Cizzler

In all seriousness GK: Hart, (ideally)Foster, Fraser Forster RB: Walker, Richards LB: Cole, Baines CB: Lescott, Ferdinand, Cahill, Jones, Smalling RM: Lennon, Oxlade-Chamberlain LM: Young, Johnson? CM: Carrick, Gerrard, Lampard, Milner, Scholes ST: Rooney, Bent, Carroll, Sturridge, Welbeck

Hmmm :? Perhaps a revert back to the good ol' fashioned 4-4-2 then. GK: Charles Hart RB: Tony Hibbert LB: Ashley Cole CB: Joleon Lescott CB: Mike Williamson RM: Ryan Shotton (utilise the long throw) LM: Ashley Young CM: Leon Britton CM: Danny Murphy ST: Adam Lallana ST: Ricky Lambert Lescott and Williamson are both coming off the back of fantastic seasons. Williamson would dominate airily, whilst Lescott could sweep with his pace. Hibbert and Cole have been two of the most consistent full backs in Premiership history. Then the midfield. Britton's ball retention rate is comparable to Europe's elite. Murphy provides the more experienced head and has the bonus of knowing Hosgson very well. Both can keep the ball. We all know what Young is capable of at his best and Shotton provides both pace and a danger with his throw. Lallana and Lambert have taken the Championship by storm this season.

GK: Hart CB: Lescott CB: Terry CB: Ferdinand RM:Lennon/ Walcott LM: Dyer CM: K.Henry CM: Cattermole ST: Holt AM: Rooney (Osman to play when Rooney is suspended) ST: Carroll Inspired by Wigan's 4-3-3. Terry organises the back three a la Caldwell. Sheer pace out wide. Centre mids to intimidate those horrible foreigners and win the ball back and give it to a deep-lying Rooney (if he's playing or out wide). Whip in the crosses and let the big men nod it in the back post. No Stevie/ Lampard nonsense.

You'd rather have the player who can't get on the bench in the Championship than the two Premiership first-teamers. Why? Have I just completely misunderstood the 'who would you have back?' question?! It's not really 'having them back' if we're moving the era they're playing for the club in, is it.

From all the strikers you could have chosen, how have you ended up with Crouch and Maloney??? and to top it off carlton cole on the bench?? Humour me then and let me know which players you think used to play for us and are currently (as I stipulated at the top of the eleven) better than Crouch and Maloney. Obviously these two didn't set the world alight here. But the likes of Carew and JPA are currently not playing as well as the two I picked. My point was to see if we had let go eleven players who would right now have improved our league position. I think we have.

His cousin is the Senegalese international Ibrahima Sonko, so we'll let you off...... just about :winkold: Edit: Just checked and Sonko's only had 4 caps for Senegal! Forgiveness withdrawn.

hasnt really deserve a spot in fairness. St.Ledger and o'Dea were very good in qualifying games and McShame has been around squad for years Not saying he deserves a spot. Just an interesting neutral opinion on one of our 'promising youngsters'. O'Dea has been **** awful for Leeds this season though. They really hate him up there. I know McShane's been around for ages. But he's still awful? You'd think if Trap rated Clark at all he'd have at least made the standby list.

Holy shit. That's a mess. Decipher it at your own pleasure.

