if we can do that, I think we can get ten or more points from the next five.