Few training squads being announced, so thought I'd revive the thread! Ireland: Given, Westwood, Forde. Dunne, O'Shea, St.Ledger, O'Dea, Ward, Kelly, Foley. Whelan, Gibson, Andrews, Fahey. Duff, McGeady, McClean, Hunt. Keane, Doyle, Long, Cox, Walters. Standby: Randolph, McShane, Green, Coleman, Keogh. Note that Clark hasn't made the squad ahead of St.Ledger or O'Dea, or even the standby list ahead of McShane! Germany's 27 man squad... Manuel Neuer (Bayern Munich), Tim Wiese (Werder Bremen), Ron Robert Zieler (Hannover), Marc-André ter Stegen (Borussia Mönchengladbach); Holger Badstuber, Jérôme Boateng, Philipp Lahm (all Bayern Munich), Benedikt Höwedes (Schalke), Mats Hummels, Marcel Schmelzer (both Borussia Dortmund), Per Mertesacker (Arsenal); Sven Bender, Mario Götze, Ilkay Gundogan (all Borussia Dortmund), Lars Bender, Andre Schürrle (both Bayer Leverkusen), Julian Draxler (Schalke), Toni Kroos, Thomas Müller, Bastian Schweinsteiger (all Bayern Munich), Sami Khedira, Mesut Ozil (both Real Madrid), Marco Reus (Borussia Monchengladbach); Lukas Podolski (Cologne), Cacau (Stuttgart), Mario Gomez (Bayern Munich), Miroslav Klose (Lazio). Holland have named a 36 man training squad! Maarten Stekelenburg (Roma), Tim Krul (Newcastle United), Michel Vorm (Swansea City), Erwin Mulder (Feyenoord), Jasper Cillissen (Ajax); Vurnon Anita (Ajax), Khalid Boulahrouz (VfB Stuttgart), Wilfred Bouma (PSV), Urby Emanuelson (Milan), John Heitinga (Everton), Hedwiges Maduro (Valencia) Joris Mathijsen (Malaga), Erik Pieters (PSV), Nick Viergever (AZ), Ron Vlaar (Feyenoord), Stefan de Vrij (Feyenoord), Gregory van der Wiel (Ajax), Jetro Willems (PSV); Ibrahim Afellay (Barcelona), Mark van Bommel (Milan), Nigel de Jong (Manchester City), Adam Maher (AZ), Stijn Schaars (Sporting), Wesley Sneijder (Internazionale), Kevin Strootman (PSV), Rafael van der Vaart (Tottenham Hotspur), Georginio Wijnaldum (PSV); Klaas-Jan Huntelaar (Schalke), Ola John, Luuk de Jong (both Twente), Siem de Jong (Ajax), Dirk Kuyt (Liverpool), Jeremain Lens (PSV), Luciano Narsingh (Heerenveen), Robin van Persie (Arsenal), Arjen Robben (Bayern Munich).

Can't even keep the ball against 10 men. Embarrassing. Why bring Collins on for ****'s sake? Drop Herd/Warnock back to fullback. Try and keep the **** thing! We'll lose this.

Could we create a decent team out of currently playing ex-players? -------------------------------------------Freidel-------------------------------------------------- Walker---------------------Cahill----------------------Mellberg---------------------------L.Young Young---------------------Barry-----------------------Milner----------------------------Downing -------------------------------Crouch----------------Maloney----------------------------------- Subs: Sorensen, Hughes, Knight, Reo-Coker, Sidwell, Routledge, Carlton Cole? Meh. Bench is weak. But I think that team beats our current mess.

Why do you think Rodgers did a poor job at Watford? Watford are hardly one of the power-houses of the Championship and he finished mid-table. Admittedly he had a shakey start - but he must have been doing something right for Reading to poach him in the first place. Additionally, Lambert quite clearly failed in his first job at Livingstone as he resigned after 5 wins in 32 games. For what it's worth, I think either would be a marked improvement on the dross we have seen this season. I also echo the respect for Martinez. Although I do think Martinez and Rodgers would find instant success harder, which is why Lambert is a slight preference. Moreover, those who are criticising Coyle via Lambert's record in the lower leagues would do well to note that Coyle made a half-decent effort of things at little old Burnley.

Carragher has made 18 appearances? I think that's plenty to judge a player on. He has been an absolute liability when he's played this season as well (even more so than usual!). Surprised you think Evra has been worse. I know he had a rocky spell during United's mid-season blip - but I think he's played some decent stuff in their recent run. I know Gabby has been awful recently too, but Sammon has made 23 appearances and hasn't scored. At least Gabby had the decency to start the season well. I'll accept O'Hara to keep you happy.

------------------------------Doni------------------------------------------ Hutton------------Savic--------------Stearman------------Carragher -----------Adam---------------Derry----------Albrighton---------------- -----------Sammon---------Carroll--------Torres---------------------- A bit of a mix of bad players (Derry and Sammon), players desperately out of form (Torres, Carroll, maybe Marc?) and the stupid (Doni. Causing your third choice keeper to play the FA Cup semi with a totally avoidable red card is reason enough).

------------------------------Szczesny------------------------------------- Hibbert---------Richards-------------------Terry----------------Gibbs -------------Joe Allen------Scholes-----Osman---------------------------- Hoillet-----------------------Welbeck-------------------------Agbonlahor Scholes again . Think I've taken liberty with the 'don't have to be promoted this season rule'. If I was required to bring down the average age I guess I could substitute Hibbert, Terry and Scholes for Shotton, Hanley and Herd.

Fair enough. I agree with the notion. To be honest I thought Scholes had played a bit more than he actually has (only 931 minutes) and I thought Yaya had missed more with ACON etc (but he's played 2425 minutes).

3 outstanding strikers means 3-4-3. Evra/Richards and Baines are worthy mentions though. ----------------------------Hart----------------------------------- -----------Kompany---Koscielny----Evans--------------------- Valencia--------Silva-----------Scholes-----Dempsey--------- -------------Aguero------Rooney-----Van Persie--------------- Evans and Scholes are the two probably most open to ridicule. But I honestly believe the media hype is (almost! it is quite sickening) justified - Scholes has been instrumental. As far as Evans goes, I didn't want to pick Lescott or Vermaelen as I'd picked their partners and I really think he's come on a lot this season. Probably a sentimental pick as he's bagged me loads of fantasy football points! Unfortunately can't mock the Cisse shout, as I've picked Scholes. Vidic is a strange choice though. Jelavic, Sigurdsson, Sessengon, Toure and Mata have all had patches of great form too.

Head to head, his short time in England stacks up fairly well compared to Fergie: Mourinho (2004-2007) Premier League: (2) 2004–05, 2005–06 FA Cup : (1) 2006–07 Football League Cup: (2) 2004–05, 2006–07 Alex Ferguson (2004-2007) Premier League (1) 2006–07, League Cup (1) 2005–06,

Could get a decent England team out of the top two teams in the 'best league in the world' this year, yet we'll stick **** the Euro's. -----------------------------Hart--------------------------------- Richards---------Ferdinand------Smalling/Jones---------Lescott Johnson/Milner-------Scholes----Carrick/Barry---------------Young ---------------------------Rooney-------------------------------- --------------------------Welbeck-------------------------------- Even a little bit of depth there. Phelan/Platt for England !

If we can't get 7 points against Bolton, West Brom, Norwich and Stoke - let alone two home games Sunderland and Spurs and a slim chance against an out of sorts Liverpool then we deserve to go down. West Brom's run in is quite interesting. Playing 4 of the bottom 5 (excluding Wolves) and then Liverpool, Arsenal and City. Everyone of those games is going to be a battle as their opponent's will have so much to play for. Only 3 points ahead of us after playing a game extra too..

What makes you think Rodgers failed at Watford :? ?

I accept that Cahill may not have been quite as good as Davies or Knight at the time - but do you think it would have been worth us (and thus not Bolton) throwing him in at the deep end? Obviously he was good enough for Premiership football - he went straight into the mid-table Bolton team. So the risk wasn't humongous. In hindsight, in my opinion, it would seem O'Neill made that mistake. What would we have lost by playing him? Potentially a few more games. So we may not have finished 6th and bailed the Europa. Who knows. I don't even think he is that good a centre half. Comfortable on the ball, sure. But not the answer to England or Chelsea's defensive issues. However, he is better than the players we have at the moment and therein lies the reason for this debate.

I think England have a comparable list of young players to be honest. Players like Jones, Smalling, Wilshere, Cleverly, Sturridge, Welbeck, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Kyle Walker are all good international prospects. Add Rooney and Hart who are 26 and 24 respectively. I think we are at a comparable level. Germany and Spain are clearly better than us. But I think the second tier consisting of us, France and the Netherlands is more competitive than most believe. Although if Pearce remains in charge perhaps not...

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